Pokemon Umbral Discussion 25: Pokegeddon Returns

[Astral Harmony]

http://www.mangabullet.com/galleryimg/2008/08/09/pokemon_summer_special_by_Kima1835_on_08-08-09-63814.jpeg

And no, their return in the RP is not a good thing for you. Take them seriously when they show up. They're make Phantomere look like a punk.

Anyways, I'll get to the actual post now.

EDIT 1: Sorry about the hurried post. Damn homework. Also, here's something for Matthias...

Matthias' Castform SyncTech has an effect of creating permanent weather, weather that no other effect can change unless he wishes it to. It loses its ability to stay permanent if changed, but hopefully that will strengthen that SyncTech some.

[Dracorion]

Yeah, Pokegeddon doesn't stand a chance.

And Jesus Christ AB, why'd you make Muon talk like that? That's just racist, man.

Got one suggestion: Mollesk's Rock Slide on Pegidash and Altarisect. Moon's pokemon can help out with Pegidash, or we can use Harliette's Mineral Shot. After we down Pegidash, get some Sunny Day all up in their business.

Have Harliette send out Illumise and Wormadam, go nuts on Gardenoir. 4x damage, for the win! Throw in Matthias to seal the deal.

Altarisect takes 4x damage from Ice, so we can use Ice Beam or Focused Blizzard on it. Wilhelmina's Piercing Shot would do 2x damage.

Pierce's Nagarai and Renny's Magnezone can concentrate on Seacalibur, but Aria's Drizzle could be troublesome. Harliette's Charge Shot works too.

Fire attacks on Frossqueen. Pierce's Hellfire if he can build up the RP would be great if it targets Regina, Frossqueen and Altarisect. Also, Wilhelmina's Nether Shot.

And Pierce can do Dragon damage to Altarisect or Ghost damage to Frossqueen with his Trainer Attack.

And I haven't even considered Rachel or the Enforcers!

Would Pierce's flinching Signature Sequence with Chizuru work on Pokegeddon?

[Geminex]

If I had exel on this PC, I'd make a graph of how AWESOME this RP just got. Or I'd try. But I'd fail. Because the magnitude of awesome cannot possibly be calculated by a computer with less than several terabytes of ram.
THAT AWESOME.

Anyway, let's do dis!

Our enemies have 100/100 rage.
We have two scenarios here:
Either, they have standard signature techniques. If so, then it's likely that they'll probably open up with at least a few of said signature techniques.

Or, they're like pokebrids, and they have to paradigm shift to use their uber-techniques. In which case, I'm guessing they'd save their pokeshift, and their techniques, for later in the battle.

I find scenario 1 more likely, which is why I think we should definitely begin defensively. That'll protect us from the first wave of enemy attacks, and it'll give us some time to gather more info. Information is really improtant right now.

And in regards to Drac's question, using the flinch technique would actually have been my plan. Defensive moves. I like your breakdown of their strengths and weaknesses, but, see, last time we split up our damage, and brought a few enemies critically close to death, they pulled full restores out of their ass and healed themselves right back up. And those were just mooks. I'm guessing our foes over here have full restores as well, at the very least. And I don't want them to heal, this time. Don't want it at all.
Hell, they probably even have max revives! Dammit.

Anyway, like I said, caution. We weather their first attacks, find out more, test their defenses. When we know more about them, we open concentrated fire on priority targets, their glass cannons, their supporters. I tried to set our troops up so we had a lot of different types, and that hepled. Anyway, their high-priority targets're gone, we just take them down at our pace. As long as we don't lose anyone important, we'll control the battle.

Sooo... defensive techniques. I have a feeling AB won't let us just flinch them all death (it'd just be too easy otherwise), so any other suggestions for defensive moves? Renny's Co-op remains an option, that might be useful. Protects all-round, we'd definitely be safe, but expensive.

Worst-case scenario, we just send out our enforcers to take the first few hits. Hell, what're they there for, if not cannon fodder?
Though mine has an instant-kill technique. Hmm-hmm.

And I made two major mistakes last battle:
1: Didn't focus fire when I should have
2: Misallocated rage. Moon's power amplifier? Helped us, but was not necessary. Also, Impact's sweep wasn't necessary either.
Ah well. We live and learn.

Oh, and one final thing... Drac already started with the type breakdown. Lemme just continue that:
Gardenoir: Psychic/Dark
Pegidash: Fire/Air
Seacalibur: Water/?
Lopunnish: Normal/Steel
Altarisect: Dragon/Insect
Frosqueen: Ice/?
They all have dual weaknesses, so we should be able to kill them with moderate ease. Depending on what we find out, we should hit Gardenoir first. Losing their leader? Must be bad for morale. And on that note, let's try to keep Impact alive. For the good of the team.

[Dracorion]

Sure, let's try to keep Impact alive. But hey, Tyranitar is pretty happy with his new hammer. Pierce can't be held responsible if Tyranitar goes axe crazy and some teammates, or just one, lose their heads.

According to AB's post, Frossqueen should be Ice/Ghost. Seacalibur should be Water/Steel, supported by the fact that it named itself after Excalibur. Lopunnish according to AB's post should be Normal/Fighting, but it might be Normal/Steel. Either way, we should get it with Fighting moves.

If Pierce's flinching SigSeq won't work on them, I don't think inta-kill would work either.

Also, what I was suggesting was more like who we should hit with what, rather than what we should actually do this turn. Yeah, let's concentrate on a few targets first. Gardenoir and Pegidash are my suggestions.

[Geminex]

Oh, right. I totally missed it where AB mentioned there types. Unless he edited that in after I read it. Nevermind.

I'm guessing the techs won't be utterly ineffective, just less so. Like, 50% chance to flinch, and just major damage, instead of insta-kill.

Hey, AB: Tyranitar's item, the hammer: It stops sandstorm from hitting teammates. Does it also just obscure visibility on our side? Like, will the enemies find it harder to shoot at us, while we can easily shoot at them?

And, y'know, what are these things? Pokebrid/Slayer? Pokemon/Slayer?

[Dracorion]

I think they're rogue Pokemon/Slayers. They're Pokesapiens, not Pokebrids, after all.

Their movesets might also be limited, but I'm not sure. The fact that most of them need weapons might suggest as much, but with all the DNA tampering they've done on themselves they might have overcome silly little things like movesets.

[Menarker]

I'm under the impression that this fight will take longer than normal...

I'm probably going to have Mollesk use Cosmic Power for about 2 turns, to really send his defence and special defense to outer space. Once that's dealt with, Mollesk can use Power Trick to have like 900+ Attack. Rock Slide will do MASSIVE damage to two targets, or a Testament Drive will CRUSH whomever it hits.

If I can get more rage, I can give almost the entire party a Rocket Booster. (Scratch that. I can give everyone a rocket Booster if I had 90 RP. Although if I skip a few people, it'll be a 10 RP cheaper for each person skipped.)

AB: How much rage did our group get from the finishing fight of that last combat? I'm under the impression we should have gotten some when we gave them the smack down! I think I got 15 rage myself due to hitting 3 targets.

As for my second pokemon, I'll probably use Swampert.

I propose we take out the Rapidash first as our target. Once she's out of the picture, we'll be safe to send out Steel types without having to worry about fire types that much. And every one of us trainers (except for Charlotte at the moment) has a steel type.

[Dracorion]

I'm under the impression that this fight will take longer than normal...

Yeah, you'd think so. But I think he also intended the Lexhur fight to take longer, and look how that turned out.

Thinking outside the box is nice and all, but we need to know what these baddies are capable of first.

[Geminex]

If anything, I'd want it to obscure only our side (so we get the evasion bonus), but damage only theirs.
BECAUSE THAT'S PERFECTLY LOGICAL SHUT UP THAT'S TOTALLY HOW PHYSICS WORK

And I don't think they "need" weapons, I think they "want to kick more ass by using" weapons.

And I think they are beyond movesets, I could imagine them just having the same move selection that a level-1 pokebrid does, with some custom moves thrown in. But they'd be able to choose from a whole moveset, is what I mean.

I wonder who created them?

Oh god, I just realized. I'm coming face-to-face with my greatest weakness.
The I-might-need-it-later syndrome. It's the reason I went through the original half-life using only a pistol. It's why I never use rare candies.
I'm really, really apt, given a one-time resource, to utterly refuse to use said resource, because I desparately try to find ways to overcome challenges without using said resources. In this case, rage. I'll try to fight it, but I'm thinking that I could give Renny control over our support classes, and Pierce control over our rage usage.

Edit:
And Menarker... I really wouldn't encourage usage of Mollesk too much, yet. These are very quick, brutal battles. 2 Cosmic power, + trick room will take three turns. Until then we've already won or lost.

Oh, and AB:
I sense a disturbance in the balance.
Cause, see, Slayers have 1 slot, for themselves. Trainers have 2 slots. For two pokemon.
That alone means that trainers get twice the rage, since they get to attack twice as often as Slayers, and're more likely to get attacked. Not to mention that when they use a technique that'd otherwise take an attack, they only have to give up one pokemon's attack, and can still the other. Is it going to be standard for trainers to have two slots? Cause, if so, can we somehow find a way to give Slayers better rage generation? Just... balance things out a bit?

[Dracorion]

You shouldn't give me control over our Rage usage. I can't be bothered to keep track of it all.

I'd fuck that shit up bad.

I wonder who created them?

I wanted Pierce to be confident in the team's ability to kick their asses, but I think I'll have him play nice long enough to ask this question.

[Menarker]

I'd take care of it. I have to deal with the rocket boosting the party anyhow! I'm working intimately with it already. And both of my techniques involve math with them... Granted, it's simple adding, but with tons of people in the party, one can always screw up.

Pierce: Did you do a Trainer Attack in the last round? If so +15 rage. If not, +10 RP (Up to 70-75)
Impact: +5. No rage gain for the second one since you spent rage to use Sweep. -25 RP (Down to 35)
Renny: +15 RP (3 hits) (Up to 80)
Charlotte: Did you do a Trainer Attack in the last round? If so, +10 rage. If not, +5. (Up to 65-70)
Matthias: +5 (55)
Harriette: +10 (one pokemon attacked and that is doubled) (70)
Moon: +15 (3 hits) (15)
Rachel: +5 (60)
Wilhelmina: +5 (60)

[Geminex]

How bout this: I do the evaluating, you make the calls. It's less that I don't trust my assessment of the situation, and more that I just don't trust my own judgement, due to my history of hoarding power-ups.

Anyway, I'll wait for a reply to my edit, then I'm off to bed.

Edit:
Impact: No rage gain since you spent rage to use Sweep. -25 RP

I don't think that applies. Or, at least it shouldn't. I'm annoyed at having used it anyway, I'd like to at least gain the rage for 1 attack, if not 2.

[Dracorion]

I'd really rather not have anything to do with Rage. I'd either always use 'em or never use 'em.

Menarker, I think you're confused. Our collective RPs went back to 50. Because this is a new battle. Everyone is healed too.

[Menarker]

I'm just following AB rule. No RP gain for attacks for which you spent rage. Although your first attack was your normal one. I guess you get 5 rage at most.



Battle SITREP

- All Rage is carried over from previous battle. No Rage is added if below 50/100. All enemies seem to have 100/100 Rage.
- No Fog of War.
- Both Morale Integrity Values are at 100%.
- The Watchmen have been fully healed.
- The Watchmen have initiative.
- Battle BGM is "Resonance" (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3l5nxTWDc5Y) by TM Resolution for the Soul Eater anime.


Not confused at all. I actually read carefully. It's true we all got healed, but rage is not set back to 50.

Also, to respond to a few posts above regarding Mollesk, AB said these guys would make Phantomere look like a punk. It's bound to take several rounds. Plus, it makes Mollesk more likely to survive being hit while gaining rage in the process.

[Geminex]

I'm just following AB rule. No RP gain for attacks for which you spent rage.
Fair enough. I'd usually argue that Sweep is just an enhancement to my normal attack, instead of a technique that exists on its own, and that I should get ten rage, but I'm willing to hold back for now. I'm hoping AB replies to my question regarding Slayer rage. And I'm hoping that when Slayer rage generation gets doubled, that'll also apply retroactively. Or we halve the cost of all of Impact's techniques. Yeah, that'd be cool.
...

And wait a second, are you giving yourselves RPs for trainer attacks?
Ah well, we could use the RPs. I won't protest, for now. But if we're using it, the enemies'll use it. And fuck, they're trainer attacks. You should have to pay rage to use them, not get rage.

[Menarker]

Well, I edited by giving you 5 rage for the first attack, since I counted sweep as an additional attack and not some sort of enhancement.

Well, technicically, I haven't done a single Trainer Attack myself in the entire RP. Heck, they aren't even mentioned in AB's database.

[Dracorion]

Pretty sure they are in the trainer upgrades section.

Also yeah, I misunderstood.

[Menarker]

Oh, now I see it. It isn't called Trainer Attack though, so I couldn't find it with Ctrl F. But it's a level 3 trainer benefit. But yeah, no RP cost for that and it's a free action, so gaining Rage from that is ok.

EDIT: And I noticed that Muon's Milk of Plenty ability only affects Pokemon. >_> AB doesn't want us to accidently close down this RP. :3

[Dracorion]

Y'know, Aria is a pokemon.

Just sayin'.

Also, if Pierce did a Trainer Attack then he now has 80 Rage. If Shizuka was anywhere near, he could unleash some appley goodness. But hey, two turns from now he can do Hellfire instead.

[Menarker]

Where did that extra 5 rage come from? AB posted that you had 60 rage because you started at 50 and both your pokemon attacked. But nothing was mentioned about you doing a trainer attack or getting hurt.

Not that it matters too much. If I do the Rocket Party Booster thing, you'll get to 100 with 75 rage.

Also, Drac, AB said that the Gal-Techs don't NEED the girls to be in the same battle. It's like a move that you're inspired to learn that you can do it passably by yourself, but do it easier when they are there helping you out (cost split).

[Dracorion]

Yes, actually, there was. Right there at the end of AB's synopsis.

[Menarker]

Main Formation Battle (Ally Phase)
- Pierce: Charizard has taken severe damage. Medic has taken severe damage. Ally Blaziken has taken 1/3 damage from Flare Blitz. 60 Rage.

Not from what I'm seeing. All I see is the above from the first round, the fact that you got 15 rage if you did a trainer attack during the second round and that fact that rage carried over to this fight. 60 + 15 = 75 max.

