ESRB Who?

[Mirai Gen]

Clicky. (http://www.gamespot.com/news/6152490.html)

The FTC ruling warns Take-Two and Rockstar that they "cannot misrepresent the rating or content descriptors for an electronic game." It also requires them "to clearly and prominently disclose on product packaging and in any promotion or advertisement for electronic games, content relevant to the rating, unless that content had been disclosed sufficiently in prior submissions to the rating authority." Lastly, it orders them to "establish, implement, and maintain a comprehensive system reasonably designed to ensure that all content in an electronic game is considered and reviewed in preparing submissions to a rating authority."

"This is a matter of serious concern to the commission, and if they violate this order, they can be heavily fined," said Parnes. Indeed, the FTC ruling would levy a fine of "$11,000 per violation" on Take-Two.

[UPDATE 5] So just what constitutes a violation? "That depends," an FTC rep told GameSpot. "Different courts have ruled on different FTC rulings in different ways." The rep said that some courts have levied single fines for each general violation--which means that Take-Two would receive just a single $11,000 fine for each title that was deemed to violate the order. That would be little more than a slap on the wrist in the case of San Andreas, which has generated over $336 million in US sales as of April 2006, according to the NPD Group.

I don't like this. It's not the fact that there's actually a penalty for sidestepping the ESRB rating system (which is already bullshit). It's the fact that the reply of "What's a violation" goes as "That depends."

Fortunately, Rockstar and Take Two aren't getting any shit for GTA:SA Hot Coffee. It only insists upon future infractions (Thank fucking christ), so they're in the clear.

Thoughts?

[Mike McC]

I think a penalty for sidestepping the ESRB is a good thing. It will help to prevent further contraversy like Hot Coffee, and avoiding that will keep the government from regulating video games itself.

[MuMu]

I'll buy the games whatever their censorship is, so that's no problem to me, but I think ESRB should be something to ADVERT for having some mature content like blood and gore(Resident Evil anyone?) and not to PROHIBIT(sp?) to play because of the contennt(With the exception of explicit sex). And, what Oblvion IV did to get their censorship higher?

[Flarecobra]

Their female character models had nipples.

[Bells]

Soon they will request that you show ID when Buying games...

Or maybe a "permit to buy adult content" will be develop, and become mandatory all over the US...

Hipocrisy is High on the enterteinemt world...

[Mike McC]

Um, many store chains already do ask for ID to by M rated games. And this, believe it or not, is a good thing. This way only the parents can be blamed for buying it for thier kids.

Hey, it's better than having stupid people suing video game and other companies because they can't regulate what thier kids do. Hell, when I heard that Louisiana legislation passed a bill that fines retailers who sold an M-rated game to a minor. This kind of thing really enforces the ratings system. And that a government institution (sure, it's only a state government, but still) shows that the lawmakers don't blame the ESRB for the slip-ups, but rather the companies, and this does make me glad. I do not want the government regulating video games, because that leads to censorship.

Noone's all bent out of shape about minors not getting let into R rated movies alone. Why this? It doesn't make sense the double standard you guys are setting up here. "Yeah, movie ratings are good, but it'll be a cold day in hell when they enforce the video game ratings!" Grow up. Trust me, it makes perfect sense if you have kids, or maybe even young nieces and nephews.

Edit: And, the reason for the ratings bump for Oblivion is because it's more violent than the presented material to the ESRB suggested, and also because modifications can be made to make the models nude or partly nude. It didn't get bumped to Adult because the mods are made by outside developers, and there's nothing in the original code to access that material normally.

[Daimo Mac, The Blue Light of Hope]

I think what should happen is that if little Junior Sunuvabitch wants Grand Theft Auto: San Andreas and Mom or Dad Stupidparent gow ith him, the clerk should inform them of the ESRB rating and the content within the game. Because we know if a parent asks the kid what M stands for, he will respond with somehting stupid and make it not look as bad.

[Mirai Gen]

I think what should happen is that if little Junior Sunuvabitch wants Grand Theft Auto: San Andreas and Mom or Dad Stupidparent gow ith him, the clerk should inform them of the ESRB rating and the content within the game. Because we know if a parent asks the kid what M stands for, he will respond with somehting stupid and make it not look as bad.
What's funny, is I've seen this first hand. I worked for a video store, and I swear to god they picked up Mortal Kombat: Deadly Alliance (the one with the bleeding logo) and I said, "this game is pretty gory and bloody. You might want to get Soul Calibur 2 instead."

And they said, "it's violent?"

