Square-Enix wants my moneys and they always get them.

[Regulus Tera]

After playing Final Fantasy Tactics (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Final_Fantasy_Tactics) a few years ago, I became a rabid FFXII fan even when all I knew was that it revamped the series in so many ways that it wasn't a true Final Fantasy game, but a Matsuno's masterpiece (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yasumi_Matsuno). I've been following its release almost religiously, avoiding some of the spoilerish stuff while trying to get as much information as possible to saciate my need for Ivalice (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ivalice) awesomeness.

Part of the reason I became so enthralled to the game, I must admit, was that unlike some other creations in the current (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Compilation_of_Final_Fantasy_VII) trend, (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fabula_Nova_Crystallis) FFXII felt unique, even when the setting had some references to Vagrant Story (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vagrant_Story) and FFT. I've heard it everywhere: Final Fantasy XII is awesome, Final Fantasy XII is a love or hate game, you must buy Final Fantasy XII.

The magnet took me in: I already preordered the Collector's Edition. I can hardly wait for October the 31st, and all I can do in the meantime is level up my characters in Dragon Quest VIII while waiting for this holy grail to reach my hands and immerse once again into the political intrigue Matsuno has always secretly treasured until the time was right for us.

But then, I see this (http://kh2.co.uk/assets/kh2/fm/scans/scn0001.jpg), and the fanboy inside me starts to scream.

Some fun stuff here, like a RPG based on a street (read my yoyo in your follo[/lame hip hop]), a revamp of Kingdom Hearts II with an extended secret ending and possibly a Chain of Memories-esque minigame (which will almost surely be only released in Japan), and a FFXII sequel for the DS.

To which I say, what the fuck?

I know S-E is a company, and like every company it exists to make money. They have been doing this from the moment they released FFX-2, but ever since I played Dirge of Cerberus, I've been fearing for what was once a series that knew how to make itself desired. Now? I feel the company is rushing all these games too fast, not focusing on one at the time and.. giving us some crappy ass job (coughDIRGEOFCERBERUScough).

So my question is this: How much can you milk something before it loses its appeal? It doesn't apply only to videogames, but I use them as a vehicle because of what is happening to Final Fantasy right now. And to be fair, Megaman has been doing it for a much longer time. That's one of the reasons I love the MGS series: you have some for a few years to fulfill your desires, and then wham! Speculation once again.

Being much more of a subjective question (as well as an excuse to rant/excite about more FFXII), I want to know your opinions as to the rehashing of a series time and a time again. Because, after all, event though they are the ones who make the games, we are the ones who demand for them.

[The Artist Formerly Known as Hawk]

i dont know how you can say the S-E is rushing the FF games they release lately. i mean i heard about FF12 about 2 and a half years ago and im still waiting for it to be released. ok so they may rush all these off-shoots of the main series (FFT, FF10-2, ETC), but as far as the main core of the series goes they are taking longer than ever.

[PyrosNine]

Eh, They can do it because the game's been out over there for a long enough time, and there's a chance the DS game won't be ported over here.

But on the Brightside, on Mario Hoops for the DS (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mario_Hoops_3-on-3), I can jam on the court as MF-ing BLACK MAGE! That makes up for any money grubbing S-E can do in my eyes.

As for who's in the game, onlly Black Mage, White Mage, Ninja, and the two Non Chocobo (Kupo and 1000 needles of death) square mascots make it in.

My main problem with Square Enix wanting my monies is that I never have my monies when square wants them. Causing Square to abuse me with Preplayed discs from Gamestop that some degenerate purposely scratched the part of the disc with the FMV's.

[Fifthfiend]

Really the one is a function of the other, they gotta squeeze out the final mixes and junk because it takes them goddamn forever to put out a game proper, anymore.

To be honest, though? I need a 3d KH game with a card-based battle system like I need a second asshole that shits shards of glass. And as far as secret endings, KH2 managed to be enough of a disappointment that it scorched out any need I might have had to speculate about KH3.

Oh that's right, you mentioned something about FFXII? Let's see, what was it that I was going to say about FFXII? Oh yeah that's right - fuck FFXII.

Yeah, I think that about sums it up.

[Furioku]

I agree to an extent, They are rushing these side games out pretty quickly and they do end up turning into crappy games. (Dirge of Cerberus and FFX-2) But there are some good out there in the mix, like the remake of Final Fantasy 4 and I can't wait for the final fantasy 3 remake for the DS and the FF6 remake for the GBA. I just really hope they take their time on Final Fantasy 12 and turn it into a hit, I have played the demo and it's not too bad, it could've been better though and I miss the turn-based battle systems, but change is to be expected of course.

Also, did I mention that, FF13 looks amazing?

[Nique]

Is it OK that I just Abdicate whatever control I have over my spending to Sqaure-Enix? Yeah? Alright. 'Cuase its really just a formality at this point...