And I'm guessing that the axe guy and the snakesword girl that Major Grant hired might very well be the guy who is supposed to be holding Dialga and Discord. Just a wild guess here though. ^^;

[Dracorion]

Sigh.

Main Formation Battle (Ally Phase)
- Moon: Used "Construct Power Amplifier". All Allies SpAttack Up +2. Soldier C has taken severe damage. 0 Rage.
- Matthias: Sunny Day is now in effect. 50/100 Rage.
- Pierce: Charizard has taken severe damage. Medic has taken severe damage. Ally Blaziken has taken 1/3 damage from Flare Blitz. 60 Rage.
- Rachel: Charizard is now paralyzed. Medic has been defeated. 55 Rage.
- Impact: Engineer has taken great damage. 55 Rage.
- Charlotte: Soldier A has taken severe damage. 60 Rage.
- Renny: Infernape has taken great damage. Infernape is flinching. Enemy Blaziken has taken great damage. Enemy Blaziken is flinching. 65 Rage.
- Wilhelmina: Engineer has taken critical damage.
- Harliette: Typhlosion is now asleep. Soldier B has taken great damage. Soldier B is now poisoned. Engineer has been defeated. 60 Rage.
- Trainer Attacks: Soldier D has taken good damage. All participating Trainers Rage increased by 5.

What's that right there at the end?

Oh, yeah.

Anyway, Impact should switch to Siege Boomerang, go apeshit on Gardenoir. Supported by Matthias and Harliette's pokemon.

[Menarker]

Your post before that never actually said you were Trainer Attacking. You only declared pokemon attacks. Not that it matters to me at any rate, for the reason I said above.

And I still think we shouldn't spread the damage too much. Probably focus on two of them at most, since these pokebrids are bound to be tougher than the soldiers. I'd suggest attacking the Rapidash and the Frolass since that's what Charlotte is doing already. Plus it'll help with any steel types or grass types we need to send out.

[Dracorion]

And I'm guessing that the axe guy and the snakesword girl that Major Grant hired might very well be the guy who is supposed to be holding Dialga and Discord. Just a wild guess here though. ^^;

No, Discord has my Dialga. THe other guy probably has Palkia.

Your post before that never actually said you were Trainer Attacking. You only declared pokemon attacks. Not that it matters to me at any rate, for the reason I said above.

No one stated they were Trainer Attacking that turn because we didn't know we could. It was assumed that we did.

And I still think we shouldn't spread the damage too much. Probably focus on two of them at most, since these pokebrids are bound to be tougher than the soldiers. I'd suggest attacking the Rapidash and the Frolass since that's what Charlotte is doing already. Plus it'll help with any steel types or grass types we need to send out.

I think we can handle three targets. Let me demonstrate:

Gardenoir: Impact's Siege Boomerang, Matthias' attack, Harliette's pokemons' attacks. Four 4x damage attacks.
Frossqueen: Sol-Leks' Overheat, Blaziken's Overheat, Pierce's Trainer Attack. Rachel's Pokemon can do Steel-type attacks for 2x damage. All in all, that's four 2x damage attacks and Pierce's trainer attack.
Pegidash: Hammond's Stone Edge, Tyranitar's Stone Edge, Mollesk's Rock Slide, Harliette's Mineral Shot. That's four 4x damage attacks.
Altarisect: Secondary target from Mollesk's Rock Slide. No matter.

That leaves Moon and Wilhelmina unassigned. Wilhelmina's Nether Shot can do 2x damage to Frossqueen. Moon's Lanturn can use Signal Beam for 4x damage on Gardenoir.

I can see Pegidash definitely down. Gardenoir probably. Frossqueen critically damaged. Keep in mind Moon still has an extra pokemon.

Matthias could Paradigm Shift, just to make sure Gardenoir goes down.

[Menarker]

I'm not using Mollesk's Rock Slide. Not yet! While he's legendary, his attack stat is at the moment only average compared to the other pokemons (100), and Rock Slide is weaken when it is divided between foes, even with STAB.

Swampert is attacking with Waterfall for Super Effective damage though.

Also, Siege Boomerang is a ROCK weapon. How is that quad effective on Gardenoir, or even Super Effective?

[Dracorion]

What the hell do you mean weakened when it's divided? It's a multi-target attack by default!

Regina's still got six pokemon that she'll presumably be using to replace the other members of Pokegeddon as they go down.

Fine, whatever, do as you will. Just keep in mind that you might have to edit your post if we decide you should do something else. I still find it ridiculous how you like to play it defensive. I mean, there's nothing wrong with a little defense, but spending two turns to boost Mollesk's already astronomical defense stats is too much.

[Menarker]

AB said that multi-hit attacks like Earthquake and Rock Slide get weaken to 75% of their normal power when they are used in a group battle instead of a 1 vs 1 battle.

And don't tell me about having to edit my post. Mollesk works best with a few pumps. He's defensive by nature and need a bit of time to be effective if he goes on the offence. Renny's combat style isn't the same as "Spam attack moves until foe is dead."

Regina's pokemon as far as I remember are all unevolved pokemons of the same type the pokegeddon's are. Goldeen, Ralts and all that. At least that's how it was in the Omake they all appeared in.

We could move Impact to use Siege Boomerang on Pegidash for quad and Swampert to hit Frosqueen for double damage with Hammer Arm.
That way, two of the 'Geddons" are quite highly likely to go down, and Gardenoir heavily weaken.

[Dracorion]

Buh, I don't remember that rule. It's silly, anyway. Multi-target attacks shouldn't deal reduced damage specifically because they're made to hit two targets.

I control my own pokemon

You're probably joking, but hell, I'm going to snap at you anyway: You don't get to bitch at me for remarking about putting you in the corner of the formation to minimize your Rage Point generation, which you argued would be better for the team, and then refuse to adapt to whatever better strategy we come up with, which would also be good for the team.

You do have more pokemon than Mollesk. Magnezone, for example. Pegidash is probably going down anyway. And even then, Magnezone can take one little super-effective hit.

If I remember correctly, Siege Boomerang is the one that does Bug-type damage. So Impact could use it on Pegidash. For 1/4 damage.

You'd think so, Menarker. But then, the Pokegeddon Pokesapiens weren't DNA spliced in the omakes. I'm guessing Regina's pokemon are now fully evolved.

EDIT: Bah, stop editing your posts. We want Gardenoir dead as soon as possible. As soon as possible being this turn.

[Menarker]

Swarm Bow is the Bug weapon! Read the database again before you post! Siege is Rock!

My pokemon team build isn't built to be all out offensive, especially with moves like Follow Me, Cosmic Power, Psych Up, Helping Hand. Naturally I'll snap at you if you try to force a square peg down a round hole. You can advise on what would be a good idea, since you got most of the battle plan down pretty good. But my pokemons don't follow the same gameplan as the rest, especially since I'm planning several turns in advance with Mollesk's Defender's Crest, Rage for Renny's special abilities and all that.

[Dracorion]

Ah, screw it. Yeah, Swarm Bow is the Bug-type weapon. Have Impact use Swarm Bow on Gardenoir.

And I'm not arguing with you anymore. Spending three turns to buff your Mollesk isn't worth it in my opinion.

[Menarker]

It doesn't have to be three turns of Cosmic Power. Two turns of it, and then Defender's Crest Activate turn after for Power Trick and OMGWTF Rock Slide is plausible. Even more so when I send Umbreon out that turn, use Psych Up, and HOLYSHIT Assurance damage the next turn.

The plan may start slow, but it's damn hard to stop once it gets moving.

Gardenoir: Impact's Swarm Bow, Matthias' attack, Harliette's pokemon's bug type attacks. Moon's Lanturn's Signal Beam

Frossqueen: Sol-Leks' Overheat, Blaziken's Overheat, Rachel's pokemon's steel type attacks. Wilhelmina. Pierce's Trainer Attack.

Pegidash: Hammond's Stone Edge, Tyranitar's Stone Edge, Swampert's Waterfall, Harliette's Mineral Shot, Moon's Kingdra Hydro Pump

Battle plan overall like this then?

[Astral Harmony]

Mornin', you Pokemaniacs.

If I was really racist, I would've had Muon ask you guys if you had some fried chicken and purple drink. But I will tone it down in the future, regardless.

Like I put it when I introduced the characters, the scouters don't have any real data on them. There's no telling what's going to work and what's not going to work. You're going to have to take risks on these guys.

Tyranitar's hammer should prevent sandstorm from obscuring the Sniper's vision.

That's right, Menarker. Add the Rage you've gotten from when the enemy fled to bring you up to your new total.

It will probably always be two Pokemon. There's always going to be an imbalance. I tried to correct it through Vengeful Rage. I'll just have to figure out something in the future. Slayers and Pokebrids will both likely get double Rage as an upgrade.

Anyways, I gotta get ready for work soon.

[Dracorion]

Remember that Psych Up only gives you half the boost.

And we really need to specify just how limited your Defender's Crest is. I realize you can't use it to deal direct damage, but what about stuff like Toxic or Hail? I don't like it. Using two moves in one turn just feels wrong.

Yeah, the battle plan is pretty much like that. Throw in Charlotte's Trainer Attack at Gardenoir. Part of me wants to throw in another attack at Gardenoir, but we don't have any to spare without pulling someone away or having Moon create an Evolith. Eh, five quad-effective attacks and Charlotte's Trainer Attack will just have to do. Though maybe Rachel can use an X Special Attack or something on Impact.

Forgot about this:

Also, Drac, AB said that the Gal-Techs don't NEED the girls to be in the same battle. It's like a move that you're inspired to learn that you can do it passably by yourself, but do it easier when they are there helping you out (cost split).

Sure, but I think the girls need to be somewhere in the vicinity, not chilling way over in Fahngrest Ruins. I mean, Pierce is going to pull a shower of apples out of his ass? He doesn't have magic netherworld powers to do that!

[Menarker]

Wasn't the half boost for Psych Up limited for when you're not using it on your own pokemons or your foes?

Defender Crest doesn't need any more nerfing, period. AB already had it approved for 2 turns and Gem insisted it be 3 turns, and I relented, but I'm not taking any more of that. I mean, you keep on telling me that Mollesk having to spend 3 turns buffing is utterly useless. And now you say that 1 move more in that time frame is excessive? Among the 12ish attacks that is done by the entire group of trainers and slayers every turn, is one extra attack every 3 turns really that game breaking? I'd think not, and AB doesn't think so either, even when it was 2 turns.

Frankly, in regards to the Gal-Tech, I was more worried about Impact Pierce having to flash our opponents if Chizuru was back in Fangrest's Ruin. >_> It's not my fault that you chose to build the move so as Impact Pierce had to somehow imitate something only they can do... or do plausibly without wanting us to gouge our eyes out.

Moon has pretty much no rage atm. Doubt he can do an evolith.

And AB's rule is that Rachel (or any other trainer) can't use an item if two of their pokemons are attacking. If she does, one of the pokemons have to forfeit their move.

[Dracorion]

Yeah yeah, fair enough. I'd just like to point out that AB is usually playing a game and watching porn while writing up replies.

And no one ever said Impact why'd you have to bring Impact into iT AUGH MY EYES WHERE'S THE BRAIN BLEACH

[Menarker]

Sorry! I meant Pierce, Hehehehehe...

[Dracorion]

Fuck you.

Now I'm going to make sure that Renny never gets laid. Even if it means force-feeding him a Magatama so he stays sixteen forever.

Wasn't the half boost for Psych Up limited for when you're not using it on your own pokemons or your foes?

Pretty sure it's just foes. Because allies can just give a stat boost to one of your pokemon and then you can have your other pokemon Psych Up.

[Menarker]

How? There are no moves that give stat boosts to someone else except for Baton Pass (And the random Accupressure), and that's only when the person using Baton Pass has survived long enough with those stats in question on them already.

Main reason that Psych Up was thought to be an issue was because I managed to use it with Belly Drum, although it was risky as hell and it only available on few pokemons. Plus it required one of my pokemons to be knocked out in the effort of protecting the Drummer when his health was cut in half and everything was trying to kill it. None of us (as far as I know) have that move available now, so time delay is an issue now when trying to buff up, because even with Mollesk, it would take 3 turns just to buff Cosmic Power to Max.

[Dracorion]

Well, let's see... there's items like X Attack and junk. Couple that with your Signature Sequence with Lola.

Also, Engineer skills.

[Menarker]

Engineer's work differently I think. It's an aura, and not so much a "stick and apply enchantment". If Mollesk tried to use Power Trick while being in a Defense boost like Mirror's, the boost to attack (leaving only his base defense as his attack) would disappear because it never actually stayed "stuck" to Mollesk as a defense boost. Mollesk will continue to have a defense boost due to the aura, but using the base attack stat that was swapped instead.
Otherwise, I would send Mollesk out, have a +4 boost to Defence due to his Simple Nature, Power Trick so that boost applies to his attack, while his new defence got boosted by 4 too. (I doubt you'd approve of that)

With buff items, first there is a limited supply of items. Too many of them and you don't have revive or restore items to recover from the damage that one takes. Also, items by far only have 1 stage boosts. We don't even have 2 stage boost items (and the foes have 3 stage versions combined with Full Restore as a comparision) We'd need Dormond to get 2 stage boosts, and even then, that's pretty low power considering it takes up item slots. If someone intends to use a plan that rely on those items, he/she should be rewarded for using them, considering the risk of running low on healing items.
As for mentioning Lola's tech, Psych Up doesn't consider how many people have the buff. It only cares about the buffs on the one single person and how high it is. Spreading it around does no better than applying it on one person. Psych Up/Baton Pass works when the buffs are focused hard on a single target.

[Dracorion]

So basically, we should only have Psych Up give half the boost when someone has Belly Drum.

Listen dude, couple Dormond's ability with your Mollesk's Simple ability. And no, they shouldn't be rewarded. I thought you preferred winning by using a strategy other than "kill them until their die". Which obscene Psych Up-induced boosts would be, except for taking a turn to buff up.

[Menarker]

Technically, it would probably take the several turns needed to buff up in the process before Psych Up is used. Also, the other main issue with Psych Up at the time was that it was used by the Pokebrids who knew it, and not by pokemons who invested in a move slot for it.

Dormond, as much as I like his character, is not that good a choice for a healer. He encourages the use of buff items, when healing items tend to be the more cruical items required that we need to stock up on with a party as big as ours. Yes, combining him with Mollesk is a combo of sort, but when compared to benefit of the party in general, choosing him is not as effective as Rachel for this mission for example or Lola or Chizuru for their most effective healing purpose.

