The Star Trek Movies

[Kenryoku_Maxis]

Well, this is a completly random thread I know, bit I bought some of the Special Edition versions of the Star Trek movies today and started to think back to a discussion my friend and I had a few weeks ago about what the best movies were. So why don't you guys (who like the movies) put a list up of what you think are the best in order. And mention some other stuff if you like.

Mine:
1. The Undiscovered Country (VI)
2. The Wrath of Khan (II)
3. First Contact (VIII)
4. The Search for Spock (III)
5. Nemisis (X)
6. The Voyage Home (IV)
7. The Motion Picture (I)
8. Generations (VII)
9. The Final Fronteir (V)
.
.
.
.
10. Insurrection (IX) {I put this one with spaces because in the event that any others are made, they will almost undoubtibly be better than Insurrection....sadly}

[Drooling Iguana]

1. The Undiscovered Country
2. The Motion Picutre (Director's Edition)
3. The Wrath of Khan
4. The Voyage Home
5. Galaxy Quest
6. Forbidden Planet (sure, it doesn't say Star Trek in the title, but it's obviously a Star Trek movie. They must've just forgotten about that when they were naming it.)
7. The Search for Spock
8. The Final Frontier
9. Generations (at least the first few minutes were good, and I usually stop watching after that.)
10, 11, 12. First Contact, Insurrection, Nemesis (they were all pure crap, so it's tough to rank them.)

[Priest4hire]

Wow, someone else who actually like ST:TMP. Go figure. I had begun to believe I was the only only one.

BTW, they sure did a really nice job on the Special Edition of ST:TMP, eh? I'll admit I prefer that upgrade to the Star Wars Special Edition upgrades.

[Drooling Iguana]

The first version of TMP that I saw was the Director's Edition DVD, and I thought it was pretty good. After that, though, I saw the original version on TV and could see why everyone thought it sucked. It's amazing what a bit of editing and a few extra effects shots (which blended into the rest of the movie seamlessly, unlike the CGI in the Star Wars Special Editions which stood out like a sore thumb) can do for a movie.

[Illuminatus]

Best Star Trek movies:

1. Star Wars: A New Hope
2. Star Wars: The Empire Strikes Back
3. Star Wars: The Return of the Jedi
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
4. that undiscovered country thing

:P. Take that Trekkies. (/wookieroar)

[Kenryoku_Maxis]

I like The Motion Picture alot. It was one of the ones I bought today (and the one I was watching when I wrote this poll). They did a fantastic job adding in the scenes. The Scenes where V-Ger is sending the Probes to circle the Earth reminded me of Independance Day with the quality of the ship (and mostly the color of the ship and the angles it was shot).

Um....but I don't know what's up with the whole Galaxy Quest and Forbidden Planet thing. I guess I'll just take it as a joke. And I'm a little perplexed how one could say Generations is better than First Contact. I can see someone not liking Nemesis and DEFINITLY not liking Insurrection, but I think First Contact is much better than Generations. But oh well, I'm not bashing your view.

And too bad people have to come into this thread bein' haters. I like Star Wars as well as Star Trek so there. Take that Haters :P (like Ih8stupidppl who is resembling a hypocrite to his own name at the moment).

[VideoDrone]

1. The Undiscovered Country
2. Wrath of Khan (KHAAAAAAAAAAAAAN!....what? someone was going to do it!)
3. The Voyage Home
4. The Motion Picture
5. The Final Frontier
6. Nemesis
7. First Contact
8. Search for Spock
9. Generations
10. Insurrection

It may be a bit obvious that I am less of a fan of the next generation. I just loved the original series and neither deep space nine nor the the next generation nor voyager really measure up. But I didn't like the Search for Spock, so Nemesis and First Contact get bonus points.

[Kenryoku_Maxis]

It may be a bit obvious that I am less of a fan of the next generation. I just loved the original series and neither deep space nine nor the the next generation nor voyager really measure up. But I didn't like the Search for Spock, so Nemesis and First Contact get bonus points.

Aww...what's with the lack of Search for Spock love. You know Leanord Nimoy directed it, right (as well as Voyage Home)? No matter, I can understand why people might not like it as much as others since its hardly action filled and mostly the science and somewhat fantasy aspect of the series (two of the three things I like best about Star Trek). And hey, I like the Original Star Trek series and characters more than the others as well. Obviously most of it is just Kirk, Spock and McCoy and sometimes limitations on the Science can help the plot instead off adding more andmore science to create plot. But I do think the Generation movies, save Insurrection, are enjoyable.