BTW, I need to pick up Vagrant Story...

[Astral Harmony]

True. Either Squenix or Capcom.

One thing I noticed about myself when it comes to their games is that I enjoy the one hit wonders far more than their series. Such as Radiata Stories. I friggin' love Radiata Stories.

[Chipper173]

Thanks for reminding me that I also need to pay for FFIII, the FFVI rerelease, FFXII, and that FFCC that apparantly is coming out with the Wii.

My wallet is really grateful.

[Regulus Tera]

i dont know how you can say the S-E is rushing the FF games they release lately. i mean i heard about FF12 about 2 and a half years ago and im still waiting for it to be released. ok so they may rush all these off-shoots of the main series (FFT, FF10-2, ETC), but as far as the main core of the series goes they are taking longer than ever.

Which is actually one of the reasons I do not like this flood of FF games at all. FFXII was supposed to be released two years ago, and although Matsuno's departure from the project surely had some effect into that, one of my suspicions is that the game was further delayed to give time for all these FF spinoffs to be released (and Dragon Quest VIII too).

I agree to an extent, They are rushing these side games out pretty quickly and they do end up turning into crappy games. (Dirge of Cerberus and FFX-2) But there are some good out there in the mix, like the remake of Final Fantasy 4 and I can't wait for the final fantasy 3 remake for the DS and the FF6 remake for the GBA. I just really hope they take their time on Final Fantasy 12 and turn it into a hit, I have played the demo and it's not too bad, it could've been better though and I miss the turn-based battle systems, but change is to be expected of course.

From what I've read, the demo doesn't do any justice to the real game, lacking not only Gambit options but also some License Board goodness. And contrary to the common belief, you can play this game as if it were turn-based, by turning off the gambits and doing every command manually. I suggest you rent it, if at least for the story.

Thanks for reminding me that I also need to pay for FFIII, the FFVI rerelease, FFXII, and that FFCC that apparantly is coming out with the Wii.

My wallet is really grateful.

What? No love for FFV (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Final_Fantasy_V#Game_Boy_Advance)?

...fuck FFXII.

If there was a god, he would have smashed you by this time. :stressed:

[Living Bobbeh]

I cut of my money to Squenix ages. Ever since they put out the pure disappointment that is known as "Fef Ecks Two", they haven't seen any money from me, neither has Sony for that matter.

[BitVyper]

I stopped buying after I tried FFX. I did, however, make the mistake of renting a couple games.

Kind of funny that back in the day I would have bought something just because Square made it, and now I won't even consider their games.

[mammothtank]

One thing I noticed about myself when it comes to their games is that I enjoy the one hit wonders far more than their series. Such as Radiata Stories. I friggin' love Radiata Stories.That's because stand-alone games aren't just yet another rehash of the first of a series; they're better than that. Why? Because they don't have a fanbase sitting around drooling on themselves, already planning to buy the game the day it comes out. "One-hit wonder" games have to make themselves popular, meaning there's a standard to meet.

I think the Final Fantasy series has been slowly dying for awhile now; in fact, I never expected there to be a 13th numbered game. They're beating a horse that isn't quite dead yet, but whose last will and testament has already been drawn up. If a friend of mine picks up FFXII I'll gladly try it, but I doubt I'll spend my own money on it.

[Living Bobbeh]

I never expected there to be a 13th numbered game.

Or three of them, as the case seems to be.

[Solid Snake]

Square-Enix these days has been a mixed bag at best. I've loved some of it (Dragon Quest VIII, Final Fantasy XII still looks pretty good, KH2 was pretty fun, and I have to admit enjoying watching the battle scenes in Advent Children.) I've hated some of it (Final Fantasy X-2, everything that wasn't a fight scene in Advent Children, Dirge of Cerebus, all these other lousy spinoffs...even DQVIII hasn't been immune from the spin-off craze.)

If there's one reason why I love the Suikoden series it's that, by comparison, Suikoden has been relatively untampered by any moneymaking desire to milk the crap out of it. Same with Metal Gear Solid, with the exception of Acid Kojima's been surprisingly good with making sure MGS stays a solid series without succumbing to the desire of sacrificing quality for more money...

Actually, now that I think of it, both Suikoden and MGS are Konami franchises, aren't they? If so, thanks Konami, for still being all about quality gaming franchises.

[greed]

Actually, now that I think of it, both Suikoden and MGS are Konami franchises, aren't they? If so, thanks Konami, for still being all about quality gaming franchises.

You know you may be right, with the exception of the PS2 Castlevanias(more than made up by the GBA/DS Castlevanias) they are pretty quality over quantity for a company as big as they are.