Also, you're misunderstanding the part of Renny's tactic. All our battles is about "Kill them until they die or flee" to a certain extent. Pokemon battles ultimately have to end with knocking someone out. How is it done is different from trainers to trainers. Some like you and Charlotte so far, use powerful moves right off the bat so the opposing foes don't get time to react fast or buff (mainly useful for glass cannons and foes that need time to buff up attack or some sort of set up. Especially if your team is varied enough to have good type coverage) Others might use a slightly delayed version by buffing up so they can deal with the big-brutes which have power and defence and such, sacrificing speed for survival and reliablility. Some uses status effects. Some use trapping (Spikes, Stealth Rock) and there are other stuff too. Renny has a few of most of these. Swampert is straight out fighter for the most part. Magnezone too although with a bit of paralysis. Togekiss offers support and has flinching with a bit of power. Shaymin does likewise. Umbreon is based on status and support. Mollesk can passably function as an attacker, but his main function is the Buff-Brute, where he can use defence/special defence to lower attacks to a scratch, use Recover when things go bad, and attack powerfully when the situation looks right, with Togekiss to use Follow Me or Umbreon's Confuse ray to muck up their attacks, reducing their chance of actually hitting him. Renny exercises a sort of variety, and not all of them function in the same way. Variety in type. Variety in support. Variety in tactics. That sort of thing.

[Dracorion]

You can also carry your own items. And you can use one as a free action if you only have one pokemon on the field.

[Menarker]

Well, in the big battle during Renny's Sidequest, all the items were healing stuff, and we still ran out. If some of them were buff items, chances are the party could have lost. (And that's taking the fact that the Psych Up tactic was used then). I'm trying to make a point that choosing to invest in buff items means sacrificing Healing items. Granted, with Renny's new ability, it's not as big a sacrifice as it was before, but it's still a big deal to think about how to proportion how many of each.

With items, a trainer/slayer can use them without using up a moveslot or taking up their action (Trainers can do one attack if using one). But they are limited in supply

Buffs from a move are unlimited therotically, but only apply to that pokemon normally, require a moveslot for that specific buff, another move if you want to transfer it over, don't get to attack that turn if you use it, and risk losing it all if you get knocked out before you can use the benefits of the buffs.

It's a sort of balancing which is suitable for the situation and which didn't. When I did it at Renny's Party, the end result was that Snorlax and Togekiss got knocked out, and two of the opponent's foes got knocked out. Dormond got the buff as well. So the actual advantage was average at best. Both side lost the same number of pokemons, and the only other advantage was that Dormond still had the buff. If Snorlax actually managed to last longer, it would have been better, but he was ganged up, and the end result was that the entire combo left the party only slightly better off than they were before.

[Dracorion]

Clearly, you didn't play it defensively enough.

If Psych Up isn't worth using like you seem to be saying, then why do you want to use it?

[Menarker]

It's a risk that was made. I still came out ahead, but things could have gotten much worse. (Also, the benefit of Dormond's power boost was on your side because I sent him your way. If he stayed in my location, I probably would have seen a bigger reward.)

Also, like you said, it wasn't defensive at the time. The previous attempt was a fast risky powerful boost meant to not only knock down some trouble pokemons, but also shoot down their morale gauge. (Now that I think of it, there was additional rewards of making them flee faster due to that, but it required care and building up on) Snorlax attack stat DID go up, but its defense didn't. So it was a high chance that he would be knocked out sooner if not later (mainly because foes would jump at the chance to off him)

This time, Defense is being amped up (at first anyhow). Knocking Mollesk will be damn difficult to achieve and thus the benefits will last longer, even after using Power Trick. Same after using Psych Up with Umbreon (The second strongest defensive powerhouse). The defensive boost will help ensure that the benefits last longer and that the eventual rewards be plentiful if I watch my steps carefully.

[Dracorion]

Wouldn't Mollesk's Defense be reduced to 100? If that's not enough Attack, I can't see why it'd suddenly be enough Defense.

Mollesk would get one attack before being assraped.

[Menarker]

Attached to a 75 power move that is further weakened to 75% of its power due to the rules of multi-pokemon battles, 100 Attack isn't that good.

100 Defence however is akin to the defence of Blastoise, Palkia, Slaking and other powerhouses.
Plus, Mollesk has:
High Hitpoints (118, which is absurdly high. Arceus only has 120 and there are few pokemons that hit hitpoints that high without sacrificing other stats. Only 14 evolved pokemons that exist in the game has hitpoint stat above 118.)
Recover to restore half its hitpoints (and as mentioned above, it has tons)
Renny with either the item spread ability or the protect ability.
A fellow pokemon with Follow Me.
The defender item which let it cast Recover for free every 3 turns.
It can double its defence again after Power Trick.

Basically, Attack/Special Attack NEEDS to scale much higher because it has to compete with both the DEF/SDEF AND the hitpoint stat at the same time. Also a pokemon can only attack once a turn, but in a group battle like this RP, a pokemon can be hit multiple times. High hitpoints and defence help mitigate this.
Mollesk would have innately HIGH Special defence and hitpoints, and his defence, even after lowering it with power Trick is still almost as high as the most respected legendary, Arecus.

*Goes to grab a video...*

[Dracorion]

And you don't think that's wrong.

Anyway, didn't you say you'd be using Psych Up with Umbreon? So you'd get a choice of, A) having two powerhouses, or B) have Togekiss use Follow Me.

You said before that Mollesk's Defense and Sp. Def would be raised to 900 with two turns of Cosmic Power. Which is wrong. It'd only get 690. You could use Cosmic Power for three turns straight and then use Power Trick as your extra move, though. But I'd probably get pissed at you spending yet another turn not attacking.

Also, I'm pretty sure Umbreon's Defense would be reduced as well if it uses Psych Up. Since, y'know, Psych Up copies debuffs and Mollesk's Defense going from 690 to 100 is a pretty big debuff. If we treat it like Umbreon got two +2 stage defense boosts and then used Power Trick, it's Defense would be reduced to 65, which is as much as Snorlax had and you know how that turned out.

So pokemon can only attack once a turn and can be attacked themselves several times. That's why you get allies. I don't think Renny's the kind of guy that would use the team as meatshields while he builds himself into a one-man army.

[Geminex]

Could we... stop the Psych-Up discussion? I was under the impression that what we agreed on was that, if you used it on an ally, any ally, the benefits get halved (rounded down). If you use it on an enemy, you get the full effects. I think that's, if anything, still a bit imbalanced, but you all know my stance on psych-up. As it is, unless AB doesn't veto its use, we can't do anything against it, and I don't wanna annoy AB with something that trivial.

In regards to Menarker's strategy: The way this game has developed, its become very quick and violent. I like that, actually.
And the reason it's become quick and violent is less the fact that we can kill all our opponents much more quickly (our numbers are usually equal, and our offensive power is proportional to their defense, usually), but because we can kill individual opponents more quickly. We can look at the enemy formation, select the most valuable targets and focus fire on those. The most important elements of the enemy force, their glass cannons, their supporters, they usually get eliminated within a turn or two. And when that's done, then, barring reinforcements, the battle's either won or lost. And even with enemy reinforcements, once the main formation has been broken up, it's not too hard to deal with reinforcements as they come.

Anyway, my point is that, even when battles take longer, they usually get decided quite early.
Not to mention that Drac's right: Mollesk can, and, mostly likely, will get focus-fired. 100 defense is fine when it's insignificant. But when it has huge attack? It's going to die quite horribly, quite quickly. Mollesk would be a great mon in 1v1 battles, but on the battlefield? Not so much.

But all those points are mere specks of relevance compared to the topic of WHAT THE FUCK WHY YOU POST.
Also
WHAT THE FUCK WHY YOU NOT FOCUS FIRE

Honestly, people.
a) what the hell happened to defensive play
b) did you read what I wrote about their use of items? It explicitely says that Regina has "unidentifiable items".

Ooh, look at us, we're PATCA, and we just loooove seeing the pokemon we damaged get healed right back up again, because focus fire? What's that?

God.
Also, lemme repost Impact's weapon list:
Light:
Claws of Darkness, Strange Parasite
Medium:
Ricewood Rifle, HV rifle
Heavy:
Flamethrower, LH launcher

I can do Ice damage, I could focus down on Altarisect. Probably freeze her too. We can probably do a lot of damage this turn. Probably even enough to kill one or two enemies. But we'd actually have to coordinate to do said damage, not just attack whomever we feel like. God.

Oh, and does anyone remember what attributes Ruin type has? Because I could also kill Lopunnish real easily.

[Menarker]

This video shows a level 100 Shuckle being hit by a level 100 Groudon's Earthquake without having done any buffing. Now, keep in mind that Shuckle only has 20 base hitpoints.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hY8S2DA1na0

Also, I was using the base stats as an example as a comparision to all our pokemons. In comparision, Mollesk's DEF and Special Defence and hitpoints are higher than what it shows. Because the base stats that you see in Bulbapedia and Serebii are measured at when a pokemon is level 50. So when I say 230 DEF and SDEF, that's when comparing equal level pokemons at level 50. So technically, Mollesk can hit the 800-900 region sooner as he goes up in level, only needing around 2 Cosmic Power to get around there... (And PATCA's pokemons are around level 70s-80ish?) And I was doing the math with neutral nature stat. It'd be faster/higher with beneficial nature, which AB said might be part of the Pokemon Breeder thing.

http://www.serebii.net/pokedex-dp/213.shtml

As for the Umbreon, I know first hand that it would have 65 DEF if I copied Power Trick. But I could copy the first two Cosmic Power, before I do the Power Trick/Rock Slide thing, then Umbreon would be defensive and focus on confuse ray and recover without dropping in defence. Or if I felt I could manage Follow Me (which Mollesk has) or use Renny's Protect, I have the option of letting Umbreon copy Power Trick for an additional attacker. The options are open if I plan carefully. ^,^

It's not a pancea, but the plan can be switched around and altered based on the changing situation.


EDIT: Gem, in regards to your post, what's wrong with my post? Drac and I had a plan there posted earlier. 5 attackers for each of the 3 targets. There is plenty of focus fire involved. So I have Mollesk do a little buffing in case things go wrong? Still plenty of focus fire involved.

Also, AB said that Lopunnish MIGHT have fighting type. It's not certain. So a ruin weapon is a good idea, but not certain to work as you hope.

Also, their defensive ability is NOT proportional to our offense if we have to pile 3-4 Quad effective attacks to knock them out.

[Dracorion]

Hey man, I posted a strategy. It focused fire on three targets. Then Menarker fucked it up by insisting on being an anal nutbag. But if we want by my strategy, two baddies would have died and one would've been left critically damaged so we could see what kinda items they got.

Also, we posted because we didn't want what happened last turn to happen now. Which is no one posted.

I think Ruin-type does quad damage to Fighting.

Also, I could've sworn AB said that Slayers could switch weapons whenever they wanted, Gem. So you should be able to switch to Swarm Bow, no problem.

Menarker, Mollesk's Defense and Special Defense base stats are 230 and those don't change. It's like saying a Pokemon with 680 base stats gets more when it levels up!

Well Menarker, they are mutated Pokesapiens, so it comes to reason they have buffed up defenses. It's proportional because we have the advantage of numbers and no super-pokemon.

[Geminex]

EDIT: Gem, in regards to your post, what's wrong with my post? Drac and I had a plan there posted earlier. 5 attackers for each of the 3 targets. There is plenty of focus fire.
Oh? Fair enough, I must've missed that.
I'll look at it in a second. BUT.
...

Lemme put it this way:
These characters have sort-of featured in Omakes. AB cut the previous battle short, just so we could get to this one more quickly. AB said that these enemies would make one of our previous battles, probably our hardest battle to date (I'd say) look easy.
I do not think that AB would let us kill even one of them without heroic efforts. Much less three.
This is a game, people. Get into the mind of the GM.

Edit:
Also, I could've sworn AB said that Slayers could switch weapons whenever they wanted, Gem. So you should be able to switch to Swarm Bow, no problem.
Can you find said post? Because if so, then why the hell did he increase the Slayer limit to 6 weapons?

Also, their defensive ability is NOT proportional to our offense if we have to pile 3-4 Quad effective attacks to knock them out.
'fcourse it is. Considering the ease with which we can lay down quad-effective attacks, plus our numerical advantage. And that's just assuming that they go down after a few attacks, which I doubt.

[Menarker]

Hey man, I posted a strategy. It focused fire on three targets. Then Menarker fucked it up by insisting on being an anal nutbag. But if we want by my strategy, two baddies would have died and one would've been left critically damaged so we could see what kinda items they got.

Menarker, Mollesk's Defense and Special Defense base stats are 230 and those don't change. It's like saying a Pokemon with 680 base stats gets more when it levels up!


Well, you are insisting on a subpar tactic on my pokemon. Renny's Mollesk is not a primary fighter on the first turn. I had Swampert join in on the focus fire. Plus Gem said to "play defensively". Did that by having one attacker for focus fire and the other buffing up defensively, planning for long term if anything happens. No need to be verbally abusive. I just showing my point of view on how my team works best. I don't sling slurs in your direction.

And yes, all the stats including Defence and Special Defence change (Unless you're Shedninja with hitpoints locked in at 1). Look at the link I posted. EV make the stats go higher than 230. It could go as high as 614 with benefiical nature.

[Dracorion]

Man, my plan involved five quad-effective attacks aimed at Gardenoir. That's goddamn heroic right there.

And Menarker, I'm pretty sure the reason the Shuckle in that video survived Earthquake is because it only takes neutral damage from Ground and because Legendaries suck.

Yes yes fine, they could change, but I think it's a liiiittle too much to assume that they'd change so much as to go from 690 to 900.

And I add slurs for color.

Can you find said post? Because if so, then why the hell did he increase the Slayer limit to 6 weapons?

Thinking back, I think it may have been before the BTS.

Hey AB, can Slayers still switch weapons whenever they want?

[Menarker]

Groudon: Level 100. 150 Attack (one of the god damn highest possible). Earthquake (One of the most powerful Ground type moves ever). STAB bonus.

For that purpose, Groudon does NOT suck.

Shuckle: Level 100 Only 20 base stat for hitpoints (unless it was EV trained for it). Only neutral for resistance. NO BUFFING at the time of attack.

Despite this, Shuckle only took 1/3 hitpoint in damage from the Earthquake.


