Ok, I know Black Belt is dead...

[Baily]

But why?
Why'd Brian decide to kill him off?
:/

[Meister]

In the long run... who knows? If Black Belt's death is important for another issue than said relationship, it's one yet to come. We'll have to wait and see for that one, but again, knowing Brian it's gonna pop up again sooner or later. Unlike Black Belt himself who is dead dead dead dead and don't no one start about no statues.

In the short run, however, it lead to this (http://www.nuklearpower.com/daily.php?date=041130) (that one plus the following two). The last word in the relationship between White Mage Black Mage has not yet been spoken, and I'd wager it's going to be very interesting when they meet again.

And in the very short run it made for one hell of a "holy shit" moment.

[Baily]

I thought BB was good comic releif. I didn't like him, but hey! I almost couldn't believe it! Then BM gave his two cents and everything was all good.
o_O

[Admiral_Kelly]

The statue double was destroyed, stabbed to oblivion.

Thus ends "Statue-Gate".

[iddqd]

I'd say because BB was basically the same character as Fighter. Other then the whole "getting lost" thing.

[Bizzaro_Exdeath]

Actually, the statue is still intact; it never showed Black Mage destroying it; only disposing of it at the same time Thief and Red Mage disposed of the Mountain Dew. Though I doubt Brian will return to that statue.

Besides, Black Mage was totally right. Black Belt's personality was just a ripoff of Fighter's.

[Skyshot]

Ahem.The Stone Black Belt is a dead statue. Un-stone-ifying it will disintegrate it.Right here (http://forum.nuklearpower.com/showpost.php?p=254516&postcount=6).

[iddqd]

Besides, Black Mage was totally right. Black Belt's personality was just a ripoff of Fighter's.
HUH?

[Kurosen]

I believe he's referring to this comic (http://www.nuklearpower.com/daily.php?date=041109). It was my little nod to the criticism that Black Belt was too much like Fighter. I don't think he was, but I never miss an opportunity to make fun of myself.

[Kima Azure]

Thus proving yet again why you're the creator, author, and all that jazz of 8-Bit Theater, and not of some other webcomic. You got style. To do awesome jokes without caring any about anything other than your own preferences... and still making us all die from laughter.

I adhorrate you.

[Tyrion]

Thus proving yet again why you're the creator, author, and all that jazz of 8-Bit Theater, and not of some other webcomic. You got style. To do awesome jokes without caring any about anything other than your own preferences... and still making us all die from laughter.

I adhorrate you.

The Black Belt joke was nothing compared to the "Sarda who did it" gag.

Black Belt was mortal. The Wizard Who Did It should've lived on forever. :(

[Admiral_Kelly]

Black Mage should of destroyed both Black Belts when he doubled.

[Baily]

OMG! It's THE Brian!
o_o
-licks the mud from his shoes-
You are GOD, man. (Does that count as a paradox?)
ANYWAYS...
Yeah.

Great comic, man. I'm looking forward to the next King Steve/EPS episode. They're rife with so many political statements, it's not even funny, and even then it's HILARIOUS.

Anywho...
Yeah.
/end post

[Kima Azure]

Ain't it weird how nobody else noticed my amazing word-creation skillz?

[invinible]

Black Mage's line: THERE WASN'T ENOUGH BLACK BELT LEFT TO BURY AFTER KARY FINISHED WITH HIM AND IT'S NOT LIKE THE VOLACANO EXPLODING HELPED ANY. made me think that Black Belt ended up time traveling at the last attack in his fight against Kary rather than getting killed.

[Admiral_Kelly]

"I'll always carry a pice of Blackbelt with me, CAUSE IT WON'T COME OUT!" I thought that Black Belt would MERGE with Black Mage!

[Meister]

No silly theories, folks. He's deeeee-ead. Stay on topic (which is: the possible significance of Black Belt's death).

[Admiral_Kelly]

Actually, there has been some significance to his death; Blackmage has shown a little bit of his good side. Read the comic here (http://www.nuklearpower.com/daily.php?date=041202) .

Blackmage's Note:

Dear White Mage,

As I’m sure you’re aware of by this time, I’m not very good at talking to you. I probably said something stupid to you in the time it took to hand you this note. Anyway, I figured it would be best if I put my thoughts on paper so they wouldn’t get all jumbled up with stupidness when I open my mouth.