As for Square, they're turning into a Japanese EA with RPGs replacing sports. FF13 doesn't even interest me, my opinion on twelve parellels PA's, never really liked KH. what I'm looking forward to is FF3, the new Mana games(revival of a childhood favourite, the nostalgia alone....) and the if the DQ series goes on the Wii.

[Mirai Gen]

neither has Sony for that matter.
It's worth noting that God of War, Shadow of the Colossus, and Ico are all done by Sony's software development team.
You know you may be right, with the exception of the PS2 Castlevanias(more than made up by the GBA/DS Castlevanias) they are pretty quality over quantity for a company as big as they are.
You know, people like myself who absolutely love Konami still cannot forget Castlevani 64. Not every game company is perfect.

Well, except maybe companies like Bungie and Blizzard. They make so few games, that I can't think of anything bad they've done FLAME PLZ.
True. Either Squenix or Capcom.
Capcom?

Okay, seriously, fuck Capcom.

Capcom is such a fucking mixed bag when it comes to developing games, it's like they play Duck Duck Goose to see who gets to design their next game, and they take, I don't know, a fucking whore down the street to do some of them. The same team that brought me Mega Man, Mega Man X, Devil May Cry, DMC3, Resident Evil, Resident Evil 5, Viewtiful Joe, and Viewtiful Joe 2 also brought me Devil May Cry 2, Mega Man X5+, Viewtiful Joe: Red Hot Rumble, and Resident Evil 0. How can they possibly fuck up a game from all of their franchises?

That kind of sheer randomness pisses me right off, especially considering how their capacity for awesome is only rivaled by their complete incompetence.

[greed]

That kind of sheer randomness pisses me right off, especially considering how their capacity for awesome is only rivaled by their complete incompetence.

Displacing fifthiend in my sig for truth Mirai.

[Ominous Dominus]

I have not heard wonderful things about FF XII, but since I lack the console to play it, I'm not too worried about it sucking. I'll just go back to playing FF 1, and hope that someday they come out with a Final Fantasy as good as VI or VII that's worth my time.

Oh, Celes... you will be mine. Oh yes...

[MFD]

That's because stand-alone games aren't just yet another rehash of the first of a series; they're better than that. Why? Because they don't have a fanbase sitting around drooling on themselves, already planning to buy the game the day it comes out. "One-hit wonder" games have to make themselves popular, meaning there's a standard to meet.

There are fanboys for FF in general, good sir.

[mammothtank]

There are fanboys for FF in general, good sir.<.<

Are you arguing against something I said? If so, I'm afraid I missed it.

[Kurosen]

Kind of funny that back in the day I would have bought something just because Square made it, and now I won't even consider their games
Welcome to 1998 ;D

[Jagos]

Hmmm...

Square making a 13th FINAL Fantasy...

And yet Parasite Eve, Vagrant Story, Rad Racer, Ehrgeiz, and Tobal don't become franchise material.

I think EA learned a valuable lesson behind their "bigger is better" era. You can make a franchise but you must constantly improve it. Kinda hard when you only have one main story. I liked the SNES era of Square for Secret of Mana and all but nowadays, the name of FF is becoming more and more... I don't know the word...

Burned out.

I dunno if Square is retreading ground or if they're breaking new ones. The money's gonna dry up and I worry if Square-Enix is gonna dry up like Sega eventually. I like how Dragon Warrior has become more popular. But for the love of mike, can't we get a few creative and talented writers to make up some new names?

[BitVyper]

Welcome to 1998 ;D

So, it took me this long to get passed denial and blow through to acceptance.

[Majin Darshe]

Hmmm...

Square making a 13th FINAL Fantasy...

And yet Parasite Eve, Vagrant Story, Rad Racer, Ehrgeiz, and Tobal don't become franchise material.

I think EA learned a valuable lesson behind their "bigger is better" era. You can make a franchise but you must constantly improve it. Kinda hard when you only have one main story. I liked the SNES era of Square for Secret of Mana and all but nowadays, the name of FF is becoming more and more... I don't know the word...

Burned out.

I dunno if Square is retreading ground or if they're breaking new ones. The money's gonna dry up and I worry if Square-Enix is gonna dry up like Sega eventually. I like how Dragon Warrior has become more popular. But for the love of mike, can't we get a few creative and talented writers to make up some new names?

Wait a minute...almost every Final Fantasy game in recent years has more or less had a completely new and different game-play engine for each game (Although FFX-2 is basically a throwback to FF5's, and FF9's is an improved version of FF6's esper system. FF 1-3 were basically the same game. And FF12 is an extreme departure from previous games, only partially resembling FFXI) and you consider it "burned out", while Dragon Quest/Warrior has more or less had a very simplified system for decades and is pretty much 99% dungeon crawler and you think it ISN'T? Not that I'm dissing DQ at all, but still.

I really can't understand this logic at all. Maybe some people should just let stuff go...