Compare with Mollesk with the same defence as the above Shuckle but 6 times as much hitpoints.

Mollesk can definately take a hit before buffing and will take MUCH more when buffed.


Anyhow, Gem, I think Drac's plan is a good idea overall.
But I don't think I deserve the particular harrassment Drac is giving me regarding how I choose to handle Mollesk or my role in the plan, especially when I'm looking ahead as to how to use Renny's abilities with the rage he accumulated.

[Dracorion]

And you don't think that's wrong.

[Geminex]

Mollesk can definately take a hit before buffing and will take MUCH more when buffed.
He can't when he Power Tricks. A hit or two, maybe. But once he has high attack and comparativley low defense, he dies. I guarantee it.

Did that by having one attacker for focus fire and the other buffing up defensively, planning for long term if anything happens.
That's... not defensive. Not very much, anyway. Defensive is preventing damage to the team. What you're doing is preventing damage to yourself. It's a start, but it won't keep the rest of us alive when pokegeddon hit us with their signature techiques. Because you, all of you, you realize they have 100/100 rage? And we will die if even two or three of them get their techniques off, I guarantee it?

[Menarker]

That's his designated purpose. He's supposed to be a wall, with merely passable offense unless he takes risks when he swaps to ultra powerful offense.

Yes yes fine, they could change, but I think it's a liiiittle too much to assume that they'd change so much as to go from 690 to 900.

Well, assume 500 DEF and special defence which is the low end of benefical nature or high end of neutral nature later on in the story. (or even right now if Mollesk is assumed to have benefical nature),
The multipliers of each stage boost is as follows...
x1.5 (1 stage) Howl, Sharpen, Defense Curl
x2.0 (2 stage) Nasty Plot, Sword Dance. Mollesk using Cosmic Power.
x2.5 (3 stage) Supreme Upgrade
x3.0 (4 stage) Mollesk using a 2 stage booster buff technique.
x3.5 (5 stage)
x4.0 (6 stage) Belly Drum

If Mollesk was to have 500 DEF and SDEF, he would max out his DEF and SDEF stat with one cosmic power, due to it hitting 2.0 multiplier. (I don't think Mollesk is that high yet though.)

EDIT: Gem, do you want me to use Renny's protect ability? Or you think they aren't likely to use their technique first turn?

[Dracorion]

That's... not defensive. Not very much, anyway. Defensive is preventing damage to the team. What you're doing is preventing damage to yourself. It's a start, but it won't keep the rest of us alive when pokegeddon hit us with their signature techiques. Because you, all of you, you realize they have 100/100 rage? And we will die if even two or three of them get their techniques off, I guarantee it?

You're going to make me repost my plan, aren't you?

Here's my original plan:
Gardenoir: Impact's Siege Boomerang, Matthias' attack, Harliette's pokemons' attacks. Four 4x damage attacks.
Frossqueen: Sol-Leks' Overheat, Blaziken's Overheat, Pierce's Trainer Attack. Rachel's Pokemon can do Steel-type attacks for 2x damage. All in all, that's four 2x damage attacks and Pierce's trainer attack.
Pegidash: Hammond's Stone Edge, Tyranitar's Stone Edge, Mollesk's Rock Slide, Harliette's Mineral Shot. That's four 4x damage attacks.
Altarisect: Secondary target from Mollesk's Rock Slide. No matter.

That leaves Moon and Wilhelmina unassigned. Wilhelmina's Nether Shot can do 2x damage to Frossqueen. Moon's Lanturn can use Signal Beam for 4x damage on Gardenoir.

I can see Pegidash definitely down. Gardenoir probably. Frossqueen critically damaged. Keep in mind Moon still has an extra pokemon.

And here's Menarker's plan, which involves Mollesk not doing anything:
Gardenoir: Impact's Swarm Bow, Matthias' attack, Harliette's pokemon's bug type attacks. Moon's Lanturn's Signal Beam

Frossqueen: Sol-Leks' Overheat, Blaziken's Overheat, Rachel's pokemon's steel type attacks. Wilhelmina. Pierce's Trainer Attack.

Pegidash: Hammond's Stone Edge, Tyranitar's Stone Edge, Swampert's Waterfall, Harliette's Mineral Shot, Moon's Kingdra Hydro Pump

That's his designated purpose. He's supposed to be a wall, with merely passable offense unless he takes risks when he swaps to ultra powerful offense.

That doesn't help the rest of the team at all.

Well, assume 500 DEF and special defence which is the low end of benefical nature or high end of neutral nature later on in the story. (or even right now if Mollesk is assumed to have benefical nature),
The multipliers of each stage boost is as follows...
x1.5 (1 stage) Howl, Sharpen, Defense Curl
x2.0 (2 stage) Nasty Plot, Sword Dance. Mollesk using Cosmic Power.
x2.5 (3 stage) Supreme Upgrade
x3.0 (4 stage) Mollesk using a 2 stage booster buff technique.
x3.5 (5 stage)
x4.0 (6 stage) Belly Drum

If Mollesk was to have 500 DEF and SDEF, he would max out his DEF and SDEF stat with one cosmic power, due to it hitting 2.0 multiplier.

That's ridiculous. And wrong. So very, very wrong.

EDIT: Gem, do you want me to use Renny's protect ability? Or you think they aren't likely to use their technique first turn?

That would be nice, yeah. Though Pierce problably won't use it. He's saving up points for Hellfire.

[Geminex]

That's his designated purpose. He's supposed to be a wall, with merely passable offense unless he takes risks when he swaps to ultra powerful offense.
Then you made a bad choice when selecting stats. What use is a wall? Defensive mons, sure. But defensive in this game involves protecting your allies.

EDIT: Gem, do you want me to use Renny's protect ability? Or you think they aren't likely to use their technique first turn?
I'm... not sure. I was hoping people would give input on that, instead of insulting each other's mother and discussing psych-up.
Or, well, instead of discussing psych-up, anyway.

[Dracorion]

Gem, your mother is ugly.

I'm for Renny using his Co-Op, even if Pierce won't be spending RPs.

[Menarker]

Mollesk getting huge defense does help the team when it can use Follow Me. (Like it does now) and living longer in general.

And Drac, you posted your faulty plan! You put Impact doing the Siege Boomerang on Gardenoir (which is not effective)! My plan is superior to yours in comparision!

[Dracorion]

Your mother is ugly too. I can't be blamed for missing a detail or two when you got me seeing red because your mother is ugly.

Any amount of defense isn't going to save Mollesk when there's a damn good chance one of the Pokegeddons has an insta-kill attack. Frosslass, Gardenoir or Regina, I'm guessing.

Also, Defense is subjective when AB railroads us. Also also, I thought you were having Mollesk use Power Trick?

[Geminex]

Gem, your mother is ugly
Oh yeah? Well your face.


That's ridiculous. And wrong. So very, very wrong.
How so? It was clear from the beginnig that Mollesk'd have excessive defense. And hey, look on the bright side: At least the rules prevent Renny from getting the full 4x boost! 2x is the best he can do, probably. Unless he intentionally micro-manages mollesk's stats so that defense is permanently at around 490, so he can get up to a 3x buff. But he won't do that. Because he knows that if he does, I will make a point that Mollesk is over-specialized and demand that Mollesk's stats be rearranged so no stat is under 50. And Drac will support me. And then Mollesk might lose some of its precious defense, or HP. That wouldn't be nice, would it?

[Menarker]

Like I said. Options. I can vary them based on how the situation shifts. I can use Power Trick if I think offense is needed or I can use Follow Me if I need to defend someone.

Anyhow, my version of the plan has 5 quad effective attacks on Gardenoir, 5 Super effective (and Pierce trainer attack) on Frolass, and 3 Quad effective and 2 super effective on Pegidash.

As compared to Pierce's currently displayed plan with less than those, I'd say stick with what I got. (My plan was a retouched version of his, so I don't know why he's passing it off as garbage.)

Since Def and Special Def maxes out at 999 with stage boost modifers, maxing out sooner is better. (and wastes less time for the party.)

[Dracorion]

Except, y'know, the 2x boost brings it damn near to a 1000. And the cap is 999, I think.

Anyway. Menarker, I apologize. I got kinda sucked up into the whole insulting thing, probably because I could see it was getting to you.

... You big baby.

Know that I meant no ill will, I was just screwin' with you. But yeah, I apologize.

AHEM NOW ONTO IMPORTANT MATTERS OKAY.

Anyhow, my version of the plan has 5 quad effective attacks on Gardenoir, 5 Super effective (and Pierce trainer attack) on Frolass, and 3 Quad effective and 2 super effective on Pegidash.

Hey, my plan had all that. Y'know, at the end.

As compared to Pierce's currently displayed plan with less than those, I'd say stick with what I got. (My plan was a retouched version of his, so I don't know why he's passing it off as garbage.)

See above. Dracorion? Huge jerk.

[Geminex]

Since Def and Special Def maxes out at 999 with stage boost modifers, maxing out sooner is better. (and wastes less time for the party.)
Ah, that's how we're playing it? Allright then, I agree with that.

As for our plan...
Lemme rethink it, M'kay? I really wanted to use the first turn to gather info, to see what our opponents are vulnerable to, whether they even have weaknesses, if they can be stunned, flinched status-ed. These are unknown enemies, and attacking them full-on isn't smart. But we'll see.

[Menarker]

Alternative options from attacking since Gem wants to explore it:

Matthias and pokebrids using Thief to steal items from attackers such as Gardenoir's Scythe.
Switch to our enforcers so they take the brunt of the first turn.

Still thinking of other options while cleaning my room.


Also Drac, I wasn't feeling THAT bad about your insults (Still got annoyed though). But I figured AB might be a tad offended by it, since he doesn't like us rough-housing too much. :3 I love a good debate, although I find slurs mixed in the middle to be... not flattering of one's intellect. And "insulting my plan" which was really just a slightly modified version of yours was almost like insulting yourself.

[Dracorion]

Oh, shush you.

HEY AB, I'M GOING TO ROUGH-HOUSE ALL I WANT.

You know, we could test flinch by using Renny's pokemon.

Also, we could also try using Pierce's Signature Sequence with Chizuru, though I'd rather not spend the Rage and just save up for Hellfire.

We could have Rachel try Thunder Wave on one of them to see if they can be statused. But chances are if flinch doesn't work, Paralysis or any other status won't either.

We could pull out Renny's Swampert, replace it with Togekiss and have it use Air Slash. I'd rather pull Mollesk instead but Menarker is a silly doodle.

[Geminex]

Ok... let's look at it this way: Which of our fighters can we least afford to lose? Like, how many are there that'd weaken us drastically if they died? Are there any?

Also, which enforcers do we all have? I have Kurika, Pierce has Milsha. If we're gonna let enforcers take the hit, I'd like to see how much damage they can do.

Finally, which attack types do we really want to field? I think bug is most important, then ice, then rock.

We can probably get quite a but of bug.
And Impact has the LH launcher, that's a lot of ice damage. Plus, we have quite a few icebeams in our arsenal.
Rock, Impact couldn't help there, but others could.

Eh, lemme check how much of each is avalaible. I'll count pokemon attacks as 2, STAB-ed pokemon attacks as 3, and Slayer attacks as 4 and 6 respectively.

This is only for what we have on the field now (and the numbers are bug/ice/rock):

Renny: 0/2/3 (Whereas the 3 only apply if Mollesk actually attacks)
Pierce: Not sure what attacks, assuming that he has, like, 2 ice, 3 rock, so 0/2/3
Charlotte: 0/2/3
Impact: 0/6/0 (Unless AB lets him switch weapons, which I doubt, however)
Matt: Can't access bulbapedia, but considering his possible pokeshifts, I'd imagine it's 3/2/0, he can field 3/0/0 or 0/2/0)
Rachel: 0/4/3 (can field 0/4/0 or 0/2/3)
Harliette: 9/2/4 (can field 6/0/4 or 3/2/4)
Wilhelmina: 0/0/0
Moon: 0/6/0 (can field 0/4/0)

That doesn't factor in the attack stats, but those should even out.
Anyway... assuming we field things so we get the highest possible total, we have...

Bug: 9
Ice: 16
Rock:16

I say we focus fire on Ice and Rock. Screw Gardenoir, for now. Oh yeah. Screw her.
...
Ahem. We determine the 2 or 3 most vulnerable allies, try to protect them however we can.

I think we might be able to kill two of them with focus fire. We could also throw some status effects their way.
Dammit, Menarker. Your technique is too expensive.

[Dracorion]

Pierce's moveset which I posted before. (http://www.nuklearforums.com/showpost.php?p=1044067&postcount=87)

One of these days I'll get into the habit of putting this in Pierce's profile, I promise!

But yeah, Pierce has Tyranitar for STABed Rock. Aria has Ice Beam and Kingdra has Blizzard.

So basically, focus fire on Altarisect and Pegidash? Might be troublesome. I really, really don't want to spend RPs to have Kingdra use Focus.

And I'd rather take out Gardenoir soon. I'm fairly certain that bitch is going to screw us one way or another.

[Geminex]

Even if we focus fire, we'd have trouble killing her outright. We can have Harliette's bug types do some damage, take her down next turn.

Though there's some other stuff to do as well...
I'm thinking, do you think it's possible to send Regina to sleep? That'd stop her from attacking or using items. It'd also be a fairly good test to see if status effects can be applied at all.

Though really, we should find out in the course of the attacks. All of our attacks should be quadruply effective, and that in turn should quadruple the chance of our ice attacks freezing our opponent. If they're still un-frozen by the time we're done attacking, they're immune to status.

And I'm still waiting on input regarding high-value allies. Who can't die?
Oh, and d'you think we can use Enforcer rage to pay for Renny's technique?

[Dracorion]

You could have Matthias try to use Sleep Powder on Regina. Of course, it's not a sure shot. We'd probably have to try several times.

High-priority allies? Rachel, I guess. Impact. Matthias. And we should try to keep Harliette and her pokemon alive.

We... should be able to use Enforcer Rage for Renny's tech, actually.

[Astral Harmony]

Wow, a lot of pages but not much in the ways of questions. Well, here goes some pretty crazy information:

- First off, you don't know this yet, and I know you'll want to kick my ass for not mentioning it sooner, but Medics have unlimited items. Otherwise, their abilities wouldn't be terribly useful when you want the Medic to focus on healing most of his or her turns. The Medic is the only specialty with unlimited items. I'll update the database with this crucial intel.