Mostly, I just wanted to say I’m sorry for any grief I may have caused you. I kind of can’t help the things I say. Half of them don’t even mean anything, but I have to say them anyway. And the things that I want to say get shoved in the corner and gang stabbed.

And what I keep trying to say is that none of this is your fault. You could not have known what would happen. And who knows maybe it

was fate that Black Belt died. Just because something hurts doesn’t mean it’s not supposed to be that way.

That’s kinda like us really. It hurts me to see you all the time, but I can get used to the idea that you don’t want to be with me. I can’t blame you feeling that way.

Black Mage

[Bizzaro_Exdeath]

Yes, of course, but then he had to blow it by telling White Mage all about hadoken siphoning love out of the universe, and his having sacrificed nine orphaned kids to get it. You know, that was the second chance he blew with her. The first one was when he was outraged by Black Belt's license to kill, which made White Mage attracted to his sensitive side, until he mentioned that the basis of his outrage was a murder right put to waste.

[konnor]

i agree with previous comments black belt was just a ripoff of fighters personality.

[Psycrow]

It was so that Sephiroth could summon the meteor and-- oh wait, wrong story.
BB had potential; could whip any human and had some philosophical moments too. The "I get lost" thing was a run-on gag like "I like swords", but outside of that he had potential. If we're going with a semi-realistic "Final Fantasy" story thing though, he shoulda never existed/been seen in the first place, unless he was part of the 4 (so-called) Light Warriors.
Then again, that brings up another interesting point. The fake light warriors tricked King Steve with light bulbs, whereas the real ones had the real orbs... but Sarda is omniscient and wouldn't be tricked like that; wouldn't he choose to help the real (competent) four Light Warriors instead of the fake ones?
Discuss.

[Carnivore]

Well, I don't think it mttered who had the fancy heriloom orbs in the first place. The Light Warriors highjacked destiny. They purified two of the orbs. I don't think it really matters who does it, as long as it gets done. (And they might fail, yet.)

[Bizzaro_Exdeath]

Y'know, the real Light Warriors were supposed to carry the orbs, whilst the fake ones faked their orb-holding with Light Bulbs. However, Lich held the Earth Orb, and Kary held the Fire Orb. Likewise, Kraken probably has the Water Orb, and Tiamat probably has the Wind Orb. That means that Lich, Kary, Kraken, and Tiamat are the true Light Warriors!

[ElfLad]

OK, my thoughts on BB's death.

I was in denial about it at first. I thought they'd just take a few pieces to a church and resurrect him. I was wrong. Then I realized a great reason for BB to return. RPGs today are full of violently angsty characters. Even Vilbert doesn't scratch the surface of how gothy these characters are. I thought that BB returning from death would be a perfect oppurtunity for a personality retooling that would allow him to become full of angst and regret for the sake of satire. While I still think that would be pretty good, I realized why BB shouldn't be resurrected.

Has anybody here read Brian's rants on the status of comics today? I'm pretty sure he made points about how he hates heroes "dying" for cheap drama and then coming back later through some time loophole/resurrection/alternate dimension/"he never really died." I agree with him on this. If we realize that the heroes are in no real danger of dying and staying dead, even if they die, we don't care.

So, Brian, thank you for treating us with respect. Thank you for not messing with us for the sake of cheap drama. Thank you for thinking that we have the maturity to accept the death of a fictional character. Thank you for keeping BB where he belongs.

Still, it'd be pretty cool to see BB again, even if he's just a ghost or flashback or something. He was awesome.

[Magus]

A ghost version of Black Belt would be hilarious if done properly, especially if he gave advice that Black Mage hated. A lot. And Fighter liked. A lot.

Basically an Obi-Wan ghost version. Y'know?

[Staizer]

Bizzaro, the True Warriors of light have the orbs of Light, Not earth, wind, fire, water. Thus, said beasts would be Warriors of their respective elements. If your theory was correct.

Black belt got what he deserved! Spending so much time with WM when BM should have been with her. Plus anyone who has such a horrible sense of direction would never be able to find his way back from the nether world, even if he was offered a ressurection spell.

[GARUD]

Black belt. Baisically Brian would have to gut and revamp his whole personality. He cannot make it back to the real world even if he wanted to with his current abilities.