[Nique]

Ya, same here - Once I started telling a parent about the kind of content was present in the games she was renting for her grandchild (in my days at Blockbuster Video -whee!) she kind of raised an eyebrow and said 'really?'

Like I was joking.

About video games? Never, ma'am.

[ZERO.]

To be honest my mother knows what M means on the game rating.

She just knows she raised me better than thinking it's ok to hot wire a car and kill some hookers just because a game does it.

[[ray.z]]

I don't know about other countries, but here in Australia there is ID required if you wish to rent or purchase any MA15+ related product. Or R18+ rated either. The thing is here that there is no R or adult rating for videogames. So games like GTA had to be toned down a bit before they hit our shores.

Anywho, you need ratings on games - not just because the youngins are easily influenced, but because a majority of parental figures would like to know exactly what they're paying for.

And if parents do buy these games for their children, they either believe that their child is mature enough to play the game, or they just don't care.

Also: Many people are very, very stupid.

http://www.gamespot.com/ps2/action/grandtheftautovicecity/news.html?sid=6147626
http://www.gamepro.com.au/index.php?id=1731998297&eid=-160
http://www.gamepro.com.au/index.php/id;651138103;fp;1073741824;fpid;1631315277

[Nique]

I'm going to say that there is a degree of legitimacy to some of those cases, but the media influence being blamed is secondary, at best, to other influences (like for instance, the already present mental issues someone who is capable of beliving a video game can translate into real life, or the fact that children somehow got access to guns). That such media was enjoyed by the people who enacted acts of violence similar to that in the game only speaks to the fact that they enjoyed that kind of violence in the first place, else they wouldn't have played the games OR gone on their respective rampages.

It's the same logic behind attempting to sue the fast food restraunt that 'made' you fat, or the cigeratte company that 'gave' you cancer - yes some of those companies are terrible, but ultimatly, you are responsible for your own actions.

Of course, this conversation is all pretty old hat right now. To add, I'd say there's a big responsibility placed on all of us to know what we can handle in what you expose yourself too, and even moreso to know what your children can handle if you are a parent. Fragile minds and all...

[Darth SS]

I think another problem here is that the ESRB is just so damn FUBAR'd and broken that they need to seriously re-evaluate how they rate some games. There are some games they rate "Mature" because of the inclusion of blood or something that really should be rated teen. There are some games rated Teen that should be rated mature because of their actually content.

Some throwing out a random example:

About two months ago, maybe more, I was with my family in an EB. I'm 16 with a little bit more than 3 months until I can buy M-rated games. At te time, that would've been about half a year. Now, my dad says that if a game is rated M, I cannot buy it. Admirable position, taking a stance and agreeing with the rating system. My mother judges on a per-game basis.

I was going to get Syphon Filter: Dark Mirror (rightfully rated M) and my mother said "Oh no, it says intense violence. Not permitted." Black was also there. The package said violence.

Since then, I have laughed maniacly as I shot the wheels off a car, to drop it on someone. The way that ESRB rated them just has me confused. I think they should take two steps to deal with this:

1) Just hire some testers to actually play the damn game, instead of watching a series of clips that the developper believes accurately represents the gameplay experience.

2) Re-evaluate some games. By today's standards, Rainbow Six 3 isn't REALLY a mature game anymore, in any way. However, Grand Theft Auto III still is.

Back on topic: It's good for them to attach consequences for trying to doge ESRB. Good plan.


And that's my two pennies.

[[ray.z]]

Your damn right Darth SS.

Those crackpots virtually have no idea when it comes to rating video games, or even tv shows and movies.

And while it would be awesome to be hired to test upcoming games for their ratings, wouldn't that mean that somewhere around the world, people would be getting paid to play a game before it comes out. Developers wouldn't be happy about that.

And chances are these testers would be at least young adults, (now in going into conspiracy mode) could hold the fate of many new games in their hands (literally). What if developers thought that, "Hey we could pay these people to give our game the rating that we want."

Like I know it sounds terribly absurd, but shit (what i said above) does happen.

Slightly back on topic now, but what if there was only one scene of really, really graphical violence, and the rest was just mild? How would developers react to that? Is it like in a move where you see just one bare titty, then for the rest of the movie everyone else shown is fully clothed (more or less).

@ Darth SS: It's two cents (http://members.aol.com/MorelandC/HaveOriginsData.htm) - not pennies (hehehe).

[Darth SS]

I'm not condemning the whole system. I'm just saying that there are a few random games where they rate it as something unsuiting.

[[ray.z]]

Yeh, but their mistakes make everything else look bad, like the comics code authority.

But I guess it all aint that bad.