[Fifthfiend]

If there was a god, he would have smashed you by this time. :stressed:

If there was a God he'd get someone to make me a damn real sequel to Chrono Trigger.

I have to admit enjoying watching the battle scenes in Advent Children.

Oh come on, even the fight scenes were retarded. It was like watching the six million dollar Dragonball Z episode.

[PyrosNine]

I find it rather funny that the 13th final fantasy, which may be the most unlucky game for Squeenix, is the one they decide to make 3 games for.

And they even go with the idea to make the main character of the central game of the 3 star a literally female Cloud. I thought so when I first watched it, and then when I was reading this one piece on FFXIII, for character design the designers were actually thinking "Hey, Cloud's very popular, so let's make the main character look like a female cloud.

Lastly, Motomu Toriyama, while reluctant to discuss in detail the main character, revealed "This time, one of the characteristics of this heroine is that she's not that feminine. I tried to make her someone very strong, independent.

"When I asked Mr. Nomura to design this character, I requested someone like a female version of Cloud from FFVII."

A female version of cloud, eh? Isn't that predictable... (http://www.anonib.com/_genderbending/images/12/1135863885414.gif).

So my thoughts go like this. The new hero is going to be a mix of Cloud, and the only gun wielding female in an FF game, Yuna. Of course that would end up looking like this (http://www.anonib.com/_genderbending/images/14/64ef9e7a.jpg) (shudder) so they'll just add some Tifa (http://pspmedia.ign.com/psp/image/article/531/531112/final-fantasy-vii-advent-children-20040716070849928.jpg), or possibly Motoko Kusanagi (http://www.liberaeva.com/interviste/motoko8.jpg) to get HER. (http://www.ff-xiii.net/images/screens/xiii4.jpg)

Fans of cross dressing cloud can celebrate, while the rest of us can cringe, look the other way and hope he doesn't try to interact with us in any way, shape or form.

[Fifthfiend]

After five iterations of progressively more effete male leads, it's actually almost a step forward that they went ahead and made the character an actual girl.

[Majin Darshe]

I think they just said that they aren't planning on making the girl in the trailer the main character. They just used her because she would basically make a good impression.


After five iterations of progressively more effete male leads, it's actually almost a step forward that they went ahead and made the character an actual girl.


I think that goes for the ENTIRE SERIES ACTUALLY

http://www.ffcompendium.com/art/4-cecil_dk_paladin-a.jpg
http://www.ffcompendium.com/art/5-butz-a.jpg
http://www.ffcompendium.com/art/6-locke-a.jpg

[Fifthfiend]

Out of game art doesn't count.

[Mirai Gen]

Yeah, being fair, Yoshitaka Amano's art is effimate no matter who it is.

Just look at that Locke picture.

And, continuing fair-being, while I happen to like Chrono Cross, yeah it wasn't a Chrono Trigger sequel, and I'm still fucking waiting for it.

And well, as Fifth said, fuck FF13.

[Fifthfiend]

What? Naw, I said fuck FF12. I haven't really seen enough of FF13 to say fuck FF13.

It'll be a good long while before I'm ready to say fuck FF13.

... Oh, who am I kidding? Fuck FF13.

[BitVyper]

Oh come on, even the fight scenes were retarded. It was like watching the six million dollar Dragonball Z episode.

You say that like a six million dollar DBZ episode would be a bad thing. I loved the action in AC. The rest... well, lets just say I didn't pay attention to the subtitles.

[Majin Darshe]

Out of game art doesn't count.

...In game portraits in the menu?

[Mondt]

... Oh, who am I kidding? Fuck FF13.I believe in Final Fantasy XII about as much as I believe in Windows Vista, which is I'll start believing in Final Fantasy XII at the exact moment where I can go to a store and pay money to buy Final Fantasy XII.

I believe in Final Fantasy XIII about as much as I believe in Windows Makes You Nachos, Gives You Blowjobs, and Finds Your Fuckin' Car Keys Edition.;)

Hell, I'm still waiting to get FFT, and a Wii for FFCC(2?). I'm waiting for FF6 for GBA too. I started playing my cousin's version of 4 on the GBA a while back. Just changed Cecil. I mean, I have a lot of stuff to go buy, but effing ay. I don't have that kind of money to spare on stuff.

[Fifthfiend]

...In game portraits in the menu?

Those weren't what you'd linked.



http://www.ffonline.com/1_ff6gfx/charactersmenu.gif

See? Not exceptionally masculine, but not particularly effete, either.

Now Setzer that's a whole other deal.

http://www.cavesofnarshe.com/forums/ipb/html/avatars/Final_Fantasy_4_Menu_Pics/Paladin_Cecil.gif

Look at that jaw, that steely-eyed stare. That Cecil, he is all man.

