Westboro Baptist Church Still Stupid, "Thank[s] God For Dead Soldiers"

[Seil]

Link (http://www.time.com/time/magazine/article/0,9171,2021068,00.html)

http://graphics8.nytimes.com/images/2007/10/26/us/26funeral.650.jpg

So I was reading TIME today - my copy of Shiny Things Inc. was back-ordered - and I past by this article. 'Cause the site won't show it in it's entirety, here's a different link:

Link! (http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2010/04/13/albert-snyder-marine-fath_n_535221.html)

What happened is that Albert Snyder's son, Matthew Snyder died in Iraq. When Matthew's body was brought back home, he had his funeral. The funeral route - the route the hearse takes to the cemetery - was plagued with a few protestors, each holding up signs like "God Hates Fags," and "Thank God For 9/11" - included among the protestors was a thirteen year old girl. These were people who flew over 1,000 miles to do this.

Matthew Snyder is not gay. However, the protestors are not protesting gays in the military - they're protesting against Americans continued acceptance of gay people. They're saying that God is punishing America for it.

Mr. Snyder, a little upset that people shouted that his son was going to hell during his funeral, sued the protestors. (http://blogs.kansascity.com/files/findlaw.pdf) That link is to the court transcript. This one is to a story on the trial. (http://www.nytimes.com/2007/10/26/us/26funeral.html?_r=1)

Snyder sued for emotional distress, while Westboro Baptist maintained a defence of free speech. Guess what - Westboro won:

Now, more than four years after his son died in a Humvee accident in Iraq, Snyder's legal battle is headed to the Supreme Court. And his tireless efforts have drawn support from across the country, including a wave of donations after he was ordered to pay the church's court costs – a $16,500 judgment that the congregation plans to use for more protests.

Well, Snyder won first - gaining a large sum in the millions of dollars, if I remember the TIME article correctly. But Westboro appealed, and won. The good news is that the fee has been paid more than full by supporters of Snyder and haters of the baptist church.

What the fuck. Terry Jones wants to burn qurans, (http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20100907/ap_on_re_us/quran_burning) and Westboro supporters are holding up signs saying "Thank God For 9/11."

There's just no words to describe the evil of the Phelps clan:

http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_kApto83SZK4/SLWQjvJx-ZI/AAAAAAAABdE/Tn1uFwWtSyI/s400/fred_phelps.jpghttp://www.advocate.com/uploadedImages/Phelps_1.jpg (http://www.advocate.com/News/Daily_News/2010/01/07/Gaga_Goes_On_But_Without_Phelps_Protest/)

[Shyria Dracnoir]

You know, I'm all for individual rights, but endorsing forced sterilization of these kinds of stupid people is starting to look really appealing...

[Gregness]

Were I in the dad's shoes I would have sued too.




AFTER I put the entire lot of protestors in the hospital with a massive assbeating of course.

[POS Industries]

AFTER I put the entire lot of protestors in the hospital with a massive assbeating of course.
The problem is that this is precisely what they want you to do. It's a racket designed to try to incite people to violence against them so that they can sue pretty much everyone--you, the local police, the military, etc--and win money. It's exploitation of people's beliefs and emotions by a family of attorneys who figured out how to chase their own ambulances.

Westboro is not a church. It's a scam.

[Gregness]

The problem is that this is precisely what they want you to do. It's a racket designed to try to incite people to violence against them so that they can sue pretty much everyone--you, the local police, the military, etc--and win money. It's exploitation of people's beliefs and emotions by a family of attorneys who figured out how to chase their own ambulances.

Westboro is not a church. It's a scam.

Yeah, I understand that completely.


Still, it'd feel damn good.

[Amake]

So God is actually terrorizing America to rid it of the gay plague. That is the story you're using to sell people on your church. I can't wait to pray to that holy spirit.

[Archbio]

It's exploitation of people's beliefs and emotions by a family of attorneys who figured out how to chase their own ambulances.

That seems to be the gist of it.