Black Belt: White mage! I'm back from the dead!
Matoya: Who the hell are you?
*later*
Black Belt: white mage, I have finally found you!
Sarda: Get lost you stupid salesman or i will rearange your particles
*even later*
Black Belt: White mage, is that really you?
Black Mage: WTF?
Black Belt: OOF! DEAR GOD! HOW CAN YOU STAB A GHOST?

See?

[Admiral_Kelly]

Black belt got what he deserved! Spending so much time with WM when BM should have been with her.

Dude, that is possibly the stupidest thing mentioned in this entire thread!

First off, if you have actually read the comic, you would have seen that Black Mage happens to be an EXTREMELY evil wizard! White Mage dose not even have an intrest in him.

Second, you would have also seen that niether Black Belt nor White Mage should an interest in eachother.

Third, as things are things are right now, Black Mage will be seeing less of White Mage because Sandra keeps sending them all across the globe.

Plus anyone who has such a horrible sense of direction would never be able to find his way back from the nether world, even if he was offered a ressurection spell.

No argument here (but you did spell the word "resurrection" wrong).

[Meister]

Dude, that is possibly the stupidest thing mentioned in this entire thread!
Violently disagreed. It's a different view on the comic, that's all. Discuss it all you want, but please step away from the border to Flameland.

[ElfLad]

And the grammatically correct way of putting it is "most stupid." :)

[Bizzaro_Exdeath]

'm pretty sure he made points about how he hates heroes "dying" for cheap drama and then coming back later through some time loophole/resurrection/alternate dimension/"he never really died."
Brian did it a thousand times in the comics. Whenever someone dies in a fantasy, I never expect them to come back; I come to terms with their deaths. And most fantasy writers honor that the character died, and doesn't bring them back. Brian, however, makes his heroes die, or supposedly die, and come back a thousand times over. The reason everyone was so baffled at Black Belt's lack of returning was that this was probably the 1001th death Brian did, and it just happens to be a real death. The same reason I was baffled when South Park did an entire season of Kenny actually being dead, after having died the last episode of the last season.

[Admiral_Kelly]

Popularity brings charachters back to life; unpopularity kills em off.

So the more popular the charachter, the better chance he has of never pernamently dying.

EDIT: Fixed a spelling error.

[Myst]

The other facet of death/ressurection in 8-bit is that, if a hero is able to come back to life, there's a logical reason for it, not just "He didn't really kill them, it was an evil parasite in his mind, and now that he's defeated it, he's a hero again." For example, the death of black mage. Black mage dies, he goes to hell, and he takes over hell. Everything is in character, the cause/effect is probable, and it serves to further the storyline (Lich becomes hell king, which explains why they fight them again before fighting chaos). The point is, when Brian kills a character, they still serve a purpose.

[MetalPsycho]

Black belt got what he deserved! Spending so much time with WM when BM should have been with her. Plus anyone who has such a horrible sense of direction would never be able to find his way back from the nether world, even if he was offered a ressurection spell.

Unless of course, Black Belt was wandering around in the afterlife and was looking for the nearest ice cream store and found the exit back to our earth.

Or maybe he was looking for said ice cream store and just ripped a hole in space time and returns with a little halo like in DBZ.

*hammered*

Ok, bad ideas that must never come to pass, but knowing this comic, it's probably possible.

And I'm pretty sure that statue BB got disolved in teh over powerful toxicness of the Mountain Dew.

BB is NOT a rip of Fighter. BB is (or was) actually intelectually smart, he just makes himself look stupid because he gets lost and tries to give a reason. Said reasons are never good ones. Take his case in point of his discussion with WM about the pressure points on a spider, and you see he actually thinks alot like we do as long as direction and geography don't interfear.

[Baily]

Hmmm.

Fighter = one track mind

BB = Too many tracks to keep track of?

Just a thought.
o_o

[Kurosen]

Brian did it a thousand times in the comics.
I think you're confusing comedy "death" with actual death. Myst's reply is right on the money.

[BigGator5]

You know, it's been establish that there are more than one than one "Fighter" going around and more "Red Mages". Maybe there could be more than one "Black Belts".

The Black Belt we know and love is dead, doesn't mean Brain can't bring in another Black Belt...

[Admiral_Kelly]

I think you're confusing comedy "death" with actual death. Myst's reply is right on the money.