[Krylo]

Meh, I suck with movie names, so I can't really list any, but I will say this... all the original is good for is comic relief to me. Now, it had a great plot, and took on serious sociological issues... the writing was superior to the new ones... but GOD how the acting sucked. Shatner is a horrible actor, and whoever played McCoy isn't much better. Nimoy is probably the only person on the cast of the original Star Trek that could act. And does Shatner have to score an alien chick every episode/movie/anything else?

Average Star Trek scene:
Kirk: "Bones... that man... needs... help walking!"
Bones: "Damnit Jim, I'm a doctor, not an escalator!"
Scotty: (over communicator) "We're under attack! She can't take much more o' this cap'n!"
Spock: *raises an eyebrow slightly* "You're all morons."

Ok, so Spock never SAID that... but you could tell he meant it. Now... the sheer comedy of watching Shatner attempt to act still makes it far better than any of the other star treks (I'd love to put the Khan scream here... but VD already did), but that doesn't mean it's good. Which is why I prefer the TNG movies... they tended to have decent plots, and the TNG cast could actually act. Although I prefer the original series... except TNG episodes with Q. But I just find Q amusing.

[VideoDrone]

Aww...what's with the lack of Search for Spock love.It took them 40 minutes to explain the current state of Spock's soul before it actually picked up the pace, and the last half hour was equally slow. Nothing really stood out in this film as was the case for the rest. The best part was when Kirk stole the enterprise, but there were more exciting parts in all the other films.

And I do enjoy the Next Generation to a point, just not as much as the original series.

[Drooling Iguana]

And I'm a little perplexed how one could say Generations is better than First Contact. I can see someone not liking Nemesis and DEFINITLY not liking Insurrection, but I think First Contact is much better than Generations. But oh well, I'm not bashing your view.The first few minutes of Generations (the stuff on the Enterprise-B) were pretty good, but the rest was crap. First Contact, Insurrection and Nemesis, on the other hand, were crap from beginning to end.

[Devon Lake]

1) Star Trek II The Revenge of Khan
2) Star Trek VI the Undiscovered Country
3) Star Trek I the Motion Picture
4) Star Trek V The Final Frontier
5) Star Trek VI The Voyage Home
6) Star Trek III The Search for Spock

I'd just like to say in my personal opinion, the Search for Spock sucked. I mean, that was just so terribly anti-climactic that they bring Spock back after his oh so immense death. Don't get me wrong, I love Spock and he kicks everyone else's ass, but I mean, that really made killing him sort of pointless. It was like a Dragon Ball Z death after that. I mean, if they made Star Wars Episode 7 and brought Obi Wan, Vader, Yoda, and the Emperor back, I swear that would be the last straw, Lucas would have to die.

Oh, and all the other movies suck because it's not the original cast. (TOS) was just so incredibly wacky and stupid; I mean, the gratituous eye candy women, the b-movie grade aliens, the hilarious way computers and robots are portrayed, and the simply bizzare acting... That's what made Star Trek! Everything after that is just bland boring nerd crap.

EDIT: CRAP! Mixed up abbreviations. I meant TOS, not TNG, so I changed it... Ya, for more on tha see below.

Oh ya, and Kirk could kick Picard's ass anywhere, any time.

[Krylo]

Oh ya, and Kirk could kick Picard's ass anywhere, any time.

Well DUH. Picard is an old French man, Kirk is an ass kicking captain who gets at least one alien babe (on average) per episode. But Data could kick the entire original casts ass... so could Q. So nyyyaaah.

Heh... And I do believe I said I liked the original series better... 'boring nerd crap' is only good in movies, b-movie grade aliens, hillarious computers/robots, and the horrible acting are always hillarious, however.