- What Impact can do is make a request. I'll have some silly supply character (probably another pretty girl who actually isn't a combat NPC this time) who responds to these requests. She'll get the weapon Impact wants, a turn passes, and she trades the weapon he wants for the weapon he doesn't need right then. Impact can make multiple requests for weapons (and armor after the upgrade) and have them fulfilled on a turn-by-turn basis, where every other turn, one of his requests is fulfilled in the order he requested the trades.

- One more crucial and new rule: your game is considered over when all five main characters (that's you great players if you're confused) are defeated. Use the other specialties and even sacrifice your own Enforcers, but don't let the PCs be defeated.

- So what happens if you do Game Over? Well, the RP could end then and there with a sad tale of how everything went to shit since you were apparently the only thing preventing the world from being taken over, or we could probably create new characters with an offshoot story that somehow still finds you on the same path to saving the world. Just don't Game Over yet, 'kay? You'll miss the beach mission. However, it should be very difficult to Game Over in this story because it's clear you all love your characters and I don't want to do a different story. I could, though. Easily.

- Oh, and there will be battles where being defeated doesn't mean a Game Over. This battle being a good example. Though you might just find a crafty way to survive it, Pokegeddon ain't nothing to fuck with and the next RP post (which I'll do soon) will be a testament to their true and frightening power and flawless teamwork. I guess the omakes were done some time in the past when they were just so-so but in the present day, they're ready to hand the world its' own ass.

EDIT 1: And what's this about roughhousing? All I see is Drac calling everyone else's mother ugly.

[Geminex]

which I'll do soon
Take your time. I wanna give orders first. Hell, it's barely 3 PM over here, you usually post much later than that.

[Bard The 5th LW]

I've noticed that you all have been debating and bitching with each other over weird tactical shit, but never actually bothered to complain about me for posting and acting before tactics were discussed.

I'm not sure how I feel about that.

And a question. To anyone really. How man signature techniques will we be allowed, and how many are we allowed at this very moment?

Sorry, its hard to extract the database from my hard drive at the moment.

[Astral Harmony]

Eh, take your time, Gem. I'm not sure which orders are the ones actually being enforced, anyways.

As for Signature Techniques, you have one of those, then a Signature Sequence with someone else. You can pretty much pick anybody, since the only relationships you've forged throughout the story are relationships based on barely-contained tolerance.

[Geminex]

Though I do have one more question, during mission 3, Sig techs and Sig Seqs were counted as a free action. Are they still?

I'm not sure how I feel about that.
You can always edit.

[Bard The 5th LW]

I'm perfectly OK with Charlotte's actions, I'm just curious as to how I've fallen under the radar as far as complaints go. Is it simply due to a lack of appearance in discussion? Or are my actions just conveniently working out as opposed to to other proposed actions?

[Geminex]

No, no. The reason I haven't raged at everyone who posted was that you can always edit your posts once we come up with something that won't get us all killed. Y'know, and I just realized, we haven't used Super Fang in a while. Gotta get back on that. Gimme half an hour and I'll have a strategy that'll blow those bitches away.

[Bard The 5th LW]

Super-fang is probably the only way I've managed to use a Mightyena to good effect.

Thank god for the move tutor.

[Menarker]

Firstly, let me say I would HATE a gameover situation. I'm rather attached to my character. ^^;



- First off, you don't know this yet, and I know you'll want to kick my ass for not mentioning it sooner, but Medics have unlimited items. Otherwise, their abilities wouldn't be terribly useful when you want the Medic to focus on healing most of his or her turns. The Medic is the only specialty with unlimited items. I'll update the database with this crucial intel.


Secondly, I'm overjoyed by this info.
AB, do Medics have access to all kinds of items like Rocket Boosters, or only Full Restore and Max Revive and such?

ANYHOW, now that we know that there is infinite items... >_> I can do this...

Turn 1: Have Renny's Togekiss and Mollesk attack for rage (Test flinching and damage.) Give a whole bunch of people Rocket Boosters, courtesy of my Gal-Tech. *Use as much of my RP as possible*

Turn 2: Send out Cecilia the enforcer. Have her use her Special ability that makes her invincible for 3 turns. ATTACK! End of Turn 1 waiting. (If Renny does this first, he can ensure other people can use their Signature Technique this turn.)

Turn 3: Cecilia Attack! SHE IS UNSTOPPABLE! End of Turn 2 Waiting. Renny's leader pokemon fully healed.

Turn 4: Cecilia cannot be stopped by any mortal agency! End of Turn 3 Waiting. Renny has Full RP again.

Turn 5: Renny joins the fray again, ready to buff the party silly with his maxed out RP or attack with dual Testament drives or something.

Oh, one thing I can test out is Shaymin's Seed Flare. It has an 80% chance of reducing a target's Special Defence by 2 stages. Too bad there is Frolass and Pegidash whom would cause trouble.

EDIT: Using your enforcer's rage to help pay for Renny's Protect ability sounds like a great idea in the future. ^,^ (Unless you want to use it this turn...) Also, when you're protected, you still gain rage from your attacks, so a trainer with two pokemons with double hitting attacks would end up getting 20 of his/her rage back.

If Super Fang turns out to be effective... Swampert and Magnezone has Mimic... (Don't ask what Magnezone bites with.)

Also, we haven't found out who the enforcer for Matthias and Charlotte is (although Bard said he might consider Shannon.) Anyhow, trainer enforcers are a good idea for throwing as tanks because even at the worst situation when both their pokemons are knocked out, they got 4 more left to spare.

[Geminex]

And AB, you have yet to adress my Rage woes. Can we make the upgrade retroactive? Because Impact really doesn't have nearly as much Rage as I'd like. There's absolutely nothing speaking against it, is there? It'd certainly be balanced. And if this is sort of a "supposed-to-lose" battle anyway, it probably won't help us win anyway.

Renny has Full RP again.
Full RP? We get 50, not full. Don't we? We only get full RP if we were revived in the process.

Anyway, I'm assuming Rachel can use two rage rockets. Would anyone protest horribly if I had Impact use Dark ambition, after two rockets? It'll be useful later in the battle, and also, it'll make him a target. I plan to have an enforcer, probably a trainer's (because you're less likely to need them) pay some rage to fund Serene Blessing, and if he's a target, his protect absorbs more attacks.

[Menarker]

Ah, it was 100 RP before the database got changed. Thanks for the clarification. Still, 3 turns of invincibility is not something to waste. ^^

AB might change how you gain rage perhaps, but I doubt he'd give all Slayers Double Rage, or he would have to give Harriette a new ability. (Although that might be easier to do in the long run perhaps.)

Anyhow, keep discussing on what you want me to do. Protect to as many active combatants as possible, or give 25 rage to as many people as possible for aggressive action!

AB said that Medics can use additional items per turn if they pay 25 rage. So yes, Rachel could do double boosters if she spent the rage on that second one.

If you could edit the details into your bio, that would be great, so we don't have to look for it. Especially if you could put it in your signature, but I have links to everyone's bio somewhat in my signature already.

[Geminex]

AB might change how you gain rage perhaps, but I doubt he'd give all Slayers Double Rage, or he would have to give Harriette a new ability. (Although that might be easier to do in the long run perhaps.)
Well, the way I see it, it'd work like this:
If a human attacks or gets attacked, they gain 10 rage.
If a pokemon attacks or gets attacked, it gains 5 rage.

As such, Harliette would gain 20 rage for attacking, or getting attacked, (because her ability doubles it), her pokemon would gain 5.
Impact would gain 10 rage for attacking.
Pierce would gain 5 rage for each pokemon.
A battle master without Harliette's special would get 10 for themselves, and 5 for their pokemon.

AB said that Medics can use additional items per turn if they pay 25 rage. So yes, Rachel could do double boosters if she spent the rage on that second one.
Well, no. She can use double boosters by just leaving combat. Though it should be triple boosters.
Because using an item, that just takes a standard action, right? And trainers/legion mages/battle masters gain 2 actions, one for each pokemon. Plus, legion mages and battle masters gain an action for themselves, if they're not a support class.
Or, at least, that's the only way it makes sense.

[Menarker]

Rage system doesn't care who earns the rage the way AB put it. It's the number of hits recieved or dealt, not whom deal it. (Which means that it's double rage for Harriette regardless of whether it's her or her pokemon.) Although maybe that can be her ability, that the double rage applies to her pokemon too, while AB boosts the rage generation for all individual slayers themselves.

EDIT: NEW PLAN!

Current party set up? (Correct me if I'm wrong)

[Evolith/Device Space 1] [Matthias] [Charlotte Pokemon 1] [Charlotte Pokemon 2] [Rachel Pokemon 1] [Rachel] [Harliette Pokemon 1] [Harliette] [Harliette Pokemon 2] [Renny Pokemon 1] [Renny Pokemon 2] [Pierce Pokemon 1] [Pierce Pokemon 2] [Moon Pokemon 1] [Moon Pokemon 2] [Impact] [Evolith/Device Space 2]

Others involved. Wilhelmina, the 5 enforcers. (Dunno if Muon has rage to contribute. Doubt it.)

Required Data: List who would benefit from getting hit. Or who don't need Protect.
Current person who don't need protection and would even benefit from getting hit. (Harriette > Boost Renny's and her own rage generation when hit.)
Pay for 11 targets if at all possible. (Renny and his pokemons are automatically included in the original payment.)

Renny attacks with two pokemons (Air Slash and Mollesk's Rock Slide so he gains 15 rage.) Test Flinch theory, while trying to get Rage. Ends up with 95 rage so he can pay for 1 person's protect in addition to his pokemons and his own. *1*
Rachel pays for herself and rocket boosts Impact Twice. She has 60 rage. Enough to do that. *2*
Impact uses Kurika's Rage to protect himself? *3* Can still attack.
Harriette attack with 3 pokemons. Her rage pumps to 100! She pays for 2 others (Pierce's pokemon?), leaving herself open so she (and Renny beside her) get double rage when hit. Renny getting rage faster this way help pump his support skills faster! *5*
Matthias has his enforcer pay rage to protect himself (or he pays for himself?) *6* Get a bit of rage back when attacking.
Wilhelmina pay for someone else. *7* Get a bit of rage back when attacking.
Moon attacks with 2 pokemons, with two double hit moves, so he'll have enough to pay for 1 protect. *8*
Charlotte has enough rage to protect both her pokemons, or can draw upon her enforcer (11 if she draws from herself AND her enforcer). Can attack to get rage.

People Protected:
Renny and his two Pokemons (Automatically included)
Moon and his 2 pokemons (3)
Rachel and her 1 pokemon (5)
Pierce's Pokemon (7)
Charlotte's Pokemon (9)
Impact (10)
Matthias (11)

Not protected: Harriette and her pokemons.
If I made any mistakes, such as forgetting anyhow or something let me know.

The current Rage set up is here...

Pierce: 80
Impact: 35
Renny: 80
Charlotte: 70
Matthias: 55
Harriette: 70
Moon: 15
Rachel: 60
Wilhelmina: 60

Everyone else: 50

[Astral Harmony]

SignTechs/Seqs do now count as an action, except there's a special case in which the initiator of the SignSeq is the one who uses their action.

Medics have access to Rage Rockets and other items. They're just not able to pack shit like Supreme Restores 'n' the kinds of items Regina is about to use.

Fine, Gem. An upgrade is you. Slayers and Pokebrids generate twice as much Rage from hits dealt and received. Ya whiny fucker.

Harliette's double Rage ability applies only to her. After all, she's the Shock Trooper, not her Pokemon.

Now that all is said and done, prepare for an epic asswhuppin'.

[Geminex]

1: I really don't think that trainers should get rage for using trainer attacks. Not unless slayers start getting triple rage. Which I'd be fine with, actually.

2: My version of said plan:

Rachel: Leave combat to use two rage rockets on Impact. Leaves combat, so hopefully immune to damage.

Impact: Dark ambition, leaving him with 0 Rage. Use second adrenaline boost. Attack Altarisect with LH launcher. Request Swarm Bow in exchange for flamethrower.

Charlotte: Spitz to use super fang on Pegidash, Hammond to use Stone Edge on Pegidash.

Renny: Use Serene blessing (Two characters not sure who (suggestions welcome), spend 35 rage to extend protection to Matt and Impact). Mollesk to use Rock Slide on Pegidash, Swampert to use Ice beam on Altarisect. We can test flinching another time.

Pierce: Tyranitar with stone edge on Pegidash, Aria with ice beam on altarisect. Deploy Aria first, then Tyranitar. That way, sandstorm overrides drizzle. I hope.

Matt: Venomoth form, use sleep powder on Regina

Moon: Fathom and Shanelle with two ice beams, vs. Altarisect.

Harliette: Mineral shot on Pegidash, Blissey's sing, also on Regina, deploy nidoqueen, Ice Beam on Altarisect

Wilhelmina: Hit Altarisect

Suggestions? Improvements?

Edit:

Fine, Gem. An upgrade is you. Slayers and Pokebrids generate twice as much Rage from hits dealt and received. Ya whiny fucker.
:dance:

SignTechs/Seqs do now count as an action, except there's a special case in which the initiator of the SignSeq is the one who uses their action.
Wait, what? Including Impacts?
...
Can I edit his technique so that doesn't apply? Or ignore that for this turn?

[DanteFalcon]

I exist still. Just...blech. Sickish. Should I not post, presume I'm doing what I'm being ordered to do.

[Astral Harmony]

Could you guys agree on a damn plan and post it in orange? Time's a-wastin' and I'm sure you want me to post tonight, eh?

I've done Charlotte, Pierce, and Renny's parts in the attack so far.

[Geminex]

I'm making Impact's post at the moment. Sorry, sorry.

[Astral Harmony]

Yeah, you better do it...before I give leadership to Renny!

Dunh dunh dunnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnh!

Don't forget to choose an attack for Matthias since he's sick. Must infected himself with his own spores.

[Geminex]

Yeah, you better do it...before I give leadership to Renny!
You wanna know where you can shove that suggestion?

Ok, I'm done. Sorry, but I keep wanting more info before I make these plans. I'll post it earlier next time.

[Astral Harmony]

Eh, I don't really mind. Occasionally gives me the night off.

Though this battle isn't nearly as huge as that battle orgy in Renny's sidequest. I learned my lesson there, for damn sure.

EDIT 1: Damn it, you just killed my post! I really don't have much time left. Tell you guys what: I'm sure you want to continue arguing amongst yourselves so please do so. I do want to do this other thing for the amount of time before I go to sleep. I dunno why, but I seem to be possessed by Arc the Lad IV.