[Jagos]

Wait a minute...almost every Final Fantasy game in recent years has more or less had a completely new and different game-play engine for each game (Although FFX-2 is basically a throwback to FF5's, and FF9's is an improved version of FF6's esper system. FF 1-3 were basically the same game. And FF12 is an extreme departure from previous games, only partially resembling FFXI) and you consider it "burned out", while Dragon Quest/Warrior has more or less had a very simplified system for decades and is pretty much 99% dungeon crawler and you think it ISN'T? Not that I'm dissing DQ at all, but still.

I really can't understand this logic at all. Maybe some people should just let stuff go...

I more or less was ranting about the name. Square has forsaken some great titles (Seiken Densetsu, Parasite Eve, Vagrant Story, Valkyrie Profile, etc.) in favor of ONE title to rule them all. Would the games be as popular if they didn't have Final Fantasy written over it? That's my argument.

Hell, we really wanna talk about a great series? Chrono Trigger is on par with Final Fantasy if not surpasses it (IMO)! But where is the love on the DS, the Wii, the Gamecube, the PS2, the XBox, or anything else for that matter from Square-Enix?

Nope, all it is... is Final Fantasy. Honestly, I'd stop at 15. I loved FF6. I liked the throwback in FF9. FFX had some great storyline to it (Even though, I still think Tidus is a wuss...)

But what I remember Square for was variety. On the SNES, I was one of the few that played Secret of Evermore and LIKED it! My first RPG was Secret of Mana.

There's so many franchises that need some help. And Square cuts off anyone else's attempt to show their love for different games (see Chrono Trigger remake for PC...) AND gives us yet another game in the FF series?

Come on, let the name go...

[Grandmaster_Skweeb]

Will I go out and spend money willy nilly on FFXII? Nah, I learned that the hard way with FFIX. As nice as it was for being a throwback..that was it's only redeeming quality. Squeenix has turned me into a shrewd and heartless purchaser of video games.

Nowadays my video game mantra is 'Decide upon a game by the purchasing mistakes of others'.

If a cousin or friend buys it I'll play it for a while whenever we have nothing to do. If I like it I'll buy it. If I don't like it enough to buy it then I won't.

I will wholeheartedly apply this plan with FFXII. :D

[Regulus Tera]

I just realized something: with Twilight Princess, the Zelda series will reach its twelfth iteration (thirteenth if you count the Oracle games as separate), which is exactly the number of main FFs that are out in Japan as of this moment. Also, Mario has like who knows how many different games in so many different genres. So, why aren't these two series bashed as much as FF?

Edit: Damn those grammatical dwarves.

[Roland]

I just realized something: with the Twilight Princess, the Zelda series will reach its twelfth iteration (thirteen if you count the Oracle games as separate), which is exactly the number of main FFs that are out in Japan as of this moment. Also, Mario has like who knows how many different games in so many different genres. So, why aren't these two series bashed as much as FF?

Edit: Damn those grammatical dwarves.

It's probably because Nintendo doesn't believe in keeping cou-wait, Mario Party.

[Eltargrim]

Probably because adventure games are less dependant on plot than RPGs. That, and as Roland said, they're not keeping count - at least with aLoZ.

[Random Ninja]

Personally, I'm interested in FF12. If only for the fact that I need a memorable FF game for my PS2. I mean, don't get me wrong, FFX was good. But if it's the best FF in the entire PS2's lifespan, I'm gonna shed a tear.

That, plus after playing KotOR I really enjoy RPG battles in the semi-free roam format. And I want to kick the shit out of some bunny women in 3-D.

And Advent Children was pure eye candy. While the plot was half decent if you know just about everything about the game, it overwhelms new comers to the game/movie. Ontop of that, it all seemed to be a big lemon squeeze just to get the ungodly Neo/Smith styled battle at the end. I mean, cutting stone I get, but wtf was up with the random flying?

Out of the movie, I'd have to say I was rooting more for Reno and Rude then Cloud. 'cause you know he's gonna win, where's the suspense?

[bananarama]

Y'know all I want out of Squenix is a Chrono Trigger sequel and a FFVI sequel (whoa! whoa! Come down everybody! All I am asking for is continuation of the best FF game of all time with the use of sprites like the SNES version, no Charlies' Angels themed crapstick of a sequel). Of course, those two sequels will never happen because apparently SE hates happiness.

[Random Ninja]

...dude...that was the worst criticism I've ever heard. Not only was it offensive to gay people, it was offensive to those that whorship the great Sea Serpent Leviathen.

Also, until I see some actual pictures of female FFXIII Cloud, I'm not going to start vomiting in terror.