[Drooling Iguana]

I'd just like to say in my personal opinion, the Search for Spock sucked. I mean, that was just so terribly anti-climactic that they bring Spock back after his oh so immense death. Don't get me wrong, I love Spock and he kicks everyone else's ass, but I mean, that really made killing him sort of pointless. It was like a Dragon Ball Z death after that. I mean, if they made Star Wars Episode 7 and brought Obi Wan, Vader, Yoda, and the Emperor back, I swear that would be the last straw, Lucas would have to die.Actually, one of the early drafts (http://starwarz.com/starkiller/scripts/revenge_revised_rough_draft.htm) of ROTJ involved bringing Obi-Wan back, and the Emporer was brought back in one of the novels or comics (I forget which. He cloned himself and then used the Force to transfer his spirit into the clone when he "died" in ROTJ.)

[Devon Lake]

Spock could kick Data's ass. Data was too screwed up with his Pinnichio complex; Spock meanwhile was a REAL machine. He certaintly wasn't as strong, but he'd figure something out because he's Spock... Probably just flick Data's off switch... As for Q, he's more or less a God, and as we saw in the Final Frontier, Kirk doesn't take any shit from God's...

And boring nerd crap is only good when it's like a foot note to explain to the dullards what the hell is going on. Of course, Star Trek just uses pseudo science so it doesn't understand anyway. All the politics and weird technological and cultural gimmicks just get in the way of what we want to see; Kirk staggering around with a funny expression on his face or a debate between Spock and Bones on whose of the superior race... I never got enough of that.

As for Star Wars... Well I'm glad they didn't screw with the script, and as for the novels, no one really cares. Lucas obviously didn't consider them into the continuity of the Star Wars universe when he made the new movies (Of course, I don't consider the new movies into the continuity of the Star Wars universe.) so it really doesn't matter, and in any case, ya bringing the emperor back would still be anti-climactic... Not that it was climactic anyway, it was Vader who did the real ass kicking.

[Kenryoku_Maxis]

It took them 40 minutes to explain the current state of Spock's soul before it actually picked up the pace, and the last half hour was equally slow. Nothing really stood out in this film as was the case for the rest. The best part was when Kirk stole the enterprise, but there were more exciting parts in all the other films.

Which is what I explained is probably the reason you disliked it following what you quoted me on....

Whatever, all that's being talked about now is what people hate. I'm tired of making threads and then all people do is talk about 'I didn't like this' or 'I hate that part of it', making comments like 'its so stupid when 'Kirk always does this every episode'. Well I think its even more stupid that 90% of threads are devoted to people complaining about things and giving their opinions about things they think are stupid while I can hardly get a positive conversation going about anything. It didn't even take 3 posts for some jerk to come in and start saying he 'hates this' and 'hates that'.

I have rebuttals to every single thing that has been said, but I'm tired of doing the run around with all of you. I'm going to just let you guys go at your 'I hate (insert thing about show)' ranting frenzy. Bye.

[Devon Lake]

Well it's kind of hard to go off on a tangent about stuff you like... There's just not that rush of hatred to egg your on. In any case, I did pointy out all the loveable and wacky quirks that make Star Trek (TOS) great. I mean, gambling brains, wanton duels to the death (With Abraham Lincoln Fighting Genghis Khan may I add) and salt vampires... What more do you need?

EDIT: CRAP AND DANG! I Mixed up my abbreviations, I meant TOS is great. It's TNG that sucks... Woo... Ok, so I haven't been watching the reruns lately, but I used to religiously watch 3 episodes of it a day when i was in high school (ARG! I'm so angry I didn't get home early enough to watch TOS.) So ya, I love TOS, and everything else sucks... But in that sort of, I can't look away suck you know? It's boring and stupid, and not TOS, but you still can't look away, especially when the only other thing you have to do is read...

[Krylo]

(With Abraham Lincoln Fighting Genghis Khan may I add)

That was the BEST episode of the original star trek ever. EVER. Actually I think that was the best episode of anything ever. I was flipping through the channels and saw Abraham Lincoln on the bridge of the Enterprise and laughed out loud right then. When I found out it had just started, I was ecstatic. That was hillarious to a degree I can't even begin to describe.

[VideoDrone]

Wow Kenryoku, do you think you're maybe taking this a little personally? I was just explaining why I didn't like the movie, in response to you saying "what's with the lack of Search for Spock love." Notice everyone has said something positive among the negative comments, which shouldn't be construed as negative so much as explaining what they dislike and why. If this bothers you, maybe you should try saying "so what is it you like about your top choices."

I'll go ahead and answer my own question.