There's a lot of people expressing heinous opinions in the world, but I'm pretty sure most if not all of them aren't actively trying to get the hate directed at them, unlike those clowns who put a lot of effort into that and only that. They'll admit as such. It's an aberration that the idea that it's a "scam" explains very well.

[Kyanbu The Legend]

What the hell Westboro. This isn't going to help the Baptist Church. More like hurt it, a lot.

Jeez you don't do that at a guy's funeral, out in the open.

[Thadius]

Well. I, uh, seem to be conflicted here.

On the one hand, while I normally never even consider religion at all, I have to admit, I respect this church for its cunning and shrewdness. A part of me, a small part of me, hopes and wishes that the instances that are pulled out and shown to the world are not in fact representative of the majority of the rest of the church.

The only thing that's preventing me from walking however far/short a distance I would need to in order to join this cunning group is the SHEER BURNING HATRED this story and many more like it have managed to pull from me. And then I remember why I hate all religions, shrewd people or no:

I HATE intolerant people.

[Kyanbu The Legend]

Thing is I always thought the Baptist was tolerant for gays/Lesbians.

Guess not from the looks of this. Unless it's just that one church.

[Nikose Tyris]

@Kyanbu: Christian religions aren't tolerant of homosexuality; it's a church by church basis. And unfortunately, Baptist churches have a tendancy to produce churches like this.

Also, charges that can be pressed and aren't affected by free speech - they violate the torts of defamation and trespassing. I think it may fall under hate speech too, but Snake and I would need to crack into a textbook to figure that one out.

In Canada, these people could be prosecuted. Damnit.

[Geminex]

Wow what the fuck

Are these guys just trolling? Yeah, that's it. They cannot possibly be serious. They're just doing this for the response.
These guys are the real-life equivalent of 4chan. Only less of the anonymity and more of the being complete and utter assholes.

[CABAL49]

@Kyanbu: Christian religions aren't tolerant of homosexuality; it's a church by church basis. And unfortunately, Baptist churches have a tendancy to produce churches like this.


Yeah, this. I know the pastor at Wake Forest Baptist Church who was proud to be on Westboro's hit list for a while because he preformed a gay marriage. It got Wake Forest kicked out of the Southern Baptist Convention, but he talked to his congregation beforehand and they agreed to it.

[POS Industries]

In Canada, these people could be prosecuted. Damnit.
In the United States, they cannot. And they know exactly how to do this operation (http://kanewj.com/wbc/) in a way that legally leaves them blameless for any and all backlashes against them that they can file suit over. They aren't trespassing because they don't do their demonstrations on private property. They get permission from the local authorities before their shows (these are shows, not protests), and if the authorities deny them permission, they sue for violation of their First Amendment rights. They do not directly target any individuals in their speech because that would be construed as assault/slander/incitation of violence/etc which would make their lawsuits fall apart.

They aren't real. They are not a church. They don't even believe the bulk of what they're saying. The only way to stop them is to ignore them completely. Let them do what they want with no one giving them a way to make bank until they've exhausted all their money in the attempt and can't continue.

When it's no longer profitable, they won't be able to do it anymore.

[shiney]

They'll probably also stop when someone at the end of their rope financially emotionally and spiritually finally snaps and shoots them. They have been poking the rabid dog for a long time now and at some point it will bite back.

[POS Industries]

I wouldn't be shocked if all these fuckers had million-dollar life insurance plans put on them at the behest of "Reverend" Phelps in order to get an easy payout in the event someone does go off the deep and and off any of them.

[Daimo Mac, The Blue Light of Hope]

I do not have any faith, but when I read stories like these, there is one bible verse that comes to mind.

John 11:35 Jesus wept.

Seriously, these guys scare the hell out of me. All I know is that I am glad that if they tried to do that stuff here, they would be arrested. Though I don't know if they are even allowed in Canada.

