Final Fantasy 12: RPG of the year, or cheap attempt to make money?

[Gilionaire]

With new ideas like the licensce board, gambits, and the deletion of random battles, how do you think people will react to it?

Yes, I am aware it isnt out yet, but it's good to have an idea of what people already think of it.

I personally am looking foward to the new FF, but I worry they are trying to change it too much. So lets discuss it!

[ElfLad]

After games like Chrono Trigger and SMRPG, random encounters shoudl have been a thing of the past, IMO. That's a good thing.

[Gilionaire]

I do agree that Random Battles were a getting a little boring definetly. I just don't think they should Drift TOO far apart from there roots.

[mauve]

I dunno... the new battle system is interesting, but the characters leave much to be desired. There's a blonde Yuna-lookalike, a Rikku, and a Tidus, along with a Cid Highwind with a shotgun and.... a bunny girl. I probably could have dealt with most of the ripoff characters if I tried hard enough, but Square's losing me with the bunny girl.

That's the one thing that irked me about Dragon Quest 8, too. One of my very few qualms with DQ8.

[Mirai Gen]

After games like Chrono Trigger and SMRPG, random encounters shoudl have been a thing of the past, IMO. That's a good thing.
I SAID FUCK YEAH!

About time someone agrees with me...Fuck random encounters. They should be in DND, where they belong.

[Dwarfburg citizen]

After going through the import all I can say is that I can never go back to random encounters. Its a brilliant game. One word of advice, the bosses are actually challenging again! Some of these guys will wipe the floor with you if your not prepared. As for the gambit system its very enjoyable. Theres even an option that eliminates it completely for those that fear change!

Secret Bosses are humorous but they will god damn rape you.

[CelesJessa]

I am quite looking forward to FF12. I think it's good that they are trying new things with their series and the demo I played was rather fun too. I haven't seen too much of the characters as far as their personalities go, so I can't say if they are ripoff characters or not, but even if they are, I think I will thoroughly enjoy FF12. It's been too long since there's been a Final Fantasy with some kind of (substancial) plot. *coughFFX-2cough*

[The Artist Formerly Known as Hawk]

Personally I'm glad they are changing things. I'm sick of people who complain that FF games these days are no longer set in the rudimentary Medievil settings with crappy random encounters every few steps you take. Get over the bloody random encounters already! They are outdated and annoying and they never made sense to begin with.

I don't know exactly how the Licence board works, but hopefully it will be better than certain upgrade systems that have been used before.

And hooray for hard bosses! At least now I will have to level up to progress and not end up suddenly coming up against one uber hard boss and not be strong enough to kill him!

Also this game will act like a test run for FFXIII, so will have time to fine tune the ideas they are going to be using in that and make XIII even better than it already looks!

[Mondt]

All of your expectations and hopes mean nothing. I'm such a loser, I'll go out and buy it even if people think it's going to suck. Obviously that's not the case but mainly since it's a Final Fantasy, I'd get it.

For example, I own 7-9, beat all three except 8, which I got to the last boss on. Beat 10. Twice. Beat FF1 on FF1&2: DoS. FF2, I haven't beaten yet. FFTA I thought was awesome, but I guess that's because I enver played the first.

Well, the point I'm getting at is, all of the FFs that people think are half-assed or not very good, I like. Note: Not all of the games I mentioned go in that category.

[8-Bit Idiot]

This is the first game that I prepaid for. So if it isn't good, there will be an Orgy of Violence at Square Enix!

And Hawk, which upgrade system were you referring to?

[The Artist Formerly Known as Hawk]

Too be honest, I'm not rightly sure. Having only recently started playing both FF7 and FF8, the jury's still out on each of their respective systems. Both Materia and Junctions mean that any character can use any ability. With Materia, characters become their limit breaks. With Junctions, characters become completely overpowered, and at times it gets fiddly with having to micro-manage which abilities to set for each character. Materia also seems to take AGES to build up and both systems mean you have to keep switching things around everytime you want/need to use another character. Personally I think FFX had the best (and simplest) system so far, but hopefully XII's will be good as well.

[Buddha Fett]

I'm probably going to ride the fence on this one; it could so easily become one of the best or the worst RPGs of all time. I really do hope that they make it work, though.

[steve11]

Honestly the FF series has gone down hill for me since it left the SNES.