[Geminex]

Though this battle isn't nearly as huge as that battle orgy in Renny's sidequest. I learned my lesson there, for damn sure.
Strangely, I did better there. Certainly posted more frequently. I'll probably become more motivated as we progress in-battle.

[Astral Harmony]

When I do that post tomorrow afternoon after you guys are certain that you want to follow Geminex's orders (I have no problems, you can do what you want, you're the characters), I'll provide some motivation in the form of grievous insults.

Pokegeddon may look like joke characters, but they are in actuality lethal joke characters. They're like that one jester who looks ridiculous and really shouldn't be anywhere near combat, but piss him off and suddenly he's an Arch-Demon or some shit, flinging meteors and casting Level 5 Death.

[Geminex]

I think I am about to become extremely unpopular. It won't be logical, it'll be all your fault for not being on in the middle of the day/night and responding to my plan. But anyway, let me distract from my errors by making a HS reference:

Pokegeddon may look like joke characters, but they are in actuality lethal joke characters. They're like that one jester who looks ridiculous and really shouldn't be anywhere near combat, but piss him off and suddenly he's an Arch-Demon or some shit, flinging meteors and casting Level 5 Death.
You mean like Jack Noir? Yeah... We're screwed.

Edit:
Oh, and you know what I just realized? Altarisect is bug/dragon. What is isn't is 4x vulnerable to ice. Did anyone else know this? Anyone? And if so, WHY DIDN'T YOU MENTION IT?

[Dracorion]

Two things: Aria's Drizzle and Tyranitar's Sandstorm would coexist. That only weather effect that clears out other weather effects is Sunny Day. And of course, all other weather effects clear out Sunny Day. But Rain Dance doesn't override Drizzle.

So Aria's ability would make it impossible for Wilhelmina to attack, since she doesn't get a nifty new item to make her ability harmless.

My suggestion? Forget Altarisect and throw some fire attacks at Frossqueen. Seriously, Overheat > Ice Beam.

Secondly, I made the same mistake you did. Thought Bug was weak to Ice, for some reason.

Also, stop making Impact into a jerk. That just makes it harder for anyone to pay attention to him.

[Geminex]

How's Impact a jerk? He's an officer, he has to be a dick sometimes. He'll make up for it by getting them out of there alive.

And ok. Modify my plan, propose whatever changes you'd make to it. I'll see...

[Dracorion]

I'm pretty sure the only person who sees Impact's promotion as actually meaning anything is... well... Impact.

Rachel: Leave combat to use two rage rockets on Impact. Leaves combat, so hopefully immune to damage.

Impact: Dark ambition, leaving him with 0 Rage. Use second adrenaline boost. Attack Frossqueen with Flamethrower. STAB super-effective. Request Swarm Bow in exchange for Flamethrower.

Charlotte: Sol-Leks to use Overheat on Frossqueen, Hammond to use Stone Edge on Pegidash.

Renny: Use Serene blessing (Charlotte's enforcer and Milsha to spend 35 rage to extend protection to Matt and Impact). Mollesk to use Rock Slide on Pegidash, Swampert to use Waterfall on Pegidash. We can test flinching another time.

Pierce: Tyranitar with Stone Edge on Pegidash, Blaziken with Overheat on Frosqueen.

Matt: Venomoth form, use sleep powder on Regina

Harliette: Mineral shot on Pegidash, Blissey's sing, also on Regina, deploy Illumise, Bug Buzz on Gardenoir.

Moon: Lanturn's Signal Beam at Gardenoir, Kingdra's Hydro Pump at Pegidash. If Pegidash is dead, redirect at Frossqueen.

Wilhelmina: Nether Shot on Frossqueen.

Trainer Attacks: Charlotte's at Pegidash and Pierce's at Frossqueen.

I didn't really want to remove Charlotte's Super Fang, but that plus everything else we're throwing at Pegidash would be unnecessary overkill, and that was the only attack we could spare.

Gardenoir would hopefully be damaged enough that Regina will use a healing item on it, and then we can see what they got.

[Geminex]

Ok... that's not bad, actually. But see, I picked Altarisect specifically because I knew we had a lot of ice moves at our disposal. Not so many fire.

Also, if we wait, we can just have Wilhelmina eliminate Frosqueen. Once she goes all maid-to-mistress, the gets two STAB-boosted ghost attacks with huge stats boosts. Murderous, that.

Also, see, we should keep super fang. Y'know why? We can see how well it works, so later it can be mimicked, potentially. (By the way, I'd have Swampert mimic either a bug move or stone edge, instead of waterfall). Also, even if it is overkill, we can just redirect all the rock attacks. Rock is super-effective against Ice or Bug, so even if Pegidash goes down quickly, the redirected attacks will do double damage against whomever they hit afterwards.

And Regina would hopefully be asleep, she couldn't use items.

[Dracorion]

If Regina's asleep then we got one weakened Gardenoir. And Wilhelima has a Flying-type attack, so we can use her to finish off Altarisect as well. Fair enough, new plan:

Rachel: Leave combat to use two rage rockets on Impact. Leaves combat, so hopefully immune to damage.

Impact: Dark ambition, leaving him with 0 Rage. Use second adrenaline boost. Attack Frossqueen with Flamethrower. STAB super-effective. Request Swarm Bow in exchange for Flamethrower.

Charlotte: Spitz' Super Fang on Pegidash, Hammond to use Stone Edge on Pegidash.

Renny: Use Serene blessing (Charlotte's enforcer and Milsha to spend 35 rage to extend protection to Matt and Impact). Mollesk to use Rock Slide on Frossqueen, Swampert to Mimic Stone Edge on Frossqueen. We can test flinching another time.

Pierce: Tyranitar with Stone Edge on Pegidash, Blaziken with Overheat on Frosqueen.

Matt: Venomoth form, use sleep powder on Regina

Harliette: Mineral shot on Pegidash, Blissey's sing, also on Regina, deploy Illumise, Bug Buzz on Gardenoir.

Moon: Lanturn's Signal Beam at Gardenoir, Kingdra's Hydro Pump at Frossqueen.

Wilhelmina: Nether Shot on Frossqueen.

Trainer Attacks at Pegidash. If it's dead, target Frossqueen.

Gardenoir: Two quad-effective attacks.
Regina: Sleep Powder and Sing.
Frossqueen: Five super-effective attacks. Moon's Kingdra's Hydro Pump for neutral damage.
Pegidash: Super Fang, three quad-effective attacks. Charlotte's and Pierce's Trainer Attacks.


Made some changes. Pegidash and Frossqueen should definitely die.

And hm, I see your point. Wilhelmina gets STAB with ghost, but not with Flying. So maybe we're better off using her super-boost on Frossqueen. My worry is that Pokegeddon will definitely be using Signature Techs this turn, and Frossqueen is likely to have one that screws us over.

Probably something with statuses or insta-kill or deathclock. Damage we can handle. Statuses suck.

[Geminex]

Eh...
I could live with that. I wouldn't like to, though. Lemme sleep on it, I'll get back to you tomorrow.

I don't think that Frosqueen's power would be so much more destructive than Altarisect's...

[Dracorion]

Altarisect's is probably something like sending a swarm of bugs to eat us up for like three turns.

[Menarker]

Firstly, AB said that Regina was packing Supreme Upgrades. We DO NOT want them getting something to the effect of Full Restore and 3 stage boosts to all stats.

Secondly, the fact that Regina has those items make me think that they were given to her by Burkmont's facilities (Major Grant works for him and probably gave them to the mercs he hired)... And somehow The Light and Dark, associated with Faynoc, had them too. I'd say chances are damn good that Burkmont are being suppliers to Faynoc.

Thirdly, your plan forgot that Mollesk has no choice but to target two foes with Rock Slide.

>> Fourthly, my post was just a placeholder in case AB went ahead or so. Didn't mean/want for Impact to start shooting and threatening Renny with bullet induced death. Was planning on editting after we decided on something. <<



As for the plan... trying to see if there is any way I can alter it so Renny can give the most out of his ability.

Renny: Use Serene blessing. Mollesk to use Rock Slide on Frossqueen and Artarisect, Swampert to wait to Mimic Stone Edge on Frossqueen. Mollesk and Swampert are protected.

Rachel: Leave combat to use two rage rockets on Impact. Leaves combat, so hopefully immune to damage. Pays 35 rage to protect Pierce's Tyranitar.

Impact: Dark ambition, leaving him with 0 Rage. Use second adrenaline boost. Attack Frossqueen with Flamethrower. STAB super-effective. Request Swarm Bow in exchange for Flamethrower. Gets Kurika to pay 35 rage to protect him

Charlotte: Spitz' Super Fang on Pegidash, Hammond to use Stone Edge on Pegidash. Gets her enforcer to pay 35 to protect Spitz while she pays 35 to protect Hammond

Pierce: Tyranitar with Stone Edge on Pegidash, Blaziken with Overheat on Frosqueen. Get his enforcer to pay to protect Blaziken. (Rachel is protecting Tyranitar)

Matt: Venomoth form, use sleep powder on Regina. Pays 35 rage for his protection.

Harliette: Mineral shot on Pegidash, Blissey's sing, also on Regina, deploy Illumise, Bug Buzz on Gardenoir. Pays for protection of both of Moon's pokemon.

Moon: Lanturn's Signal Beam at Gardenoir, Kingdra's Hydro Pump at Frossqueen.

Wilhelmina: Nether Shot on Frossqueen.

Trainer Attacks at Pegidash. If it's dead, target Frossqueen.


With this plan, nearly everyone is protected, attacks is not changed (except including second target of Rock Slide for Mollesk.

[Bard The 5th LW]

I'm OK with that plan, I'll change around my post for a moment.

E:Alright, editted Charlotte's post to apply. Although I can't really expend the rage points until Renny uses Serene Blessings, which I don't think he's done.

[Menarker]

Was going to see if Gem approve the latest revision (I doubt it would be an issue, but I don't want Impact to shoot Renny. ^^; )

Will make a post inputting Serene Blessing when I get the word.

[Dracorion]

First of all, AB's exact words were:

Medics have access to Rage Rockets and other items. They're just not able to pack shit like Supreme Restores 'n' the kinds of items Regina is about to use.

That doesn't mean Regina is carrying Supreme Restores. It means she's carrying a different kind of item that's probably comparable, but might be entirely different. So it could be anything, and if we're going to be ready for that crap, we need to know what the fuck it is. Or else we don't attack ever.

Doesn't really matter if Rock Slide hits two targets, Menarker.

Meh. I'd rather not spend too many RPs at once. We might want to use Harliette's Signature Technique, for example. It does non-elemental damage, sure, but it's sure to pack a punch nonetheless. And we might want to use our Enforcer's Signature Techniques, as well. Not to mention Charlotte's Co-Op and Matt's Synch Techs.

Moon doesn't really need protecting. I don't think Pokegeddon have anything that can do super-effective damage to his pokemon, and even if they did I doubt they'd target him specifically.

[Menarker]

Mind you, if they do heavy damage, our morale gauge might sink quite a bit. My technique, if used in high amount, also practically negates morale loss for a turn.

Plus, Harriette gains double rage. In addition to being a slayer, that is going to give her a lot back when she hits or get hit. And when someone gives her a rocket booster, she'll get 50 instead of 25.

[Dracorion]

Their morale will drop quicker if we do Signature Techniques after Signature Techniques after Signature Techniques. That means having RPs.

Normally, I'd argue that we shouldn't spend Harliette's RPs so that we can just have her use her Signature Technique every other turn. But she's bound to be a priority target anyway, so what the hell. Let's have 'er spend those RPs. Everyone else's RPs? Yeah, no. At least not Matthias' and Charlotte's.

[Menarker]

AB: If I wanted to have Renny take an item from a medic's infinite stash (for the purpose of his item technique), would that take an action of some sort?

Had the thought of Renny pumping almost the entire party with 25 rage this turn (instead of protect) this turn, giving some offensive power.
Rachel next turn double pumping Renny with rocket boosters (the way she is doing for Impact this turn), Renny use one of his pokemon's attack actions to take a booster from Rachel and giving everyone another 5-6 people 25 rage and repeat each turn. During turns when the party is really hurt, Renny does Full Restore instead of booster.


Thus a different plan would be

Renny: Mollesk to use Rock Slide on Frossqueen and Artarisect, Swampert to wait to Mimic Stone Edge on Frossqueen. Has 95 Rage. Use Prosperous Gifts with his Rocket Booster item. Give 25 rage to himself and 8 other people. (End rage is 30)

Rachel: Leave combat to use two rage rockets on Impact. Leaves combat, so hopefully immune to damage. (Gets 25 rage due to Renny. End up with 60 rage.)

Impact: Dark ambition, leaving him with 0 Rage. Use second adrenaline boost. Attack Frossqueen with Flamethrower. STAB super-effective. Request Swarm Bow in exchange for Flamethrower. (Get 25 Rage due to Renny. End Phase with 35 Rage.)

Charlotte: Spitz' Super Fang on Pegidash, Hammond to use Stone Edge on Pegidash. (End with 100 rage.)

Pierce: Get 25 Rage. Hit 100. Activate Co-Op Technique? (Can you use a Co-Op technique and still do your normal attacks?)
Otherwise stick with original plan, which is : Tyranitar with Stone Edge on Pegidash, Blaziken with Overheat on Frosqueen.

Matt: Venomoth form, use sleep powder on Regina. (Get 25 rage. End with 70 RP)

Harliette: Mineral shot on Pegidash, Blissey's sing, also on Regina, deploy Illumise, Bug Buzz on Gardenoir. (End with 95 rage.)

Moon: Lanturn's Signal Beam at Gardenoir, Kingdra's Hydro Pump at Frossqueen. (Get 25 rage. End with 50 rage.) Maybe get him to build a device or evolith?

Wilhelmina: Nether Shot on Frossqueen. (Get 25 rage. End phase with 95 Rage.)

Trainer Attacks at Pegidash. If it's dead, target Frossqueen.

I'm taking in account the altered Rage from Slayers getting double and what you guys would get from attacking.

[Dracorion]

I'm pretty sure we shouldn't be able to take tems from the Medic. But hey, ask away.

[Menarker]

Alternative plan for first turn. (Especially useful if AB say we can take an item from a medic at a cost of an action or so.) Only slightly different (Mainly allowing Pierce and Charlotte to do their signature techniques and Renny doing Propserous Gifts instead.)