I liked the Undiscovered Country best because it was the farewell to the original cast, which to me made it more dramatic. It was probably the most exciting as well. My favorite touch was the death of Chancellor Gorkin. I like Wrath of Khan because Khan was an excellent villian, there were some great lines to come from it, and it was very climactic with the death of Spock. Both films were directed by the same guy Nicholas Meyer.

[Kenryoku_Maxis]

If this bothers you, maybe you should try saying "so what is it you like about your top choices."

In effect, I was trying to say that in my first post but trying not to have to make a guideline saying "try to talk more about what you like rather than what you don't since so much on this board is negative." But seriously, look what I had to do to get someone to try to say something they liked primarily, I had to basically say shut up and say something positive (oxymoron there).

In any event, the only thing I have grievances against with the Search for Spock thing is that again, I kinda did say what you said...about it being less action and more about the science and diologue. So, I'm not mad about that. Just don't know if you were trying to make your point as if I hadn't.

In ANY event....it seems half the people (and the ones doing most of the 'hating') have choosen to just ignore what I wrote anyway and just kept going on about their conversation. Just so you know, I did like the Episode with Abraham Lincoln and Ghingis Khan.....but you see, I saw the one from the Original Series. This one where the blob guy recreated them (along with others like Hitler and Caesar) and put Kirk in the middle as a mock fight of 'Good vs Evil'. That one was more interesting than the Next Generation one.

----

Anyway. My top choice is Undiscovered Country because I think it has some really good Directing, the best Script and the best Acting. People make fun of William Shatner and hey, not gonna say he's the best. But I have to say, he's pretty ok if not good in Undiscovered Country. The guy who plays Chang is actually a veteran British Shakespere Actor who was also Shatners acting instructor durring the time he was making the Star Trek movies (I think he came on durring Khan). For some knowledge for you.

And for some quirky knowledge I found out a couple weeks ago. In Freakazoid, Khans actor does the voice for 'Giutierrez', Freaks nemesis in a way. And then in Star Trek VI, you have Gorkon...his actor does the voice for the Lobe, Lord Bravery, Cave Guy and a host of other voices. Anyway, I just like all that kind of connecting the actors and voices and stuff.

[Krylo]

This one where the blob guy recreated them (along with others like Hitler and Caesar) and put Kirk in the middle as a mock fight of 'Good vs Evil'. That one was more interesting than the Next Generation one.

Wait... they had a TNG one? I thought Devon just made a mistake. I don't remember hitler in it though... but yah, the Good Vrs. Evil fight thing is what I was talking about.

Also... Wrath of Khan is the only one I remember well enough to put a name to, so I'm going to have to say that's my favorite by far. Hmm... guess that counteracts my liking the TNG better for movies, eh?

[Devon Lake]

Ya, I mixed up my abbreviations (Look above) It's TOS that I love and everything else that's crap, but I hope you got that from the gambling brains reference (You should have dag nabbit!) Anyhow, yes, the duel with Abraham Lincoln and Ghengis Khan was, objectively, the greatest thing ever... Now I have to remenis about some of the great qualities of Star Trek more now.

Remember that one where Kirk goes to that alternate universe with bearded Spock and they're all evil? I mean, the TOS crew evil? How cool is that!

Remember that one where they land on that planet and everyone's like "Are you one of the body?" and they're all happy zombies in puritan clothes controlled by a computer named Landrew? It's great seeing how awful the world those sterile "family" lobby groups want to create is.

Space Seed: Khaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaan! Need I say more?

Then that one with the planets fighting the simulated war. It's such a stupid idea it's cool!

The one where they go to that planet where the flowers make them all euphoric hippy zombies because it shows why THAT utopia sucks.

The one where Kirk beeks up Apollo; they episode sucked but the fact that he's a god slayer really helps in the Kirk vs. Picard debate.

Pon Far episode... hahahahaha.

The one where they all get old. That was hysterical.

Tripples.

Gambling Brains.

The weird Nazi one with fascism screwing things up.

That one where the descendants of communists are fighting the descendants of Yanks.

The one where they find an Earth where Rome took over; an idea so insane it's brilliant.

Spocks brain being stolen.

The one where that alien blob light effect tries to make the humans and Klingons kill each other forever so it can feed off their hatred.

The one with the nut house.

That one with those guys who're half black and half white...

[Drooling Iguana]

Don't forget the one where Kirk switches bodies with his crazy ex-girlfriend. That was actually the final episode.