[bluestarultor]

Geez, some of you guys are talking like you've never heard of the WBC before. First things first, they're about as Baptist as they are Bhuddist. As in, not at all. They just picked something and went with it, then came up with a justification later. Real Baptists classify them as entirely separate from the entire body of Baptist sects.

Second, they're all family. I'm not kidding. Nearly all of them, by blood or marriage, minus a few. You could wipe these guys out in a single rampage. There aren't even enough to even justify passingly considering a tactical nuclear strike. Or even a proper carpet bombing. There were only 71 of them in 2007 and are probably still less than 100 of them.

Thirdly, they're even condemned as extreme by other extreme sects.



Like, seriously, I'm not sure why everyone is acting surprised, here.

[Nique]

It seems like a lot of you guys are not familiar with who (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Westboro_baptist_church) these people (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fred_Phelps) are exactly. (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cult#According_to_the_anti-cult_movement)

EDIT: Dammit blues!

[DFM]

Gaga... hates me?

But...

:(

[Fenris]

They didn't even show at my university when they threatened to a couple weeks ago.

[Daimo Mac, The Blue Light of Hope]

Considering what they are saying, couldn't it be called treason?

[Krylo]

I wouldn't be shocked if all these fuckers had million-dollar life insurance plans put on them at the behest of "Reverend" Phelps in order to get an easy payout in the event someone does go off the deep and and off any of them.

On the other hand when/if someone goes off the deep end it will probably be Phelps with the bullet in his head, so that's not going to be particularly helpful.

[Token]

Gaga... hates me?

But...

:(

Don't worry, Gaga loves all her children.

[Seil]

I think I'm going to agree with POS here - they're kinda like Jack Thompson. Ignore them and... wait, he kept coming back, right? Until he generally acted like a jackass so much he was disbarred?

Does that mean we have to wait until Phelps is excommunicated?

They didn't even show at my university when they threatened to a couple weeks ago.

Why is it I imagine your face as your avatar when you say this? It's probably the same face you made when you brought your poop-canon out specifically for them and they didn't show.

Gaga... hates me?

Gag loves all her fans, and wants you to join her army. (http://ca.eonline.com/uberblog/b193122_lady_gagas_vanity_fair_cover_loves_fans.ht ml)

[POS Industries]

Considering what they are saying, couldn't it be called treason?
Technically, I suppose they could be charged under the 1940 Smith Act, which is apparently still on the books for incomprehensible reasons, but all that would do is either make them go down in history as defenders of the First Amendment if their case is the one that gets the whole thing ruled unconstitutional or set a horrible precedent in favor of the limitation of free speech in the event that it isn't.

Neither outcome really appeals to me.

[Viridis]

I think I'm going to agree with POS here - they're kinda like Jack Thompson. Ignore them and... wait, he kept coming back, right? Until he generally acted like a jackass so much he was disbarred?

Does that mean we have to wait until Phelps is excommunicated?
We could try getting him disbarred (http://www.reddit.com/r/AskReddit/comments/dl5ol/i_hope_this_may_help_some_of_you_since_i_see_it/).

I have no idea how valid this idea is.

[Bob The Mercenary]

There aren't even enough to even justify passingly considering a tactical nuclear strike. Or even a proper carpet bombing.

Yes there are.

[bluestarultor]

Yes there are.

Sure, if you want to do collateral damage to a major city.

Well, it is Kansas, though.

[Magus]

At least Westboro Cult (I won't deign to use either "Baptist" or "Church" to refer to them) continues to show that, for all intents and purposes, we can find objectively evil things in this world. Philosophy kind of leaves a lot of stuff in the air, but you'd be hard pressed to find anyone outside of this cult that thinks what they are doing is anything but disgustingly vile.

[Viridis]

At least Westboro Cult (I won't deign to use either "Baptist" or "Church" to refer to them) continues to show that, for all intents and purposes, we can find objectively evil things in this world. Philosophy kind of leaves a lot of stuff in the air, but you'd be hard pressed to find anyone outside of this cult that thinks what they are doing is anything but disgustingly vile.Well the Dove World Outreach Center (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dove_World_Outreach_Center) (also known as the crazies who wanted to burn the Quran) sometimes has joint protests with Westboro but they don't really count, being just as crazy.