What about Garland? He came back to life, possibly twice.

First time: Blackbelt beat him to a pulp.

Second Time(?): He drowned after being pushed off Bikke's ship(?).

Each time, he came back more powerfull with no logical explination, other than the fact that Garland is a primary villan.

Oh, and Drizzel and Vilbert also came back to life too. No explination behind that.

[Myst]

What about Garland? He came back to life, possibly twice.

First time: Blackbelt beat him to a pulp.

Second Time(?): He drowned after being pushed off Bikke's ship(?).

Each time, he came back more powerfull with no logical explination, other than the fact that Garland is a primary villan.

Oh, and Drizzel and Vilbert also came back to life too. No explination behind that.
Let's examine these in order
First time: Beat to a pulp is the key word. Being beaten unconcious and killed are two different things. Second, this would be a comedy death, as it served to satire the 'villain respawn' where you fight them half a dozen times before you can kill them, and each time they've gained more hit points and attacks (Kefka is a good example).

Second time: He was pushed off of a boat, but does it ever explicitly state he drowned? Most likely, something completely innocuous (sp?), such as Bikke pulling him out of the water, could have occured.

Drizzle: He was brutally mob stabbed, they didn't bother to make sure he was dead.

Vilbert: Black Mage said it himself, "Either his heart or his gothicular membrane..." So, apparently they just punctured the latter, rendering him speechless, until the armoire was removed.

[Bizzaro_Exdeath]

Well, I know you're justified in bringing all the characters back. I'm just saying that everybody was baffled when BB didn't return, because know it was you, it just seemed so likely that he wouldn't be put off for good.

BB is NOT a rip of Fighter. BB is (or was) actually intelectually smart, he just makes himself look stupid because he gets lost and tries to give a reason. Said reasons are never good ones. Take his case in point of his discussion with WM about the pressure points on a spider, and you see he actually thinks alot like we do as long as direction and geography don't interfear.

No, see, Black Belt got lost in a straight hall. The architecture of a straight line baffled him so much that he saw it exactly as complex as we would see any four-dimensional dungeon (since we couldn't possibly comprehend it), and as Red Mage discovered, your psychology has a direct effect on the complexities of working physics in your surroundings (in the 8-Bit world, of course; if it was the same here, life would be ridiculous), and thus, Black Belt was enveloped in a pocket of space-time, breeching the forth dimension, and being spat out seconds earlier, to duplicate himself. The fact that his psychology did that much whilst in a straight line makes him incredibly stupid, and mathematically incoherent. He can still make full sentences and speak properly. Meanwhile, Fighter is a mathematical genius, but gets stumped in the simplest of conversations. You could use that to say they're the opposite, but I said that he's a ripoff, because there's many similarities between the way Fighter pisses Black Mage off, and BB pisses White Mage off.

[Kurosen]

Again, Myst proves to be paying attention.

One sidenote though. Garland never drowned. After being in the water, he is shown to be ashore in the jaws of a dreaded and supposedly mythical landshark. He's speaking in that panel and presumably alive. Since we see him walking and talking in comics after that, it's safe to assume he escaped and lived.

[Admiral_Kelly]

Second, this would be a comedy death, as it served to satire the 'villain respawn' where you fight them half a dozen times before you can kill them, and each time they've gained more hit points and attacks (Kefka is a good example).

Thats somewhat how I figured it for all of the villan deaths(?). They would just respawn and you would have to kill em' off again.

And if what you say about Drizzl is true, than how did Garland find him?

I try not to draw logical explinations on things like this.

[Kurosen]

Drizz'l: He was brutally mob stabbed, they didn't bother to make sure he was dead.

How did Garland find him? Brutally mob-stabbed, but not dead. I even made a comic about it (http://www.nuklearpower.com/daily.php?date=030524).

[Admiral_Kelly]

*hits self for not remembering these things*

[Cloud3514]

sbout the only thing i like about BB was how he could get lost in garland's castle. that was great!

[PCD]

It's a bit sad that BB's permanently gone. Hopefully it'll be truly important in the end, but to me it seems unfair that he was tossed aside while the other five Player Characters live on. It's kinda like saying that his character wasn't worth it, like it was the lamest. ...Which may be true, but hey, nonetheless.

Anyway, mourn mourn, whateva.