And then there was the Star Trek/Known space (Larry Niven's sci-fi universe) crossover, but that was part of the Animated Series and is no longer considered canon (probably because everyone knew that the Kzinti would kick the TNG Klingons' asses.)

[Devon Lake]

What about the rest of the Animated Series? I found it to be rather entertaining, you can't tell me it's all been banished from the cannon when they let that awful DS9 in?

[Wetflame]

Hmm.. I haven't seen many. I actually liked insurrection.

1. Nemesis
2. Wrath of Khan
3. Insurrection
4. Generations
5. TMP

They're the only ones I've seen sadly. I find the Motion Picture boring. Nothing happened in it. They didn't meet any interesting aliens or new ships or have cool fight scenes.

[Kenryoku_Maxis]

The one where they go to the Alternate Universe is my favorite Episode. The one where Spock's 'Alter Ego' is the only one who will help Kirk...and that Spock was going to assasinate Kirk and take command. I thought it was well written.

The one where they are having the 'simulated war' as you call it...its a bit different. Actually, they were killing people of these two planets in these machines as 'casualties' to make it seem like a 'war' but making it what they called 'efficient'. And I don't think its really stupid....seeing as how I've seen a few TV shows do it after Star Trek.

The Pon Far episode was a good excuse for us to get into Spocks character even more. Hey, he almost goes to Kill Kirk, but Kirk has to find a way out of it. Blame the 60's culture and their standardized sysem of the James Bond like leading man in every show to have to 'get out of' things to why it isn't different.

The Nazi one was VERY well written, Historically and just for a TV script. But you would never be able to think up a story like that. That's what you get when you get these 23 year old sci-fi writers...who later goes on to publish tons of books in the genre.

The Communist and Yanks ones is actually one of those paralell world ones. But it would make more sense if you lived in 1969...

Spocks Brain....they somehow molded that into a entertaining thing, but its initial idea is still dumb I gotta admit.

We still haven't mentioned some though. There's the one where they visit 'Nepoleon' but he turns out to be the child of a race of 'higher beings' who just wants to play with them and almost destroys the Enterprise.

There's the one where they go back to 1969 and meet that alien guy with the cat who has to keep someone from destroying one of the Apollo spaceships or something. Episodes a little foggy...but I remember it was ok.

The Mobster one, where in the first season Kirk and Spock had been sent back in time and left a book about 1920's Chicago and then 200 years later, its their normal time and they visit the planet. The entire planet is set up like the 1920s and they are run between 5 different Mob Bosses. THAT was a good episode. That's what writing should be like. Horribly acted on Kirks part but the writing was 'superb' ::insert Kirk's horrid Mob accent::. Patrick does a much better Chicago guy, although he's a P.I.

I can't remember the rest....too much.

[Kenryoku_Maxis]

Hmm.. I haven't seen many. I actually liked insurrection.

1. Nemesis
2. Wrath of Khan
3. Insurrection
4. Generations
5. TMP

They're the only ones I've seen sadly. I find the Motion Picture boring. Nothing happened in it. They didn't meet any interesting aliens or new ships or have cool fight scenes.

Uh...they met an entire race of living machines that sent one of Earths probes back to Earth in a space vehicle roughly the size of our moon and that could generate more power than our sun. But yes, you're right that there's no cool fight scenes...which the Next Generation Star Trek movies are known for and the original series cast movies are known for more science and in the ship stuff (I like the in the ship stuff the best). -_-

[Devon Lake]

We still haven't mentioned some though. There's the one where they visit 'Nepoleon' but he turns out to be the child of a race of 'higher beings' who just wants to play with them and almost destroys the Enterprise.

Actually, his name was "Trelane", the squire of Gothos. He just sort of admires what he sees as the "warlike humans" because for whatever reason he could only observe them from the past. That was actually pretty funny. Like in the gun duel and he's all like "Well I get to go first!" and so on.

The Communist and Yanks ones is actually one of those paralell world ones. But it would make more sense if you lived in 1969...

Ya, a good lot of them seem to be analogous with the Cold War. That one was saying how the descendants of Commie China and The United States moved out into the galaxy, founded that planet, and then blew each other up and evolved super longevity due to how much they screwed up the planet.

Sort of like that one where the Klingons give those natives guns, and then so Kirk has to give the other natives gun to sort of keep things equal, sort of like MAD.