[POS Industries]

We could try getting him disbarred (http://www.reddit.com/r/AskReddit/comments/dl5ol/i_hope_this_may_help_some_of_you_since_i_see_it/).

I have no idea how valid this idea is.
He's been permanently disbarred in the state of Kansas since 1979, and agreed to cease practicing law in Federal courts ten years later. The rest of his family handles any and all legal matters on an official manner.

[Shyria Dracnoir]

So get the rest of his family disbarred then

[Viridis]

Seems I misread. What I linked to is actually about getting the 'Phelps-Chartered Firm' attorneys (the rest of the lawyers in the family) suspended/disbarred.

[bluestarultor]

So get the rest of his family disbarred then

I'd like to point out that there are effing seventy of the buggers. Seventy!

Hell, they could start their own orchestra with that!



Seriously, though, yeah. That should totally be done.

[Magus]

Christwire's satire on Fred Phelps continues to get chuckles from me. (http://christwire.org/2010/04/pastor-fred-phelps-is-not-a-secret-gay-pedophile/)

I am completely fed up with the gossip, blog posts and innuendos so let me state this very clearly: Pastor Fred Phelps is not a secret gay pedophile! I don’t know what liberal underground organization has been spreading these nasty rumors but they are wholly unproven and offensive. In fact, no one in Pastor Fred’s organization has confirmed these vicious statements and the pastor himself is happily married and has even fathered several children. Let me assure you, we ARE NOT on the verge of another Ted Haggard-type scandal. Yes, Phelps does live in close quarters with many barrel-chested young men (it’s Kansas after all!) and he is a self-admitted expert on the indulgences of homosexual fornication. And yes, “Fred never, ever misses a Pride parade!” as one gay circuit party promoter has noted, but like many Christian thinkers today he finds it necessary to experience gay environments firsthand for his work. Homosexuality is one of those “cutting edge” issues that people of faith must deal with. Those of us who humbly seek to educate our brothers and sisters about the dangers of sodomy and gay male love need to be deeply informed about all aspects of homosexual activity, no matter how intimate or disgusting.

Phelps belongs to a new breed of Christians like Peter LaBarbera, NOM’s Brian Brown, Family Research Council’s Tony Perkins and journalists such as myself, respected men who have dedicated their lives to ferreting out the homosexuals in our midst. Many of us have sacrificed families and marriage to get into the homosexual mindset so we can better understand how these lacivious and hard-bodied perverts live their lives, why they desire our young and hearty men, and what can be done to stop their unnatural cravings for utter dominance. We live and breathe the gay world. It’s a dangerous task and there are many amongst us who have fallen prey to the dangers of the male-on-male lifestyle, but we must join together and be strong for our work is noble and important!


fred phelps and homosexuality

In the past, Fred Phelps has drawn the ire of many for his provocative stances on homosexuality. From protesting the funerals of Iraq War veterans to coining the slogan, “God Hates Fags,” Pastor Phelps’ Westboro Baptist Church has been at the center of many, many controversies. He even supported Al Gore’s candidacy in 1988 and has received awards from the NAACP. Rumors of him primping in his best clothes for the many gay pride marches he attends are fabulously exaggerated, however, as are the suggestions that he has wandering eyes whenever the floral floats of leather men pass his way. I also realize that since he is a preacher there may be accusations out there that Fred has a history of abusing children and has led an active, albeit secret, gay life. Some have even suggested that he has used his anti-gay rhetoric to hide his flamboyant sexual orientation. According to the liberals, this type of excessive homophobia often masks deep feelings of inadequacy due to one’s true sexual nature and acts. “He’s a case study of the self-hating gay,” one expert has lamented. But what is psychology but a tool of the weak-minded to gain access to state-funded drugs and disability payments?