FF VI was the pinacle of the series FFVII was cool because it was 3d (though inferior to VI in every other way) but it was still a neat game, after that the series ran off a cliff.

On the "random encounters" TBH FF is a random encounters series, and changing that is silly. There are other square franchises (Chrono Trigger, Seiken Densatsu) that are not random encounter based which they could expand (I'll not they are expanding Seiken) and are just as good (if not better) then the FF series.

[Gilionaire]

I preordered the fancy FFXII in august. The one with the metal case. I am looking foward to it. I hope they have done a good job. They are also making a prequel for it for NintendoDS.

[Lockeownzj00]

Well, the point I'm getting at is, all of the FFs that people think are half-assed or not very good, I like.

While there are a few that are more hotly debated than others...essentially, every Final Fantasy is thought of as 'half-assed' or 'not very good' by someone. Just a heads up.

[Magus]

Well I certainly wouldn't label it as a cheap attempt to make money, they put as much time and effort into it as they have any other Final Fantasy game, probably more what with the enhancement of the graphics and all the thought that went into the License Board and Gambit systems.

I'm sure it'll be just fine, it might not be as good as FFIX but the fact that you can explore has already made me like it more than FFX, an okay game but man was it linear, and not just in choices, you seriously walked in one straight line that entire game. Full 3D is very much appreciated.

As for the characters and universe, I like them a lot, I've always liked the FFT themes of war and revenge and such, and since you can turn off the Gambit system if you don't like it I can't really see why people won't like this at least as much as most of the other FFs. And heck, they're calling the summons Espers again, how oldskool is that?

I love the Esper list, that's like every main boss from the FFT games and half of the regular games. I mean, you can summon Velius (finally properly translated as Belias), that's almost a game seller right there.

Anyway, I think it looks pretty good.

[Regulus Tera]

I love the Esper list, that's like every main boss from the FFT games and half of the regular games. I mean, you can summon Velius (finally properly translated as Belias), that's almost a game seller right there.

And Zeromus, Exdeath, Chaos... oh, and there's also a fight with Gilgamesh! How could I forget that one?

Sincerely, I don't have that much to say about FFXII because I already explained why I think FFXII is God's gift to man. Main reasons?


Yasumi Matsuno (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yasumi Matsuno).

Intelligent AI that actually works when you apply it.

Hitoshi Sakimoto (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hitoshi Sakimoto) and Matsuno (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yasumi Matsuno).

The characters may look like they came out from a j-pop magazine, but you can't not say that the art design is exquisite.

Bunny girls are the hot.

Did I mention Matsuno (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yasumi Matsuno)?


Yeah, I'm a Yazz whore. Bite me.

EDIT: Wanted to point out, if you really want to play the game at the end of the month, refrain absolutely from the internet for... well, about a month. The game was leaked last week, and spoilers are going to be abundant by the time it officially comes out.

[ElfLad]

On the "random encounters" TBH FF is a random encounters series, and changing that is silly. There are other square franchises (Chrono Trigger, Seiken Densatsu) that are not random encounter based which they could expand (I'll not they are expanding Seiken) and are just as good (if not better) then the FF series.

Not if random encounters were never a good thing, only a necessary thing before there was the capability to show enemy sprites on the map.

That's like saying that any Shadows of the Colossus sequel would need a sub-par, uncooperative camera. It doesn't.

[Dwarfburg citizen]

Another impression I got from the import is that Matsuno stalkers/whores (Im looking at YOU Neko) are going to be VERY happy, so happy in fact that Id say your gonna need new pants for your wardrobe on the 31st. The whole thing is a God Damned Matsuno Lovefest. References to Vagrant Story and other Matsuno things abound.

[Regulus Tera]

Citizen, seeing as you have played the import (because I trust you in that you legitimately bought the game, and were not a cheap ass bastard who just downloaded it off da intarwebs you are awesome), what would you say are the game flaws (non-story related, of course)? Almost all of the criticism I hear comes from people who have not played the game, and I would really like to know if something bothered you so much in particular that it may have occured at the dismay of everything else.

[steve11]

Not if random encounters were never a good thing, only a necessary thing before there was the capability to show enemy sprites on the map.

That's like saying that any Shadows of the Colossus sequel would need a sub-par, uncooperative camera. It doesn't.

That makes no sense.

