THE WAR ON CHRISTMAS

[Kim]

snrk... Link (http://www.rightwingwatch.org/content/war-christmas-lives-resolution-ban-references-%E2%80%9Choliday-tree%E2%80%9D)

It’s never too late (or too early?) to fight the “War on Christmas,” even in January. Five Republican members of the Rhode Island State House have introduced a resolution to protect the name of the Christmas tree by preventing the state from using terms such as “‘holiday tree’ or other non-traditional terms.” The First Amendment Center first reported on the efforts of the five legislators to make sure that Rhode Island’s state employees don’t refer to Christmas trees by any other name. The resolution declares:

RESOLVED, That it is the policy of the state that state officials and departments refer to the tree customarily erected or displayed in celebration of the period from Thanksgiving of each year to January of the following year as a ‘Christmas tree’ and not as a ‘holiday tree’ or other non-traditional terms; and

RESOLVED, Further that the Secretary of State be and he hereby is authorized and directed to send a duly certified copy of this resolution to each state agency and department.

heh...

hehe...

AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!

God Christian fundamentalists are dumb.

That is all. You may continue with your regularly scheduled broadcasting.

[TDK]

Not that I agree with the whole law thing, but why would you ever call it anything but a christmas tree? Its a CHRISTMAS tradition. Oh no, are we going to offend the jews and whatever by not implying they are included in a tradition they choose not to celebrate?

[Kim]

FUN FACT: Christians totally stole the whole tree thing from Pagans.

~tHe mOrE yOu kNoW~

This is why it's so hilarious. Christianity appropriated the tree from another religious group and holiday as a way of legitimizing their movement, and now that people are trying to make it less about Christianity and more about a fun Capitalist holiday for the whole family regardless of religion Christians are freaking out about how someone else is "stealing" what they stole.

[Jagos]

FUN FACT: Christians totally stole the whole tree thing from Pagans.

~tHe mOrE yOu kNoW~

I don't think it's steal so much as "borrow so that they can get more suckers into their religion"

... Oh... NM.

[Loyal]

I would have loved to see the legislative process on this.

[Fifthfiend]

TBH I think the best way to go would be for atheists and secularists and muslims and jews and hindus to go ahead and keep calling it Christmas and steal the fuck out of it anyway, basically because I suspect that this would make the people who are all super-angry about the War on Christmas even angrier, but leave them basically nothing that they can do about it.

[akaSM]

So, this "Christmas Tree" thing is what we've been using to celebrate the international day of love and family (and lotsa gifts)? People and their weird naming conventions.

[TDK]

FUN FACT: Christians totally stole the whole tree thing from Pagans.

~tHe mOrE yOu kNoW~

This is why it's so hilarious. Christianity appropriated the tree from another religious group and holiday as a way of legitimizing their movement, and now that people are trying to make it less about Christianity and more about a fun Capitalist holiday for the whole family regardless of religion Christians are freaking out about how someone else is "stealing" what they stole.

It wasn't the tree they stole so much as everything about the holiday (saturnalia/the solstice) except the name.

[Fenris]

God Christian fundamentalists are dumb.

This could have gone without saying.

[Kim]

There is actually a difference between Christians and Christian fundamentalists, wherein Christian fundamentalists, are, BY DEFINITION, those fucks who have a problem with religions becoming slightly less awful as time progresses. So, yeah, not going to apologize for saying that a group defined by their awfulness is dumb.

[Fenris]

There is actually a difference between Christians and Christian fundamentalists, wherein Christian fundamentalists, are, BY DEFINITION, those fucks who have a problem with religions becoming slightly less awful as time progresses. So, yeah, not going to apologize for saying that a group defined by their awfulness is dumb.

Flaming: Do not be aggressive towards or insult other forum members, whether actively ("John, you're a dick") or passively ("anyone who likes Pokemon must be retarded").

Replace Pokemon with Old School Jesus and yeah, I'm not asking you to apologize. I'm asking you to not do it anymore.

[Kim]

'Kay, I'll just go back to painting with my wide "Christians" brush then.

[Fenris]

'Kay, I'll just ban you when you do it!

[Menarker]

^^;

I remember some years back when people insisted on using the term X-mas because they felt that taking the word "Christ" away from "Christmas" made it more secular and thus universally fitting.

Too bad they don't know that the X is greek and it is the first letter of the word that means Christ.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Xmas

So... yeah. That war on Christmas thing... absurd.

[Kim]

You'll start cracking down on when people call Republicans and Conservatives amoral/sociopathic/ignorant/stupid/jackasses or various combinations of those, too, right? I mean, if I can't insult a movement more or less defined as "we want religion the way it was before women could vote," why should I be able to when they're the same but slightly more subtle about it?