There's the one where they go back to 1969 and meet that alien guy with the cat who has to keep someone from destroying one of the Apollo spaceships or something. Episodes a little foggy...but I remember it was ok.

I actually heard Gene had submitted the whole cat and secret agent thing to the NBC executives, and upon getting rejected just changed it into an episode. It was sort of an enteresting thing to see for that reason, it was like a failed pilot.

Ooh, I loved that one where they reshow the original pilot. It was interesting to see what the series was going to be like. Captain Pike was a real bad ass and Spock actually cracked a smile at a flower thingy (I almost shat myself when I saw that. I mean, if he was just possessed by a flower or a Greek guy in a Platonian society was possessing him it's just jolly well fine, but in that seen it was just SOOO out of character.) Then there was how Pike was all mangled and so was that girl... That made it all really dark and creepy and stuff for me.

[Illuminatus]

I can't beleive a Trekkie had the audacity to call me stupid AND hypocritical. Good thing I'm a Star Wars fan or I might get mad.

Now I get serious:

The only ones I've seen are Khan, Nemesis, Insurrection and First Contact (Sorry I never felt compelled to go back and watch ANYTHING with William Shatner in it. Please Kenryoku, defend him. I dare you.) Nemesis was fairly original in terms of plot, lots of philsophical debate; good fight scenes, awesome ship-ramming sequence (But why, at the end, did the CAPTAIN go disable the ship? Everyone looked at him like he HAD to do it. It made zero sense to me) I can't really remember anything about Insurrection, it must have sucked. First Contact had the Borg and time travel, coolness factor way up. And Khan had Spock. And Khan. So:

1. First Contact
2. Nemesis
3. Wrath of Khan
4. Insurrection

[Kenryoku_Maxis]

I'm not going to defend Shatner. I've pointed out both good and bad points of his acting career in this thread if you want to go back and read through and find them though. But I'm sorry you choose to miss out on some good movies (OPINION!) just because you dislike one actor in it (or at least you're using that excuse for it).

And yet I doubt you'd like some of the movies like Search for Spock or the Motion Picture for reasons people have given in this thread already (frankly, I don't want to state them because you might get mad).

And I don't know if I'm a Trekkie...myself hating Two complete series of the show (DS9 and Voyager). I just really got into the series with the movies and watching Next Generations as a kid. Then I watched the original series when I was 15 or so. So...Trekkie...not really. Now, Kid who had alot of time on his hands who watched all the movies alot, that I'm guilty of. But that doesn't quite get me to Trekkie status, by Trekkies anyway. Whatever you want to think you can, since my explination hasn't changed your view in any way.

[Mike McC]

I liked the original 6. The Next Generation ones are definately not as good, just like how The Next Generation series isn't as good as the original.

Now, it would be kick-ass if they put Q in a movie, but they'd probably end up fucking it up.

[Kenryoku_Maxis]

I've always thought they could just have done an entire show with Q alone. Just like I thought there was enough thought put behind the HoloDeck to fit into a 5 season show or something. Lord knows there was more thought put into the Holodeck in the few episodes it was used than most Prime Time shows ever see...

Cheap shot...but its true.

[TheZeroMan]

I would just like to take this moment to say one thing:

KKKKKKKKHHHHHHHHHHAAAAAAAAAAANNNNNNNNNNNNNN!!!!!!! !!!

[Bezo]

Just for the record, and despite rumours you may have heard, Star Trek V never happened.

In fact, I don't even know what I'm referring to, all I can remember is the weird gap between IV and VI.

[Devon Lake]

Holodeck was cheap. On DS9 and Voyager, a good third of the shows involved something being wrong with the holodeck. I mean, that was just lazy writting. At least in TNG they didn't use ad nauseum.

[Mike McC]

I just prefer to forget that Voyager even existed. Well, the first couple of seasons were okay, but it just went downhill so increadibly fast....

I actually liked DS9 myself... But, that's just my opinion. None of them hold a candle to the original Star Trek.

[Bezo]

If I had been writing Next Gen, every Episode would've featured one of the following things:

1) Q

2) The Borg

3) Lore

4) A rare space disease which causes Counselor Troi to dress in a Japanese school girl uniform.

