California; "Ban this sick filth!"; The Trial

[The Artist Formerly Known as Hawk]

I don't normally get involved in political threads, much less start them, even less so when they're politics from a country not my own, but I haven't seen a thread on this subject, which I found slightly odd, so I decided to make one.

Basically, unless you're a complete non-fan of all gaming, or have been living under a rock recently, California has been trying to pass a law to make it illegal to sell 18 rated games to under 18s. Now while this works quite ok over hear where I live, this is apparantly quite a big deal in the states, where until now, it wasn't actually illegal to sell 18 rated games to under 18s, and the worry is that if this law passes, then lots of places will stop selling 18 rated games out of fear that they might get prosecuted if they accidentally sell those games to minors, which would have a massively negative impact on the entire gaming industry, because if few places are willing to take the risk of stocking such games, then game developers are going to have to cut back on making AAA 18 rated game titles for fear that they just won't sell anymore.

Somehow this law got through to the Supreme Court, and today was the final day of hearing all the arguments for and against. There is a transcript here (http://www.scribd.com/doc/40744855/Schwarzenegger-v-EMA) of the hearing, which is both informative and amusing.

From what I can work out, the judges in the case seem to be mostly on the pro-gaming side, having been in possession of rational faculties and common sense, but we have to wait until February for a final verdict.

So, anyone been following this debate at all? Any americans here care to shed any more light on the subject or who understand it better than I? Comments, questions, humourous anecdotes to share??

[bluestarultor]

Okay, it's a bit more complex than you're understanding it. The whole thing boils down to recognizing that games are protected by free speech. This vid might help: http://www.escapistmagazine.com/videos/view/extra-credits/1961-Free-Speech

[The Artist Formerly Known as Hawk]

Yes I do get that, this was just a general "this is the basic premise" idea for anyone who hasn't heard of this yet. Unfortunately, the people who want this law passed don't see it that way of course, which leads to some of the aformentioned amusement in todays hearing.

[synkr0nized]

Okay, it's a bit more complex [...] The whole thing boils down to [...]

THESE SEEM TO CONTRADICT OLOL

[McTahr]

People go to the store to buy games anymore?

Maybe I'm just jaded by digital distribution as a PC gamer, but I don't think I've been inside a Gamestop in months.

[bluestarultor]

Yes I do get that, this was just a general "this is the basic premise" idea for anyone who hasn't heard of this yet. Unfortunately, the people who want this law passed don't see it that way of course, which leads to some of the aformentioned amusement in todays hearing.

Well, to be frank, I've been following this for quite some time. The decision is already basically made, you said, and the projected outcome is pretty well what's been expected all along. I think we actually did have a thread on this a few months ago. The studies California cited were torn to shreds so small the shreds of the shreds were torn to shreds by the scientific community at large.

I guess I'm just a bit surprised you haven't heard about it until now. I really can't find much to discuss myself, but others might be a bit more creative.

[synkr0nized]

People go to the store to buy games anymore?

I do.

While I get that digital distribution will let me re-download and all that and still gives me the same access to a serial key or the like when needed, I prefer to have a physical copy.

I've had people tell me that's dumb, but I don't get why? Like, what's wrong with wanting a tangible proof of ownership and means to install, minus newer patches, that doesn't require logging in to something and being connected to the Internet? Hell, I am not even a fan of physical copies for any kind of pirating reason (though I suspect it'd be just as easy to torrent some game regardless).


Also, consider console games. Well, most of them -- there are, of course, a whole collection of games that are actually only offered as downloads.

[Marc v4.0]

I go into Gamestops all the time because we have 3 Gamestops in my area that are staffed by people who know what they are doing and are cool dudes.

[Fifthfiend]

I wish California would ban letting kids buy violent games so that I could have some kids and wait for them to get to be old enough to play videogames and then buy them alllllllllll the violent videogames so they'd be the totally cool kids at school whose dad lets them play all the totally sweet videogames that other kids can't play because their parents are dicks.

Also, tattoos!

[phil_]

I think this hasn't been discussed because, as people who have suffered through Mr. Thompson's heyday, we're all aware that gaming politics only matter so much as "Are they going to outlaw video games this time? No, just like every other time? Well, ok then." It's just the same discussion over and over again.

Now, if this could be a discussion of the sick burns thrown out by the Supreme Court continually in this hearing, that would be a new subject. Scalia in particular had some real zingers. Oh, and how the Justices all refer to video games as "videos." That was pretty amusing and I might take it up.

[RobinStarwing]

Um Hawk, I would like to point this out.

Reload this Page California Video Game Law Before Supreme Court (http://www.nuklearforums.com/showthread.php?t=38793)

I started a thread in September inspired by it being mentioned in my Game Informer.