Renny: Mollesk to use Rock Slide on Frossqueen and Artarisect, Swampert to wait to Mimic Stone Edge on Frossqueen. Has 95 Rage. Spends 80 rage to use Prosperous Gifts with his Rocket Booster item. Give 25 rage to himself and 7 other people. (End rage is 40)

Rachel: Leave combat to use two rage rockets on Impact. Leaves combat, so hopefully immune to damage. (Gets 25 rage due to Renny. End up with 60 rage.)

Impact: Dark ambition, leaving him with 0 Rage. Use second adrenaline boost. Attack Frossqueen with Flamethrower. STAB super-effective. Request Swarm Bow in exchange for Flamethrower. (Get 25 Rage due to Renny. End Phase with 35 Rage.)

Charlotte: Spitz' Super Fang on Pegidash, Hammond to use Stone Edge on Pegidash. (Renny gives her 25 rage. End with 100 rage.) Unless Charlotte wants to do her Relationship Technique? Or Co-Op technique if that's allowed with pokemon attacking on the same turn. (End with 0 rage)

Pierce: Get 25 Rage from Renny. Hit 100. Activate Co-Op Technique? (Can you use a Co-Op technique and still do your normal attacks?)
Otherwise stick with original plan, which is : Tyranitar with Stone Edge on Pegidash, Blaziken with Overheat on Frosqueen. (If you can attack after you do the Co-Op technique, you end with 10 rage. Otherwise, you end with 0)

Matt: Venomoth form, use sleep powder on Regina. (Get 25 rage from Renny. End with 70 RP)

Harliette: Mineral shot on Pegidash, Blissey's sing, also on Regina, deploy Illumise, Bug Buzz on Gardenoir. (End with 95 rage. Renny didn't give her rage.) She COULD do her signature technique, but that's questionable since her damage is random and we're probably relying on her to knock out Pegidash.

Moon: Lanturn's Signal Beam at Gardenoir, Kingdra's Hydro Pump at Frossqueen. (Get 25 rage from Renny. End with 50 rage.) Maybe get him to build a device or evolith?

Wilhelmina: Nether Shot on Frossqueen. (Get 25 rage from Renny. End phase with 95 Rage.)

Trainer Attacks at Pegidash. If it's dead, target Frossqueen.



I'm taking in account the altered Rage from Slayers getting double for this turn and what you guys would get from attacking with pokemons and all that.

Does Rachel have to pay 25 rage to use her second item? I didn't see any clarification. If she doesn't, she ends turn with 85 rage instead. Excuse me if I missed something.
Cause what I saw was
- The Medic has the ability to leave combat and use two items instead of taking an action and using only one item. The leader(s) can decide when the Medic actually uses these items, which is usually best after the leader sees what the enemy does. However, the leader must decide during the Ally Phase if the medic will leave combat to use two items. Medics can spend 25/100 Rage Points to use additional items.

[Dracorion]

I think it means they have to spend 25 Rage to use a third item.

I think Co-Ops only take one action. So Pierce could use Hellfire, then have Tyranitar use Stone Edge.

[Bard The 5th LW]

I don't actually have a co-op technique for Charlotte as of now. Unless you mean Future Shock. I'm not sure which one is which right now.

Need an enforcer to. Going to look through the dataase now for one. Get back to you guys in 7 minutes.

[Menarker]

In that case... We could have Wilhelmina hold off her attack for a sec (she is at 60 rage.) Rachel pays 25 rage to use a 3rd item, a rocket booster on Wilhelmina. Renny gives her 25 rage as well. Giving her 100 rage. Wilhelmina activate Hell on Honymrr.

Also Bard, the following Enforcers are taken: Cecilia, Misha, Kurika.
Co-Op is the one that involves your pokemon with another of your pokemon (or yourself).
Relationship is the one that Charlotte does with another NPC or maybe PC.

[Dracorion]

Wilhelmina will be a 95 Rage just with your Rage Rocket. And she gets to use an attack to bring her up to 100. We can have her use her Signature Technique next turn.

[Menarker]

Well, I'd thought you'd want fast powerful damage. If we do it the way I proposed, we can add an extra attack, and both her attacks will be boosted by 5 stages for this turn. It's only a cost of 25 rage, which is practically already paid for by Renny's Prosperous Gift (which only costed 10 rage per person). So the benefits are huge for a small cost.

Anyhow, I won't have time to hang around much longer today. Work called me in early and asked me to work until later. >_<

Looking forward to see what your choice is.

[Bard The 5th LW]

OK, seven minutes have passed (according to my clock at time of writing) so I am back!

Enforcer: Shannon. Due to the whole 'attempted murder' thing, and because Charlotte lacks grass types of any sort. Good to have a trainer enforcer to.

It will also be quite difficult for Charlotte to have a relationship with anyone. At least not a good relationship.

[Dracorion]

Yeah, I forgot Wilhelmina's Sig Tech only costs 50. Let's do it. She can target Altarisect twice with Flying Shot. Pierce will use Hellfire, which should ensure Frossqueen goes down on top of everything else we're throwing at her.

Now that Bard's picked Shannon, we can have Moon and Shannon use their Signature Sequence. But it's just Dark type damage, which doesn't help us right now.

[Astral Harmony]

Once you're ultimately decided, just post an action guide in orange. That should be the best way to keep from confusing me.

And no, you can't replenish items from Medics. Friggin' h4x. You should be able to replenish items by stealing them from enemies. I won't indicate which enemies have what, but the items should always be decent and not something else...

Renny: "Mollesk, use Thief on that HPG Soldier!"
Mollesk: "Moll!" *uses Thief*
Renny: "Mollesk, not for nothing but what the hell am I supposed to do with a condom? ...Hey, Lolaaaaaaaaaa..."
Lola: "I'm not in heat yet, Renny."

[Dracorion]

I assume we can steal items from Regina? Or maybe we can't because she's a boss and bosses cheat.

Either way, candidates for Thief: Renny's Umbreon (doesn't actually learn Thief, but it learns Covet), Charlotte's Spitz (learns Covet or Thief),, Charlotte's Hammond, Pierce's Skarmory (learns Thief, but I wouldn't suggest it because Skarmory is permanently retired after Pierce's sidequest anyway.)

Pokebrids with Thief: Matthias (in both Castform and Venomoth), Dormond in Zangoose and Houndoom forms, Whitney in Gardevoir and Mismagius form (but she's a Sniper),

[Geminex]

...
What happened here?

I'm not mad, really, I just want to know what happened. And I want the person responsible to own up. I won't punish them, but I want to know who they are.

[Bard The 5th LW]

http://i209.photobucket.com/albums/bb214/chrisrooR/LOL-WUT-IT.gif

[Dracorion]

Sure you're not. I blame Menarker, by the way.

Out of curiosity, what are you referring to?

[Geminex]

Renny: Mollesk to use Rock Slide on Frossqueen and Artarisect, Swampert to wait to Mimic Stone Edge on Frossqueen. Has 95 Rage. Spends 80 rage to use Prosperous Gifts with his Rocket Booster item. Give 25 rage to himself and 7 other people. (End rage is 40)

Rachel: Leave combat to use two rage rockets on Impact. Leaves combat, so hopefully immune to damage. (Gets 25 rage due to Renny. End up with 60 rage.)

Impact: Dark ambition, leaving him with 0 Rage. Use second adrenaline boost. Attack Frossqueen with Flamethrower. STAB super-effective. Request Swarm Bow in exchange for Flamethrower. (Get 25 Rage due to Renny. End Phase with 35 Rage.)

Charlotte: Spitz' Super Fang on Pegidash, Hammond to use Stone Edge on Pegidash. (Renny gives her 25 rage. End with 100 rage.) Unless Charlotte wants to do her Relationship Technique? Or Co-Op technique if that's allowed with pokemon attacking on the same turn. (End with 0 rage)

Pierce: Get 25 Rage from Renny. Hit 100. Activate Co-Op Technique? (Can you use a Co-Op technique and still do your normal attacks?)
Otherwise stick with original plan, which is : Tyranitar with Stone Edge on Pegidash, Blaziken with Overheat on Frosqueen. (If you can attack after you do the Co-Op technique, you end with 10 rage. Otherwise, you end with 0)

Matt: Venomoth form, use sleep powder on Regina. (Get 25 rage from Renny. End with 70 RP)

Harliette: Mineral shot on Pegidash, Blissey's sing, also on Regina, deploy Illumise, Bug Buzz on Gardenoir. (End with 95 rage. Renny didn't give her rage.) She COULD do her signature technique, but that's questionable since her damage is random and we're probably relying on her to knock out Pegidash.

Moon: Lanturn's Signal Beam at Gardenoir, Kingdra's Hydro Pump at Frossqueen. (Get 25 rage from Renny. End with 50 rage.) Maybe get him to build a device or evolith?

Wilhelmina: Nether Shot on Frossqueen. (Get 25 rage from Renny. End phase with 95 Rage.)

Trainer Attacks at Pegidash. If it's dead, target Frossqueen.

This, coupled with your apparent intention of using Wilhelimina's signature technique as well.
...
I disapprove.

Seriously, what happened to defensive play? I was considering something similar, actually, but I scrapped it. You wanna know why? Because we don't know anything about our foes. We need to test them. Learn about them. NOT use our most powerful attacks against them. Cause see, you're proposing that we go all-in here. We'd be comitting resources to something we don't know will work. I'd much prefer to just attack normally this turn (or, well, to use my previous plan) and when we know what works and what doesn't, that's when we use Renny's rage boosters and all of our signature techniques, where they'll do the most harm. The only reason that I used Impact's is that I have to use it early, if I want it to be effective later.

[Bard The 5th LW]

Well to be honest Gem, that is the fault of whomever made the post containing said strategy.

You have the quote, clearly you know who did it.

[Geminex]

You have the quote, clearly you know who did it.
I could go nuclear on Menarker's ass, yeah. But hey, with any luck Drac will admit guilt as well, and then I can anihilate them both!
...
Speaking of anihilating, where were you when those two were discussing this?

[Bard The 5th LW]

Reading their post and going 'meh, cool with that' because tactics make my head hurt.

[Geminex]

That's not a bad idea. Hey, Drac, Menarker. You win, we'll do this your way, whatever that way is. I don't like it, and Impact won't like it either, but sure. Let's try it. Have one of your characters ask Impact to do things their way, Impact will say yes, for some reason. I'll find one, and we'll go with the plan you propose.

But its failure will by your responsiblity, both IC and OOC. That a deal?

[Dracorion]

Nope. I didn't like Menarker's plan either. I was all for limiting our RP expending. I'll admit, I got rather carried away with Signature Technique spam.

But yeah, I'd rather go with this plan of mine:

Rachel: Leave combat to use two rage rockets on Impact. Leaves combat, so hopefully immune to damage.

Impact: Dark ambition, leaving him with 0 Rage. Use second adrenaline boost. Attack Frossqueen with Flamethrower. STAB super-effective. Request Swarm Bow in exchange for Flamethrower.

Charlotte: Spitz' Super Fang on Pegidash, Hammond to use Stone Edge on Pegidash.

Renny: Use Serene blessing (Charlotte's enforcer and Milsha to spend 35 rage to extend protection to Matt and Impact). Mollesk to use Rock Slide on Frossqueen, Swampert to Mimic Stone Edge on Frossqueen. We can test flinching another time.

Pierce: Tyranitar with Stone Edge on Pegidash, Blaziken with Overheat on Frosqueen.

Matt: Venomoth form, use sleep powder on Regina

Harliette: Mineral shot on Pegidash, Blissey's sing, also on Regina, deploy Illumise, Bug Buzz on Gardenoir.

Moon: Lanturn's Signal Beam at Gardenoir, Kingdra's Hydro Pump at Frossqueen.

Wilhelmina: Nether Shot on Frossqueen.

Trainer Attacks at Pegidash. If it's dead, target Frossqueen.

Gardenoir: Two quad-effective attacks.
Regina: Sleep Powder and Sing.
Frossqueen: Five super-effective attacks. Moon's Kingdra's Hydro Pump for neutral damage.
Pegidash: Super Fang, three quad-effective attacks. Charlotte's and Pierce's Trainer Attacks.

And I will never admit to being at fault.

[Geminex]

Ok, see, that? I could live with that. I still think we should hit Altarisect instead of Frosqueen, but your modification of my proposal, that could work. Though it still doesn't seem like enough damage... but maybe that's just me. Anyway, I just didn't like Menarker's Signature Orgy.

And I will never admit to being at fault.
No. You're at fault. You will eventually admit to being at fault! Admit it!

[Dracorion]

Ask me again five minutes after I'm dead.

[Geminex]

So, like, in 6 minutes?

[Dracorion]

Sure, why not.

[Geminex]

Ok, how about now?

And I've been thinking... We've been doing quad damage before, against Ruin types. You remember how much it took to kill one of them? Took a lot. If our current foes had, say, Omnisroth-scale power... would they die from our assault? Because I think that they have Omnisroth-like defense and HP. At least.

[Dracorion]

We've killed Omnisroths with way less attacks before.

[Bard The 5th LW]

Super Fang + Dragon Attack + 1 other attack = Dead Omnisroth

That's the equation from what I recall.

[Geminex]

Really? When? Assuming Super-Fang works... Last time we killed an Omnisroth, we cut its health in half, hit it with three quad-effective attacks. We also halved its defense. So if they're as survivable as an Omnisroth, it might actually be fairly close. And we're not certain to take down Frosqueen either...

Ok, and one more thing: Instead of having moon's kingdra use hydro pump, have him deploy fathom, and use helping hand on Impact. ^^

[Dracorion]

... Eh, yeah, okay.

[Bard The 5th LW]

Well i'm probably just imagining Omnisroth as being a bit easy because we've never fought that many of them at a time. I think three was the most at once.

But yeah, if these are all the strength of an Omnisroth, or more, then this will be a tough match to get through.

[Geminex]

Omnisroth. That's the big one, isn't it?. We've only fought two of them, ever. One in the vault, one in the mansion.

But ok, we'll go with Drac's modification of my plan. It might work.

[Dracorion]

Right, so:

Moon: Lanturn's Signal Beam at Gardenoir, Fathom to use Helping Hand on Impact.

Rachel: Leave combat to use two rage rockets on Impact. Leaves combat, so hopefully immune to damage.

Impact: Dark ambition, leaving him with 0 Rage. Use second adrenaline boost. Attack Frossqueen with Flamethrower. STAB super-effective. Request Swarm Bow in exchange for Flamethrower.