Also, I wasn't a huge fan of FFVI. It was too dead looking, the art style didn't really appeal to me (Concept art, I mean. It didn't really look like the characters. Although this dude was the same guy that drew the art for ff9 and FFIV, neither of which's art impressed me) What I want out of Squarenix is a polished up FF7 for PS3, same plot, same mechanics, just updated graphics, soundtrack, VO and maybe a bit of harmless extra content. Like what they did with the Anthology/chronicles packages. Also, I can't wait to get my hands on those games for PSP, mostly because I felt Zack was always far superior to Cloud in the fact that A. Zack has cooler hair, and isn't a short ass, and B. His personality is likeable instead of emo.

[Fifthfiend]

I just realized something: with Twilight Princess, the Zelda series will reach its twelfth iteration (thirteenth if you count the Oracle games as separate), which is exactly the number of main FFs that are out in Japan as of this moment. Also, Mario has like who knows how many different games in so many different genres. So, why aren't these two series bashed as much as FF?

As a purely technical consideration, if you're counting the GBA Zeldas and junk, then you have to throw in like the Final Fantasy Legend games, Final Fantasy adventure, Final Fantasy Tactics / FF Tactics Advance, FF Crystal Chronicles, FFX2, all kind of junk.

But honestly all that is beside the point, what it really comes down to is - you know, if Final Fantasy had done thirteen, totally awesome games, that didn't annoy the crap out of me for various and infuriating reasons? I would be like all right Square, way to make thirteen totally awesome games that don't annoy the crap out me! And I mean, if they had made like six good Zelda games, and then a progression of increasingly weak-sauce sequels and effete emo-boy Links? I'd be like well, fuck Zelda.

And I mean dang, since when have people not bashed Zelda? I mean, people bashed the shit out of Wind Waker, and that game's worst sin was what, cel-shading? (For the record, I was pretty much okay with cel-shading, I bashed the shit out of Wind Waker because it murdered Goddamn Hyrule.) And hell forget Wind Waker, I know I'm not the only person who had their last fucking nerve plucked by goddamn LoZ 2, aka 'The Shitty Side-Scrolling One'. I mean okay, we didn't have an internet to bitch about it on back then, but that didn't stop us bitching, all the same.

[Nique]

I think it's funny how... polarized the opinions of any given game or series is...

Its not even like its about how good the game is verses another game... its just this heated debate about how, say, Final Fantasy 8 was either friggin' sweet or smelled metaphorically of President Taft's least-often cleaned body part.

[Mirai Gen]

And hell forget Wind Waker, I know I'm not the only person who had their last fucking nerve plucked by goddamn LoZ 2, aka 'The Shitty Side-Scrolling One'. I mean okay, we didn't have an internet to bitch about it on back then, but that didn't stop us bitching, all the same.
I liked Zelda II, honestly, and it would have been terrific had it not been mind fuckingly hard.

[BitVyper]

I liked Zelda II, honestly, and it would have been terrific had it not been mind fuckingly hard.

I didn't like it when I was young, but now that I go back and play, I find it pretty enjoyable.

Yeah, being fair, Yoshitaka Amano's art is effimate no matter who it is.

http://c-uncut.com/media/ff1-ff6-banon.jpg
http://www.ffsky.com/ff/zhuanti/FF6/pic/sabin2.jpg - note the beard.

http://c-uncut.com/media/ff1-ff6-sabin.jpg

http://content.answers.com/main/content/wp/en/thumb/c/c7/150px-Ff6cyanart.jpg

[Random Ninja]

But honestly all that is beside the point, what it really comes down to is - you know, if Final Fantasy had done thirteen, totally awesome games, that didn't annoy the crap out of me for various and infuriating reasons? I would be like all right Square, way to make thirteen totally awesome games that don't annoy the crap out me! And I mean, if they had made like six good Zelda games, and then a progression of increasingly weak-sauce sequels and effete emo-boy Links? I'd be like well, fuck Zelda.

I also tend to find the LoZ series of dungeon crawler puzzles to be a trip of nostalgia that quickly turns to nausia. I mean, sure, I enjoy kickin' ass with a boomerang and chain-hook thingy as much as the next guy, but honestly. I can only push so many statues and pull myself across so many gaps before I'm just thinking 'I just paid 20 bucks for a continuous replay'.

Now, of course, FF isn't the most mind blowing puzzle game ever, and some of the trips get annoying (Most notably those mofo'ing Trials of Fayth or whatever in FFX) but at least when they give you dungeons, they have greater differences then tile colouring and a pallette swapped enemies. (For the most part) And the graphic flare they deliver is way better then any boss fight I've seen in the LoZ games, save for possibly the bitchin' giant demon hog thing in OoT. Ontop of that, I wasn't too fond of Wind Waker for the fact that everyone looked like they came out of a retarded British saturday morning cartoon. It wasn't the cell shading, it wasn't the complete slaughter of Link's character, but the fact that they all looked like fuggin' rejects from Pikmin.