[Magus]

Yee ain't ever gonna get it passed because it's unconstitutional. End of story.

EDIT: lawl that court transcript is some hilarious reading. The justices seemed to have had a pretty good time tearing the case to shreds. Sotomayor may have something about banning Bugs Bunny, though. That notorious lagomorph is the cause of more than his share of ills in this world.

[bluestarultor]

God, this is a hoot! http://www.supremecourt.gov/oral_arguments/argument_transcripts/08-1448.pdf

[EVILNess]

At this point I think the Supreme Court is just trolling California.

[The Artist Formerly Known as Hawk]

Well, to be frank, I've been following this for quite some time. The decision is already basically made, you said, and the projected outcome is pretty well what's been expected all along. I think we actually did have a thread on this a few months ago. The studies California cited were torn to shreds so small the shreds of the shreds were torn to shreds by the scientific community at large.

I guess I'm just a bit surprised you haven't heard about it until now. I really can't find much to discuss myself, but others might be a bit more creative.

Erm, I have heard about this before today. It was just that today was the final stage of the hearing and the transcript went up online, which I thought was worthy of mentioning. Do I really have to justify my motivations for creating this thread? Really??

Um Hawk, I would like to point this out.

Reload this Page California Video Game Law Before Supreme Court (http://www.nuklearforums.com/showthread.php?t=38793)

I started a thread in September inspired by it being mentioned in my Game Informer.

Ok yeah, hadn't noticed that thread. But I think the last post was a while ago anyway, dunno if it would count as necro to have used that one.

[Marc v4.0]

Some of the Grimm's fairy tales are quite grim, to tell you the truth.

Love It.

This Morazzini guy is just a beautiful fail-train running off the tracks

edit:

You should consider creating such a one. You might call it the California office of censorship. It would judge each of these videos one by one. That would be very nice.

http://dl.dropbox.com/u/4549162/SICK_FIRES_BRO.gif

seems appropriate

[bluestarultor]

Love It.

This Morazzini guy is just a beautiful fail-train running off the tracks

It would have been like 10% better if the opposing lawyer hadn't danced around so much. They were going way easier on him. It's pretty bad when they're basically saying "hey, we're handing this to you, just give us a straight answer to make the papers look good" and the guy keeps delving into politician-speak.

[Magus]

No, Hawk, this thread is fine since it brought the transcripts to light and they are quite epic.

[RobinStarwing]

I couldn't read those transcripts without laughing. It was like completely hilarious what California's lawyer was arguing was the same old same old.

EDIT: So basically, I'm a violent person because I watched too much Bugs Bunny as a kid? LOL! That Anderson study sounds like a laugh riot.

[Hanuman]

At least idiotic kids will blow em selves up in games rather than playing jackass with shopping carts and fire crackers IRL.

[krogothwolf]

Does everyone forget the dumbass Lawn Dart toys? Much more violent then video games!

[bluestarultor]

Does everyone forget the dumbass Lawn Dart toys? Much more violent then video games!

Well, the original ones were lethal, but they came out with new ones that have a half-sphere for a tip instead of a deadly spike.

[RobinStarwing]

Does everyone forget the dumbass Lawn Dart toys? Much more violent then video games!

Throw harder! Throw harder! You suck! *grunt as Lawn Dart is now lodged in spleen*

[Marc v4.0]

Well, the original ones were lethal, but they came out with new ones that have a half-sphere for a tip instead of a deadly spike.

Yes, weighed down with lead shot, because blunt-force trauma is easier to treat then bleeding gashes and pierced organs

[RobinStarwing]

Yes, weighed down with lead shot, because blunt-force trauma is easier to treat then bleeding gashes and pierced organs

Don't forget Concussions and Brain Damage! Fun for the whole family!

[bluestarultor]

Yes, weighed down with lead shot, because blunt-force trauma is easier to treat then bleeding gashes and pierced organs

Don't forget Concussions and Brain Damage! Fun for the whole family!

You guys are speaking to a guy who learned to throw horseshoes Frisbee-style with deadly accuracy. I never got the hang of horseshoes as a game, but as a weapon... :D

[krogothwolf]

You guys are speaking to a guy who learned to throw horseshoes Frisbee-style with deadly accuracy. I never got the hang of horseshoes as a game, but as a weapon... :D

We used hockey sticks to joust each other off bikes.

[Magus]

Don't listen to your mothers, BB guns are hilarious to shoot each other in the ass with.

[bluestarultor]

We used hockey sticks to joust each other off bikes.

Never did that, but we did a lot of stick fighting to teach ourselves weaponry to supplement the hand-to-hand we learned in Tae Kwon Do. This includes knife-throwing. Although we at least had the sense to reserve the screwdrivers and ice picks for the hill in the back yard in that regard.