Charlotte: Spitz' Super Fang on Pegidash, Hammond to use Stone Edge on Pegidash.

Renny: Use Serene blessing (Charlotte's enforcer and Milsha to spend 35 rage to extend protection to Matt and Impact). Mollesk to use Rock Slide on Frossqueen, Swampert to Mimic Stone Edge on Frossqueen. We can test flinching another time.

Pierce: Tyranitar with Stone Edge on Pegidash, Blaziken with Overheat on Frosqueen.

Matt: Venomoth form, use sleep powder on Regina

Harliette: Mineral shot on Pegidash, Blissey's sing, also on Regina, deploy Illumise, Bug Buzz on Gardenoir.

Wilhelmina: Nether Shot on Frossqueen.

Trainer Attacks at Pegidash. If it's dead, target Frossqueen.

Gardenoir: Two quad-effective attacks.
Regina: Sleep Powder and Sing.
Frossqueen: Five super-effective attacks.
Pegidash: Super Fang, three quad-effective attacks. Charlotte's and Pierce's Trainer Attacks.

Threw in Fathom using Helping Hand on Impact.

[Geminex]

That's it. Maybe even better than my version, you use Wilhelmina better.
Let's do it, have Pierce suggest that they should hit Frosqueen instead of Altarisect. Impact will agree.
Let's do it.

[Menarker]

I just got back home and I'm getting all the blame before I could defend myself!

1: The current plan can hardly be called "defensive". I tried to make the plan really defensive, but Drac rejected it utterly saying that it costs way too much RP. But the current set up... Only protects Renny, Impact and Matthias? (and maybe Rachel and Wilhelmina) Hardly defensive in my book. I tried to propose the ultra defensive plan which still had lots of offence (since you didn't lose your ability to attack and still gained rage from that), but Drac rejected it. So I proposed something with offense that could be shifted into defence.

2: My "proposed" plan wasn't meant to be a defiance of your tactics, but a possible alternative. (Since Drac wanted to use his Co-Op technique and doesn't want to spend rage on using Protect.) Consider this. My contribution via Rocket Boosting the party could also serve in a defensive manner if you wanted to take it that way. The rage can be saved for next turn, for when Rachel can pay to uses more items on the party, Moon can put a Special Defense device (he could even do it the current turn with my plan), Renny could activate Serene Blessing, but this time with the party having more RP than they had before (and for when we saw what the foes had to offer). Other people could use rage for whatever they wanted. Offense, Defense. The rage could be saved for next turn.
Yes the plan could be used offensively (and I built it looking like that to plactate Drac who wanted to use his Hellfire above all else) but it could have also been used defensively.

3: I thought using Wilhelmina ability was good because it also boosts her defence by 5 stages. Plus with Slayer getting boosted rage generation and 2 attacks, she'd get 20 rage per turn. With a rocket boost or two, she could do her Signature Attack every other turn or so.

4: If Renny uses Propserous Gifts, he has 40 rage to build up on for Serene Blessing later on. A rocket boost and an attack later, he could use Serene Blessing the turn after.

So honestly, I'm just saying that having Renny use Serene Blessing only to protect 2 other people is an waste of his RP, since payment option is only available on that turn.

Nope. I didn't like Menarker's plan either. I was all for limiting our RP expending. I'll admit, I got rather carried away with Signature Technique spam.


Oh please, you weren't for limiting RP spending. You wanted to use Co-Op technique, instead of the Protect thing despite...
A: Pure Offense, Opposite of Gem's plan at the time.
B: More expensive (100 RP) than Protect (70 for 2 pokemon)

[Geminex]

Thing is, we have the choice between Renny using Serene grace now and prosperous gifts later, or vice-versa. And since all of our enemies have max RP, I expect them to use these RP. Hence, I'd prefer to protect ourselves (with Serene Grace), and not use too many RP yet, so that later, when we know more about our enemies than just their type, we can more effectively allocate those RP. And if you think that we're not protecting enough friendlies, sure, extend protection to Harliette as well, have Renny's enforcer pay. That'll mean just 8 potential targets for whatever our foes decide to do next.

The plan isn't so much defensive in that it avoids damage, but in that it avoids our most valuable assets from getting damaged, and stores our more valuable resources for when we can more effectively use them.

[Menarker]

Renny's enforcer is special. Her special ability makes her invincible for 3 turns. That counts as a good stall against powerful attacks while still attacking, and those 3 turn Renny is hiding behind her would also heal his leader pokemons and give him 50 rage.

Besides, I don't want Harriette or her pokemon protected yet. Renny gains equal rage when she or her pokemon gets hurt. That boosts his ability to help the party with Prosperous Gifts or Testament Drives or whatever.

Why can't Harriette pay for two people's protection? She gains rage faster than anyone else, would get double rage if someone rocket boosted her (50 rage instead of 25) like Renny or Rachel probably would, and we aren't using her Desperado ability now. And if she gets hit like I expect she would, she would get tons of rage back.

I'd be more enthuastic about the plan if there was a few more people protected. Would feel that my technique got its bucks worth.

[Geminex]

Economics time!

Your technique has a fixed cost, and a variable cost. The fixed cost is 70 RPs for yourself, variable cost is 35 RPs, for further targets. You also have a fixed benefit and a variable benefit. Fixed benefit is protection for both of your pokemon, variable benefit is protection for a further target. Your technique is being used most efficiently when the total profit (i.e. total benefit-total cost) is maximised.

Each time you extend protect to a target other than renny's pokemon (that is to say, you pay another 35 RP), you gain marginal profits. That is to say, you pay a cost and gain a benefit. Your marginal profits for extending protection are the benefits of extending this protetion, minus the cost of extending this protection. You should continue extending protection as long as marginal profits>0. Slayers and pokebrids are difficult to replace, protecting them has, I think, a positive marginal profit. But pokemon are lower in value. So I think, when you use that technique, you should only be protecting Slayers, or very vulnerable pokemon.

Though, considering Vengeful Rage, I think you're right. Let's leave Harliette unprotected.

[Menarker]

I knew about the above, but it's still nice of you to sum it up for others (and you did it accurately too. Although mind you, pokemons are variable in value too, depending on their stats, move lists and whether they can use Testament Drive or so.)

Well, I figured that since one can only have 100 RP maxed except in cases of Gaea's Second Wind, and Harriette already has 70. So, if we don't let her pay for someone's protect, chances are she is going to go OVER 100 easily, (since she's still attacking this turn and she'll easily get 25 rage and that's before she's get hurts. And if she's knocked out and revived, she's going to get a shitload of rage back courtesy of doubled Vengeful Rage which would probably pump her back up to 100.

Since we don't want rage that would go over that magic number of 100 to be wasted, I still think that Harriette should pay for 2 other targets. It seems to make a lot of sense to me.

I'd nominate Pierce's pokemon because if we think Hellfire is a good idea for next turn, they will be alive and Pierce will probably have enough rage by then to activate it.


THUS, the above plan, but editted a bit.

Moon: Lanturn's Signal Beam at Gardenoir, Fathom to use Helping Hand on Impact.

Rachel: Leave combat to use two rage rockets on Impact. Leaves combat, so hopefully immune to damage.

Impact: Dark ambition, leaving him with 0 Rage. Use second adrenaline boost. Attack Frossqueen with Flamethrower. STAB super-effective. Request Swarm Bow in exchange for Flamethrower.

Charlotte: Spitz' Super Fang on Pegidash, Hammond to use Stone Edge on Pegidash.

Renny: Use Serene blessing (Charlotte's enforcer, Shannon, and Milsha to spend 35 rage to extend protection to Matt and Impact. Harliette pays 70 rage to protect Tyranitar and Blaziken). Mollesk to use Rock Slide on Frossqueen and Artisect, Swampert to Mimic Stone Edge on Frossqueen. We can test flinching another time.

Pierce: Tyranitar with Stone Edge on Pegidash, Blaziken with Overheat on Frosqueen.

Matt: Venomoth form, use sleep powder on Regina

Harliette: Mineral shot on Pegidash, Blissey's sing, also on Regina, deploy Illumise, Bug Buzz on Gardenoir.

Wilhelmina: Nether Shot on Frossqueen.

Trainer Attacks at Pegidash. If it's dead, target Frossqueen.

Gardenoir: Two quad-effective attacks.
Regina: Sleep Powder and Sing.
Frossqueen: Five super-effective attacks.
Pegidash: Super Fang, three quad-effective attacks. Charlotte's and Pierce's Trainer Attacks.


I don't know why you guys keep editting Mollesk's second Rock Slide attack out of the plan. Rock Slide is forced double hitting in multi-target battles.

[Geminex]

Oh, you did eco as well? Cool.

And if she has 70 already...
Her technique costs that much. D'you think it'd be worth it, to replace one of her attacks with that? Not her own, or Blissey's but one of the bug attacks she'd use?

And I don't think vengeful rage would get doubled. That'd be just imbalanced. But hey, she'll get some rage for attacking, some for getting attacked, and then even more for being revived.

That's really not a bad idea, actually. I hadn't considered that...

[Menarker]

I did statistics, not economics, but quite a few people say I speak and write and behave very lawyerishly. And everything that you said, I already grasped in my mind when I made the technique. Not that I mind at all. Glad to see you that you know the finer details of the move.

Harriette's rage gaining ability used in conjuction with paying for Renny's Protect thing was all included in my high defense plan that was rejected and shamed. T_T

ANYHOW, what you think of the VERY SLIGHTLY revised plan I edited above?

Anyhow, I don't think we should have Harriette do the move. Aside from the benefits of protecting Pierce's pokemon, we're trying to knock out Pegidash for sure (Reduce their numbers and offensive ability). Quad damage helps assures that. Harliette's shotgun IS powerful, but it spreads damage instead of focusing it. Which was exactly what you said you DID NOT WANT. It would be good later, but for this turn, it is counterproductive to the goal of the turn, to survive the turn with fairly minimal damage while doing effective offense on select few targets while maintaining sufficent resources for the next turn after scouting their abilities.

EDIT: Oh, you meant the bug pokemons' attack switched with that. I still think protecting is better for the situation though. She'll get lots of rage back though.

[Geminex]

Oh, that's not how I see your move! That's how I see everything! :D

And Pierce can still use the co-op technique when they're unconcious, can't he? I just question the value of using protect on pokemon. He can just deploy new ones, if they go down! You all can! And I think that even spread-out damage would at least soften our enemies up a little. And since we'll be happy if we hit, Gardenoir, Frosqueen, or Pegidash, or even Altarisect, it's really unlikely that we won't benefit from it at all.

Swampert to Mimic Stone Edge on Frossqueen
Wouldn't this be used against Pegidash?

[Menarker]

I wasn't the one who chose the attack targets. I presumed that Drac thought that Super Fang and 3 quad effective attacks along with trainer attacks would be enough. And since Frolass doesn't have any double weaknesses, There needed to be another super effective attack. Hence Stone Edge. 5 Super Effectives for Frosqueen compared to Super Fang, 3 quad effective, and trainer attacks.

Of course, I'm skeptical about whether Super Fang would work. Otherwise, I don't mind either way. Frolass and Pegidash are among the top two in my "knock out list". Both of them would cause trouble to Shaymin, Pegidash to Magnezone as well as several other steel type pokemons in our team, and Frolass is a ghost type and probably has some nasty techniques like curse or Pain Split among other stuff.
That said, I don't mind Swampert using Stone Edge on either Frosqueen or Pegidash.

AB said that you can't use your Co-Op technique if they are knocked out. They can still use it if they not the active battlers or so, and status affliction like Flinch shouldn't be a problem. But knocked out stops it.
Example would be Renny's current situation. He has Mollesk and Swampert on the field now. If he uses his ability, he's calling Togekiss out as well, but not as a combatant. AB said in the previous battle that it being flinched wouldn't stop it from doing the Co-Op. Being Knocked Out however...

Hence why I opted for protecting his pokemon. Besides, they are strong attackers. And if one of those Geddon pokesapiens have sniper capability, having a one sided sandstorm will protect Wilhelmina.

EDIT:
Anyhow, I would be fine with the slightly modified plan (the most recently posted one) if you are.

[Geminex]

AB said that you can't use your Co-Op technique if they are knocked out. They can still use it if they not the active battlers or so, and status affliction like Flinch shouldn't be a problem. But knocked out stops it.

Riiight... then how about this:

Moon: Lanturn's Signal Beam at Gardenoir, Fathom to use Helping Hand on Impact.

Rachel: Leave combat to use two rage rockets on Impact. Leaves combat, so hopefully immune to damage.

Impact: Dark ambition, leaving him with 0 Rage. Use second adrenaline boost. Attack Frossqueen with Flamethrower. STAB super-effective. Request Swarm Bow in exchange for Flamethrower. Request bug-immune armor.

Charlotte: Spitz' Super Fang on Pegidash, Hammond to use Stone Edge on Pegidash.

Renny: Use Serene blessing (Charlotte's enforcer, Shannon, and Milsha to spend 35 rage to extend protection to Matt and Impact) Mollesk to use Rock Slide on Frossqueen and Altarisect, Swampert to Mimic Stone Edge on Frossqueen. We can test flinching another time.

Pierce: Blaziken with Overheat on Frosqueen, Tyranitar divide Stone edge on Pegidash and Altarisect (for 25 RPs)

Harliette: Mineral shot on Pegidash, instead of deploying second pokemon, use SigTech, "Desparado". Blissey's sing, also on Regina,

Matt: Venomoth form, use sleep powder on Regina

Wilhelmina: Nether Shot on Frossqueen.

Trainer attacks: Hit Pegidash, or, if that's dead, hit Frosqueen.

If it turns out that we need Pierce's technique next turn, Rachel can just revive his two pokemon (if they even die!), to give him the necessary rage. She can spend 25 rage to use extra items, so even is she does use her 2-item limit this way, she could still keep spreading the love, 25 rage to revive Harliette, another 25 to buff Renny.
It we don't need the technique, then we didn't waste rage protecting the 2 mons.

And besides, if we do it this way, then Harliette can use her technique this turn, and, if it turns out to have been effective, next turn as well.
Not to mention that we're weakening Altarisect already.

[Geminex]

Psst. New discussion thread. Also, the plan was readjusted one more time. Besides, if Harliette had used Desparado, she'd have been likely to hit Gardenoir for at least as much damage as Bug Buzz.

But you're behind the times. Read the new thread. Read the RP post. Then you get to bitch.