Also, it's nice that the games give new characters in each installment. I know alot of people stretch for ways to connect the storylines, and Squarenix never really lets them, but at least they dangle enough hints to make it interesting. And with these games, when they don't continously reuse the same heros/villians, they can't totally screw up their characters. They either start retarded and no one likes them, or they're cool and people remember them that way.

(Such as with Ryu in Breath of Fire, who seemingly gets more effemninent with every reincarnation. Despite that, BoF 3 was, and is, my favourite Capcom RPG to date.)

On a side note, at first, I was a total sucker for FF7, and when FF8 came out, I didn't mind it. Then everyone was like 'this game is vastly superior to the old styles of the archaic FF7!' and I was all 'Grrr' and started to hate the game from spite. But after I got over it, I can look back on the game and say that it really was a great game. I especially loved the card game, which is probably one of the few game long mini-games I every enjoyed, coming second behind Blitzball.

So in closing, LoZ's had it's ups and downs, mostly at fault for falling back on the same bosses, enemies, weapons, spells, characters and backdrops (and when they tried to remove one or two of said elements, the games were less then impressive). FF has had it's same share of highs and lows, but mostly because they've placed so much detail in the game, and so much content that it can take away from the emotion expressed through the storyline. Like how when you eat a dessert every day for a month, you just can't stand to look at it anymore.

Basicly, LoZ needs to start changing things in their games, but within a safe test margin until they know what they're doing, and Squarenix needs to take more time to turn the fight to fight content into something less repetitive and dreary so that when we finally do get to the plot points, we're not depressed or annoyed with those summa bitch random encounters, or tacked on side missions.

[Mirai Gen]

http://c-uncut.com/media/ff1-ff6-banon.jpg
http://www.ffsky.com/ff/zhuanti/FF6/pic/sabin2.jpg - note the beard.

http://c-uncut.com/media/ff1-ff6-sabin.jpg

http://content.answers.com/main/content/wp/en/thumb/c/c7/150px-Ff6cyanart.jpg
Okay, granted.

But Tidus and Locke's character art kind of gives me that "womanly" vibe every time I see it.

I think Sabin is the only one in those images that really is manly.

Oh, and PS: The links to those sites don't work. They redirect to the main site.

[Solid Snake]

Damn, I wish Sabin actually had the beard in FFVI.

[Random Ninja]

Pfft, you guys think Tidus is bad? Check out the main character from Magna Carta: Tears of Blood

It's a mutha fuggin' MAN! (http://www.afjv.com/press0510/051026_magna_carta_ps2_a.jpg)

[BitVyper]

Okay, granted.

But Tidus and Locke's character art kind of gives me that "womanly" vibe every time I see it.

I think Sabin is the only one in those images that really is manly.

Oh, and PS: The links to those sites don't work. They redirect to the main site.

...How annoying...

Well, one was a picture of Banon, who is positively grisly, and another is Cyan just looking masculine.

[Kenryoku_Maxis]

Square has only gotten my money in the last...4 years because of the 'Enix' part in their name.

However, I think FF12 is going to be a perchase for me for sure.

[Random Ninja]

Oh, I definately have to agree about FF12. Mostly because the entire plot doesn't revolve around constantly playing dress up, or an exceedingly sappy love story.

And to quote X-Play, it's settings and technology also seem to take a great deal of imagery from the George Lucas universe.

[Kroze Gamegod]

They did it.... AGAIN!!!


Final Fantasy 7: Advent Children Complete
This is the Blu-Ray version of the movie, and as the title suggests, it's going to be somewhat of a director's cut. Not only will the resolution be much higher than the DVD version, but Square Enix will be adding scenes and making changes to existing scenes. One new scene shown during the presentation was Sephiroth impaling Cloud and hoisting him over his head while his Masamune was still embedded inside of him, much like in Final Fantasy 7 for the PSOne.

No word on a solid release date yet but the trailer did indicate a Japanese release sometime in 2007.

Way to milk that movie Squenix!
I have torches ready to go if anyone wants to help..

[BitVyper]

Meh, that's pretty normal. You rarely see the REAL movie in theatres these days.

If you really want to go after someone for this kind of thing, George Lucas is probably your man.

[Regulus Tera]

If they add some substantial plot, character development, give Red XIII the spot he deserves AND fill all the plot holes that movie has, I will consider buying it.

Then again, it's for Blu-ray, and it looks like all they are adding is prettier graphics and longer action scenes.

Stupid Nomura, in how many ways can I hate you? Let's count.

[Random Ninja]

See, this is why I'm glad I downloaded it in japanese and waited before deciding to buy it on DVD. With paitence, maybe after one or two more releases I'll get the 'final version'.

[Krylo]

I mean, people bashed the shit out of Wind Waker, and that game's worst sin was what, cel-shading?