Anyone can see that Phelps is obsessed with homosexuals, but out of disgust, not an incessantly throbbing physical need. Those close to him have denied that Pastor Phelps has engaged in any recent overt acts of homosexuality, nor that he has used his official computers to download large amounts for gay porn, “other than for research purposes.” And although the family sleeps in close quarters and the sweaty farm boys are often left alone with Phelps, local authorities have no recent police records of sexual abuse at the secretive church compound that some liberal groups liken to a cult in the manner of the Branch Davidians or Warren Jeff’s Fundamentalist Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints.

One person close to Phelps noted it would be very difficult for him to have a secret gay life. “He’s too well known in Topeka, so he’d have to be paying male prostitutes like Ted Haggard or sexually abusing his handsome male relatives, but he’s definitely not hanging out at the local homosexual bathhouse.” Another erroneously suggested he might be sneaking off for anonymous rendez-vous with truckers in public restrooms, “just like [former Senator] Larry Craig.” If that’s the case, it certainly fits his profile as a “power bottom” into “verbal abuse and humiliation, leather and dressing up as a Nazi,” according to one disreputable scholar who has studied tapes of the pastor’s angry tirades against everything from Sweden to sodomy.

So for the record, let me state this again: Pastor Phelps is absolutely not a secret homosexual pervert. He is not now nor has he ever been a member of any homosexual organization including ActUp, LAMBDA or Manhunt. Extensive searches of public records do not show any connection, and although many private documents and databases of gay organizations are unavailable to reporters because they do not fall under the Freedom of Information Act and homosexuals are sneaky that way, I am confident that Pastor Phelps has nothing to hide about a secret dedication to homosexual depravity.

[Seil]

Hell, they could start their own orchestra with that!

A crazy, evil, racist orchestra that doesn't really sell seats, they wouldn't know their mouthpieces from their spit-valves, and they'd regularly stop in the middle of songs to shout at the audience.

And all the concession stand is selling is communion wine and crazy.

[bluestarultor]

A crazy, evil, racist orchestra that doesn't really sell seats, they wouldn't know their mouthpieces from their spit-valves, and they'd regularly stop in the middle of songs to shout at the audience.

And all the concession stand is selling is communion wine and crazy.

Well, yes, but communion wine is actually pretty good, so at least they have one draw. XD

[Magus]

Baptists don't use actual wine for communion, they use grape juice.

I'd suspect this cult does the same thing.

DON'T YOU KNOW LIQUOR IS THE DEVIL

[The Sevenshot Kid]

Baptists don't use actual wine for communion, they use grape juice.

I'd suspect this cult does the same thing.

DON'T YOU KNOW LIQUOR IS THE DEVIL

These people are probably gonna end up drinking the kool-aid.

[bluestarultor]

Baptists don't use actual wine for communion, they use grape juice.

I'd suspect this cult does the same thing.

DON'T YOU KNOW LIQUOR IS THE DEVIL

But Jesus-! :wtf:


I'm not even going to try to understand that.

[Oron]

But Jesus-! :wtf:


I'm not even going to try to understand that.

I've been to a few of my friend's prayer services (or whatever they are called) at his Baptist church (I'm Catholic, mind you). He said the grape juice was more or less so they had a non-alcoholic drink. They see it as symbolic of the "blood of Christ" and not actually his blood drank in communion, so they figure they can simply substitute something in for wine.

I guess it's so the kids can drink it.

[bluestarultor]

I've been to a few of my friend's prayer services (or whatever they are called) at his Baptist church (I'm Catholic, mind you). He said the grape juice was more or less so they had a non-alcoholic drink. They see it as symbolic of the "blood of Christ" and not actually his blood drank in communion, so they figure they can simply substitute something in for wine.

I guess it's so the kids can drink it.

I forgot about that difference. That's a lot more reasonable.


Edit: Crap! I was going to rep you, but you're fake-banned. >.<;

[Oron]

Ah, well.

It's the thought that counts.