[Quirriff`]

The Stone Black Belt is a Plot Device, there to be used when/if Brian seems appropriote.

[toma02]

Okay, so what about the actual deaths in the comic?

The two that pop into mind most are the Fiend Of Earth and the Fiend Of Fire. They are currently in Hell. We've been shown both of them. In the game they do get resurrected but this comic doesn't really follow the grand, confusing, overreaching, time travel plot so resurrecting them seems less important. Why do the Fiends get to be shown in hell but BB not pointed out in Heaven?

Also, when BM died and went to hell, it was a permanent sort of death but he rose to prominence in the underworld and was booted out of it. BB wasn't as important a character but again we see a different standard invoked. It really makes no sense to me. WE know there is a heaven and hell, Brian has shown it to us. Why havn't we seen BB in the afterlife?

The Drow Elf is another iffy example. We were left to assume he was killed by the light warriors but a little later he is found to be "not quite dead" and brought back. Fact is, important people rarely die. Astos would be a rare example of when a villain did (Lesie and crew would be the only other time in my memory where this happened as well but they were kind of throwaways. Perhaps not important enough to be allowed to keep living and frankly I don't remember them from the original game. Where they even in it?). Which actually is interesting as he was the first major villain to perish. HE could have been shown to have been almost dead as Drizzel was. Why DID Brian kill him off after making him such a central figure. Personally, I think it was because his son was ready to take off in the wings so there is still a continuity there.

Even though Astros died, it was still a FUNNY death. BB is the first, the only seriouly upsetting death we have come across in this whole comic. It stands out like a sore thumb, so completly shocking and different then anything else we have experienced here in 8-Bit that you can't help but scream "WHY???".

It feels like a small betrayal, Brian has killed off the main heroes so many times and then suddenly does one off for real? You can say it was for comedy all you like but when you start doing comic deaths you set up a certain expectation. The difference with the comics Brian complains about and 8-Bit is that THOSE comics pretend to be serious. Humor is laced in and certainly ridiculous things happen but they keep the pretense that it's some kind of reality. So the resurrections are always a bit of a betrayal and there are no comic deaths, only serious ones that get cheapened. To do a comic death on those comics serves no purpose to the writer's view. They want us to cry and buy the comics at the horrible events but after it's done they realize that the comic won't keep as many readers (or so they think) without that character so they bring them back. It's a very cynical endeavor.

This, however, is mainly comedic and one rule of comedy is the hero never dies. BB was definably one of the heroes. Besides casual ressurection of characters is standerd fare in FF. Not letting any of she six die is perfectly in keeping with the universe we are inhabiting. Why make this so stark and unlike anything that has come before. In terms of character growth BB could still die but be shown in heaven as the Fiends are in hell. The main characters still don't know that BB is on another plane of existence. WM can still grieve for the loss and things can happen as they do while the readers are reassured that BB is still in the game in some small way. Truth is, no one really believed that BB or anyone important to the storyline COULD croak. BB is the first time this has happened.

What about the monk monetary what was the point of this comic?
http://www.nuklearpower.com/daily.php?date=040810


Was it a throwaway? When I read it I was sure we were finally going to focus on BB's history. Which frankly would have used a little filling out but 20 comics later he has died. Why such a drastic change? We don't even visit the monastery after the heroes kill of Kary. They just go off to another land.

I don't know, I think Black Belt had more story to him then Brian allowed. There has been some development in character due to the death but overall I just don't think there was a compelling enough reason to kill him. Especially as this is a lighthearted comic. An actual death like this really goes against the mood that had been created up until that point and continues to this day, by and large.

Perhaps Brian couldn't really get his head around the character and just got sick writing BB in so he killed him just to get rid of the problem of how to write that particular personality. Black Belt always DID seem less filled out then the other five main heroes. I don't know, all I DO know is that BB's death is the one thing in this whole comic that seriously bothers me I don't think it's fits with the rest.

PS. I noticed some people asking why Sarda is helping the Light Warriors if they arn't really the Light Warriors. It seems to me that this entire prophecy of Sarda was specifically made to keep WM from going back in time to mess up Sarda's life so it hardly matters who are the Light warriors a long as WM was kept busy with them. As to why he's still doing it now she has messed up his life anyway... He may just going ahead on his previous momentum. Dunno.