Actually, I liked the Cel Shading. It fit the story-telling style so ridiculously well.

No... its worst sin was not cel shading. Its worse sin was me setting my controller down, going to make a sandwich, grabbing a pop, sitting down, and having lunch while waiting for my GODDAMN RETARDED BOAT TO GET TO THE NEXT FUCKING ISLAND! And don't even get me started about how annoying finding the fishmen was, or how utterly pointless and easy anything resembling combat in it happened to be... oh and the weaksauce puzzles.

Yeah--all my problems are with the gameplay being either ridiculously boring or far too easy.

...SOMEHOW it still managed to be pretty damn fun... but still...

And as for FF12?

Sky Pirates.

That's all I need to know.

PS--Sabin looked like a blonde ugly goth chick with a beard, and Amano is a fucking shitty artist.

[Random Ninja]

Nonono...he's not 'shitty' He's 'stylilized' or some other word that means shitty, but isn't shitty.

[BitVyper]

No... its worst sin was not cel shading. Its worse sin was me setting my controller down, going to make a sandwich, grabbing a pop, sitting down, and having lunch while waiting for my GODDAMN RETARDED BOAT TO GET TO THE NEXT FUCKING ISLAND!

You know, that WAS annoying, but in some ways, I applaud the attempt to really depict travel. They didn't do it right, but it is something I'd like to see more of in my RPGs. They just need to, you know, find a way to make said travel interesting.

I want the feeling that I'm actually stomping across the countryside on my horse, or travelling the high seas. Actually, Shadow of the Colossus did all right in that respect.

[Random Ninja]

Well, I think that if they're going to stick you on a boat for hours, it should be a fairly decent sized boat. Like Jack's boat in KH2. Now if they added things like storms, sea fairing enemies (aquatic monsters/enemy ships) as well as things like Sea Fishing or something, it'd be fun.

But then I'd probably want the option to skip the entire thing and make the trip as short as possible so I didn't get side tracked.

[Regulus Tera]

Ranting time! (http://ds.ign.com/articles/733/733945p1.html) Now with extra on-topicness avec le premier post!

The game's director is Motome Torishima, who previously served as event planner on Final Fantasy VII, event director for Final Fantasy X and director for FFX-2. He's also working as director on Final Fantasy XIII for the PS3, so he's got some strong ties to the FF series. Serving as co-producer is Eisuke Yokoyama, the assistant producer on Dragon Quest VIII.

So you are replacing Matsuno-san with the guy who is responsible for FFX-2 and is supposed to be working on FFXIII so that he has less time to spend on both projects? Sign me up for a ride on that boat!

Torishima explained to the magazine the reason for putting this spin-off on the DS. Apparently, Torishima and his staff had taken note of a common scene throughout Japan: people playing the DS. They began to consider ideas for games designed for people who aren't into games. That's when the idea of a "My First Final Fantasy" came up.

ñya ñya!! This smells like Mystic Quest. You are removing the hair numbling (supposedly) difficulty and intricacies from the original plot, and you are watering it down for small kids. It’s like Advent Children on crack and on gummy bears.

Yokoyama and Torishima's details on the storyline were equally vague. The time frame of Revenant Wings in relation to the main FFXII story isn't important, explained Torishima, adding that the game's timeframe is merely an era when Vaan and Panelo were air pirates. The story of XII was, he admitted, that of Vaan and Panelo getting caught up in a storyline that was already taking place with Ashe and the other characters. In Revenant Wings, Vaan has the main character role all to himself.

Yokoyama added that the game isn't a sequel to FFXII. It's not, for instance, FFXII-2.

Final Fantasy XII: Vaan wants to be a sky pirate.
Final Fantasy XII Revenant Wings: Vaan is a sky pirate.

Yeah. No continuation whatsoever. Great way to spoil FFXII, also. Awesome.

[Random Ninja]

I tend not to read too much into those sorts of things, because in the end, opinions based off of this sort of stuff sours my opinions of games that turn out to be pretty good. So I end up not liking them for reasons that I can no longer remember.

Like FF8...for a time.

[ElfLad]

Nonono...he's not 'shitty' He's 'stylilized' or some other word that means shitty, but isn't shitty.

Word you're looking for is "avant-garde."

[Jagos]

http://media.ds.ign.com/media/853/853587/imgs_1.html

Two things...

1) Square just needs to make a lesbian couple as the main characters..
2) This guy is just... *sigh*

I'll just pass on FFXII for now.

[Random Ninja]

....wasn't that what FFX-2 was about? Spunky teenage lesbians that run around solving mysteries in bikinis?

[Fifthfiend]

....wasn't that what FFX-2 was about? Spunky teenage lesbians that run around solving mysteries in bikinis?

You know, I think that about nails it.

On that note, thread closerered.