5) Riker angst about his beard

6) Q attacking the Enterprise with the Borg while Lore gives Counselor Troi a mental probe which causes her to wear a Japanese school girl uniform, causing Riker to angst about his beard.

7) Picard singing show tunes.

[Drooling Iguana]

8) The entire crew dying horrible, horrible deaths, repeatedly. Unfortunately, only one episode met that last criterion.

[Mental-Rectangle]

I just prefer to forget that Voyager even existed. Well, the first couple of seasons were okay, but it just went downhill so increadibly fast....

I find it quite the opposite. The first three seasons and the very last season of Voyager were pretty weak (the last season was specifically 7/9'ths cleavage on the holodeck day-in day-out.) (and these were the only ones people watched and knew about).

There was this really good period between that where they regularly met all eight criteria listed above. Pity really, some episodes were better than most movies they made.

The series line-up would go as follows:
The Original Series ****1/2
Voyager ***1/2
Enterprise **1/2 (if only because of the last season being much better than the previous ones.)
Next Generation ** (The last season was the only good one)
DS9 ** (also, the last season was the only good one)

For the movies: (also quite impressed with the first movie's director's cut. They did a perfect, and meticulous job finishing unfinished scenes even with dead actors.)

The Undiscovered Country ****1/2
The Motion Picture (Director's Cut) ****
First Contact (The only good TNG one) ***1/2
The Wrath of Khan ***1/2
The Voyage Home *** (more of a comedy than a sci-fi in ways, but it worked alright)
Generations *** (the first hour was good, but a bird of prey can't destroy a vastly supurior flagship, even without shields. No matter how you work it.)
Nemesis **1/2 (better graphics than Star Wars, and a semblance of plot, but it could've been more thought out, and Picard should've died in some nasty way at the end.)

The others deserve to have every copy burned, except for one, which will be stored at a Paramount themepark in the "bad idea" gift shop on display. Overall I'd say the best Star Trek movies were better than the best Star Wars movies, but the worst ones are a lot worse, and more numerous.

[Drooling Iguana]

Nemesis has better graphics that AotC? was I watching some sort of special "crappy special effects" version of Nemesis, then? The version I saw certainly didn't have better graphics than Star Wars.

[Kenryoku_Maxis]

Nemesis has better graphics that AotC? was I watching some sort of special "crappy special effects" version of Nemesis, then? The version I saw certainly didn't have better graphics than Star Wars.

Well I also don't think half the Star Trek movies are horrible, but alas, its his opinion and its been stated.

Seriously, the only BAD Star Trek I can say is Insurrection. Even Star Trek V is somewhat good. Its concepts and execution was great. Direction was neither bad nor good (William Shatner Directed it). The villian has two faces (reference the connection to him and 'god' at movies end). A good addition of actors (the 'villian' and others who were added for the movie). And most important of all, it kept the original formula of exploration of space and cool starships with the comedy. However it was plagued with the shortest development time out of all 10 of the Star Trek movies and although had about as much money as Voyage Home (the movie before it), was trying to do alot more on that same budget. This plus script cuts and the thought it would be the last movie...its no wonder it didn't do that well.

Yet when I grew up, it was one of the movies I watched all the time. I never saw any of the other Movies because I'd seen bits and pieces from them really young and got scared. So, for me to go so long liking what many dub the worst of the original series movies, that must mean it has something. And no matter how you look at it, it got me to watch all the others over time. Which spawned this thread and well...yeah. Glad you're all coming with me on this.

And by the way guys, if you want to know the reason the first season of Star Trek is better than all others. And the reason many characters in other series seemingly aren't as good as the past ones eventhough they might be better 'actors'. Its simple really. The later Star Treks were written by young writers (like those who write for sit-coms and Law and Order type shows) and a few sci-fi veterans. Most of the Original Seires were written by THE Sci-Fi and Fantasy novel veterans. Ray Bradbury even wrote an episode if I'm not mistaken. Prominent people who have gone on to write entire books that if you go back and watch the series, sometimes a certin episode will resemble the basic idea of many different sci-fi or fantasy books. And of course my big beleif. The core of the old show always centered on Spock, McCoy and Kirk. The others might do something here and there, but it was those three that really were the center of almost all the plots and such. And none of the other series do something like that. Enterprise is the only one to come close to that so far...and it isn't quite doing it because its still trying to do that while branching out and focusing on everyoneelse as well.

Anyway, my ideas.