There has always been the ability to have the sprites on the map. Take the 16bit era and tons of RPG's had sprites on the map, but it didn't always work well. Hell even in the 8bit era they had them.

Random encounters was part of what made the original FF games good, and helped create that particular genre of RPG (the J RPG to be specific) taking them out is changing it and it no longer deserves the FF title.

[lazy man]

Well, that's just the thing. It's a title. Every FF game could have had a different title, but Squenix is either too lazy, or they just want the name to attract attention. And I'm getting the feeling it's the latter...

So, with that point, random encounters don't exactly matter in this series. Sure they've been there since the beginning, but that doesn't mean they HAVE to be there. I mean, a LOT of people complain about random encounters. Why keep complaints coming?


Anyway, I think this game might be getting some hope from me. It actually seems like a good RPG, Final Fantasy or not. The gameplay and story BOTH seem interesting enough, meaning there'll actually be enough balance between the two to grab my attention.

Basically, it's lookin' good, and I'm liking.

[Regulus Tera]

Random encounters was part of what made the original FF games good, and helped create that particular genre of RPG (the J RPG to be specific) taking them out is changing it and it no longer deserves the FF title.

Then what characteristics must a game have in order to be called a Final Fantasy? If anything, this series has changed so much since its conception that I'm not sure there is an overarching set of instructions in Square Enix's possession that makes all of the games in the series connected. You could say that "pretty graphics" and "interesting plot" are fundamentals in this saga, but if you think about it, even that was not as important at the roots of the saga (because, seriously, lots of games of the era had a more enthralling plot than FFI).

Besides, although random encounters are obsolete in FFXII, there are still surprise attacks from what I've seen in reviews and videos. Seriously, Dragon Quest VIII was the last time I dealed with random encounters containing battle screen transitions. There's just so much a single man can take of taking two fucking steps and then wham! Random Battle with Random Monsters. It may be changing, but the formula was already overkilled four years ago.

EDIT: It seems kinda funny how the overall population on the intarwebs (or at least the other forums I visit) seems to dislike the Final Fantasy series for being stale and monotonous. However, when some changes are made to the gameplay or story mechanics, immediately everybody rises up with their forks on fire claiming they are going to topple Square Enix monarchy over their money. Curious, yet somewhat cynical if you ask me.

[Tydeus]

Hmmmm... well, from the sound of people who've actually played the game (either through imports or demos), sounds like the gambit system is fun after all. Fuck!

I was soooooooo wanting to hate this game! I got so excited, thinking that Squeenix had finally become so self-indulgent as to repulse most gamers.

Why do I want to hate FFXII? Because I'm an Xbox fanboy, and I also love Japanese RPGs. And I hate that Square doesn't play nice with Microsoft. I don't want to buy a PS3 (FFXIII, which, if FFXII had sucked, would also probably suck), mainly because I like my monies. Sigh. Considering White Knight Story, and FFXIII, I may be forced to -- but not until the price drops. Rrrrrgh.

So, fuck you, Square, for dashing my hopes that Mistwalker Studios would usurp the Japanese RPG throne uncontested.

[The Artist Formerly Known as Hawk]

Well if anyone wants to see how the combat looks, go here. (http://uk.media.ps2.ign.com/media/488/488222/vids_1.html)

Might I specifically recomend the video entitled "Big beasts on the field". As we can see, enemy ambushes are indeed still possibly as shown by the snake creature that attacks them. Not only that but pre-emptives are also still there, as seen by the sleeping enemy they attacked.

I like this combat system. No level-up screen intrusions after every battle. Battles themselves are faster paced and still complex enough so you don't get bored and just keep stabbing the "attack" button until everything lies down, (something which I find myself doing a lot in some FF's lately) and I can't wait to see the summons appear! If I remember correctly, you actually control them directly, which will be brilliant!

[Dwarfburg citizen]

The gambit system is pretty much a double edged sword. Either you can customize it to your exact liking or you can make the game play itself. Either way the Gambit simple can be seen two ways, something fun and simple for those who dont really know it, or the most complex battle system known to man that will make anyone with perfectionist, obsesive compulsive or any type of RPG geek illness either jump for joy or suffer through all its wonders.