[Staizer]

The monestary was more an illustration of how badly BB is at any sort of directions, if you told him to go to his back yard he would get lost for years trying to find it (anyone think Pi-chan from Ranma 1/2 here?) That's what I got from it anyway, I was a little curious about BB's past because of this, in fact, just because one protector of White Mage is dead doesn't mean another one cannot appear.

[Amara]

I hadn't realized that Black Belt was no longer in the comic until I read this. Rather oblivious of me.

[Willowhugger]

I guess it's what you expect 8-bit to be. 8-bit is a comedy, it's not fine drama and drama actually is dischordant with the entirety of the strip. Nuklear Age is one of those Brian works (okay, its the ONLY other brian work I know of) where drama can build from the humor because the characters are more than their shallow reflections indictae. In the case of 8-bit, they aren't.

White Mage just may end up with Black Mage because well...the world DOESN'T make sense and that's why its funny.

[toma02]

You know, no matter how many times Brian says not to, people will always look to the fact that BB has a stone statue hidden away that could potentially be unstoned. He said it wouldn't work and such BUT why not make it into a story line in the comic anyway?

If we have WM go down, find the stone statue of BB and try to unstone it only to have it dissolve (as brian says would happen) it would be a mighty fine moment of drama and even character growth for WM if handled right. It could be a story arc too. WM trying to rescue BB, show what lenghts she would go to save him and then have it all fail. How sweet and touching and sad.

I don't know if Brian takes story ideas from us forum users but

what do you think about that idea Brian or the rest of you guys?

[Meister]

King Steve probably drilled for Mana exactly where the stone statue lies, utterly and completely destroying it in the process.

[netrider6]

I always believed that the horribly toxic Mountain Dew dissolved it...

[Medeo]

It's interesting to see how many people seem to honestly care for this character and want to see him come back- if not technically "alive", then at least in some other form. Some of us are as much in denial about it as WM herself doubtlessly was (though she chose to show more of her feelings of guilt than of denial).

Am I the only one who is eerily reminded of their FF7 days?

Speaking for myself, I know that the first time I played through Final Fantasy VII, I spent the entireties of discs 2 and 3 wondering when Aeris was coming back. And she never did- at least not in a full, significant, and unambiguous fashion. Eight years later, this ingenious, unexpected turn of plot is still endlessly taken apart, meticulously analyzed, and viciously debated by many of the game's fans.

The similarities in this regard between BB and Aeris seem uncanny. It will be interesting to see how many fans are still in denial over it long after the comic ends.

(P.S.: Although it's statistically and intuitively safe to assume that everyone reading this is familiar with FF7, my apologies for the spoilers to all who have yet to experience this wonderful classic. Yeah, most likely, but just to be on the safe side. ^^ -Meister)

[PyrosNine]

No you are all wrong wrong wrong!!!
Thief stole it shortly after the episode was over, sold it to someone, stole it back, was hired as a sleuth to "find" it, Ransomed it back, was payed to carry it back into the house, then robbed the house. Then Brian started using it as his doorstop.

I'm thinking that since Aeris is coming back for the Movie, once there's an 8-bit full feature movie, then Blackbelt will come back.

Preview Clip
BB: Oh you've come back to this place, the heart of the earth, but at the same time, it is killing you...
:bmage: What the heck are you talking about? Didn't you die and I danced upon your empty grave, since there was nothing but shreds left of your mutilated corpse?
BB: You must go, and stop these remaining sephiroth clones from destroying the world!
BM:Ha! Don't you know? I AM sephiroth! It just took me six FF games to grow my hair out!

[Meister]

Then Brian started using it as his doorstop.
Actually I picture a little fountain in his garden.

[Admiral_Kelly]

The Black Belt statue dissolved in the Mountain Dew. Do I have to draw a diagram for you clods? (http://www.nuklearpower.com/daily.php?date=020412)

EDIT: This is directed at people who think Black Belt will come back.

[Meister]

I'm as annoyed with them as you are, but 'clods?' Come on.

The only reason anyone should ever need to accept Black Belt's death is that Brian himself confirmed it numerous times in no uncertain terms. All that's left for us is to make stuff up to counter the inevitable BUT BUT BUT THE STONE BLACK BELT arguments.

Brian, I swear, if you left a loophole for yourself and bring him back at some point...