[ArlanKels]

All I care about is whether or not it doesn't take two hours to beat. :)

[Daimo Mac, The Blue Light of Hope]

Another impression I got from the import is that Matsuno stalkers/whores (Im looking at YOU Neko) are going to be VERY happy, so happy in fact that Id say your gonna need new pants for your wardrobe on the 31st. The whole thing is a God Damned Matsuno Lovefest. References to Vagrant Story and other Matsuno things abound.

And FFT/TA and FF4 which I am extremely pleased. I have the special edition on pre Order and picking it up on the 31. A Birthday gorts to me.

[Tydeus]

I'm actually considering buying a used PS2 just for the sake of this game. I mean, for one, it's Ivalice (and of course, like everyone else, I loved FFVII -- I know, real original), second, the combat system actually looks quite fun (and everyone says it is), and third, the spell effects are insane. Oh, and, part of the Ivalice thing is that the story looks very intriguing.

EDIT -- I'd probably go get Kingdom Hearts 1 and 2 also, if I got a used PS2. Damn if I don't have a love-hate relationship with Squeenix.

[Gilionaire]

I can't wait to get it. It will definetly be a change. I was actually used to FFX's battle system before the old ones since FFX was the first one I played. So it shouldnt be too big of a change to me.

One thing that does bother me is the fact that they are basing a lot of the game of FFTA. I think they should have been totally original and not have connected it to the GBA game

[Tydeus]

One thing that does bother me is the fact that they are basing a lot of the game of FFTA. I think they should have been totally original and not have connected it to the GBA game

Well, I don't know -- continuity can be a good thing. I mean, remember how exciting it was when Square showed everyone that re-vamped cutscene from FFVII, rendered on a PS3? And, for about two minutes, all you could think about was "Are they making a remake of FFVII? That'd be so cool! Fuck yes! Oh, wait, even better, they're probably making a sequel! Excellent! Cloud is back! Hurrah, big swords, bigger hair, and everything I love about FF!" And then you realized it was just another shameless, half-explained ploy by Sony to get people excited about the PS3 back when there was no reason to be.

Or was that just me?

Either way, I think that tying together the plot of several games can be a good thing, as it allows more room for the plot to grow and become fully-developed.

[videogamerz2000]

Well there's a few things that I have to say about this game:
1. The new license board is probably the greatest system they have thought up yet. Develop a character anyway you want, including their basic stats? Heck yeah.
2.Gambit system. Automate some actions or just freestyle it? Pretty awesome stuff I think.
3. Alot of the game is based off past characters and events in probably the most evolved FF world? Pretty sweet.
And that's all I'm gonna say about that.
XII rocks!

[Coinspinner]

Before even finishing FFX I had decided I would never play a traditional Final Fantasy game again. I have nothing against them or people who like them. I'm just tired of them. There's nothing they can do with the line up and take turns battles to pique my interest again. 30 hour long movies with a combat minigame isn't how I like RPGs either.

But that wonderful bastard Matsuno took charge of FFXII. Inspired by FFXI? I liked that game and occasionally during a 6 hour LFG session I'd have a fervant wish for a single-player version. And it's from the creator of one of my favorite games, FFT. Sign me up.

Well time passes and we finally see more than that one poster with the Bangaa at the bottom. I don't like the character designs. Well, mainly I don't like their clothing. I'm uncomfortable with the ridiculously strong resemblance to Star Wars. The battle system superficially resembles FFXI and other MMORPGs but is essentially an inverted ATB with free movement and no battle screen. I felt totally out of touch with the character I controlled even if I disabled his gambit. /sigh

I still want to play the game, and badly, but I have reservations now. =/

Either way, I think that tying together the plot of several games can be a good thing, as it allows more room for the plot to grow and become fully-developed.

My guess was always that the Ivalice of FFTA was a dreamworld created by the imagination of a kid whose favorite game was FFXII and the power of that old book.

[Magus]

Apparently the original FFT is being somehow connected to FFTA's universe, despite a complete lack of non-human races in FFT. This is the power of the almighty retcon or whatever the heck that crap is called.

[Kroze Gamegod]

Apparently the original FFT is being somehow connected to FFTA's universe, despite a complete lack of non-human races in FFT. This is the power of the almighty retcon or whatever the heck that crap is called.

Well, FFT always took place in Ivalice so TA was always a sequal to it....
About the non-human races, I am sure this takes place in a diffrent section of that world....

[Magus]

Yeah, that's how they're connecting it, the original FFT was before the other continents were discovered along with the other races by the human race or whatever.