I mean, I essentially went out of my way to specify, "The awful elements of this group are awful" and opposed to "Man this group is awful" and while what you enforce and how you enforce it is totally your deal, saying I can't be mean to Christian fundamentalists in a broad way like that while the administration is simultaneously okay with similar behavior toward a very similar group seems inconsistent.

[Fenris]

The entirety of your post was calling this group stupid.

That is where your case is different than the rest.

[Thadius]

Would not a rose by any other name smell as sweet? Similarly, it doesn't matter what you CALL a tree. Or what you call the season. By now it is so ingrained in our minds to be a season of giving, of loving, of caring, and of being less of a dick than usual, that you could call it the day of Fenrismas and we'd still celebrate it.

So I have to laugh. Really. The only other option is weep for the stupidity for our country, and I'd rather not. Laughing is much more fun.

[Kim]

The entirety of your post was calling this group stupid.

That is where your case is different than the rest.

The War on Christmas bullshit is a Christian fundamentalist thing. Unless I forgot about ATHEISTS TO DEFEND CHRISTMAS FROM OTHER ATHEISTS or something. Like, that is one of their deals. So, when you've got Christian fundamentalists doing a stupid thing, like trying to pass this law, as part of a stupid movement, the War to Defend Christmas, then yes I am going to say that the group behind a stupid movement and stupid actions is stupid.

When it is so bold-facedly stupid I won't have much to say other than it is in fact stupid.

If someone made a thread about rain and how they hate being wet, I might even make a comment that references rain being wet, as the fact that rain is wet is relevant the discussion.

[Fenris]

When it is so bold-facedly stupid I won't have much to say other than it is in fact stupid.

Then don't make the thread until you have something of substance to say, like the rest of your fellow forumites seem to have no problem doing.

[Loyal]

Fenrismas

Dear god no. This time of year is for spreading joy.

@Noncon: I'd like to believe there's never a good reason to insult the entirety of group X for being group X, particularly if the argument for doing so is "this group really is that bad, so it's okay." 'Cause if something bugs me that much that I really can't think of anything else to say, I'd rather just not bring it up at all without good reason. But maybe that's just me.

[Kim]

I guess I forgot about all the good and intelligent things Christian fundamentalists do.

Like trying and have creationism taught in schools as though it's equal to scientific theories about the origin of life and the like. (BUT ONLY IF IT'S CHRISTIAN CREATIONISM)

Or try and maintain Christianity's role in numerous aspects of the government on the misguided belief that "THIS IS A CHRISTIAN NATION"

Yeah I have no clue why these guys have such a bad rep.

EDIT: Better keep us from making threads about how the KKK are totally bad guys because that might offend forum members who are in the KKK and we wouldn't want to hurt their feelings.

[Fenris]

NonCon I'm really trying very hard here to not ban you because I like you and I respect you but mother-of-fuck you are making this way harder than it needs to be.

I'm sorry man but I'm going to have to ask you to take some time off. See you in a few days, hopefully with a better disposition.

[Aerozord]

Pretty much my view on the whole thing (http://www.cracked.com/blog/frosty-snowman-declares-war-war-christmas/)

well mostly page two

[Fifthfiend]

Nonsie has a point in that _________ Fundamentalists basically are definitionally dumb and awful in a way I think we can all agree upon but the War on Christmas shit, while ALSO dumb in a way I think many of us can agree upon, is really not at all something limited to those people we would consider Christian Fundamentalists so identifying them as such, when really there is a broad spectrum including many Christians who take many non-terrible positions on issues nonetheless take this terrible position, it seems like you are expanding "Christian Fundamentalists" to include basically all Christians, or at least a much much larger subset of them than is probably justifiable.

[Aerozord]

well no, while I think War on Christmas is stupid, I also think those that insist on being PC about it are just as stupid. You aren't ignoring non-christians by saying merry christmas and you aren't lessening christmas by saying happy holidays. In grand scheme of things anyone that cares about either is just being overly sensitive. Its just semantics that ultimately has absolutely no affect on your life in any way.

[Fifthfiend]

well no, while I think War on Christmas is stupid, I also think those that insist on being PC about it are just as stupid. You aren't ignoring non-christians by saying merry christmas and you aren't lessening christmas by saying happy holidays. In grand scheme of things anyone that cares about either is just being overly sensitive. Its just semantics that ultimately has absolutely no affect on your life in any way.

The "well no" at the beginning of this post gives the impression that you're responding to someone but I have no idea who or what in this thread that would be.

[RobinStarwing]

Ah isn't it just lovely? Here we are discussing the War on Christmas middle of the way into January. I maybe an anomaly but I'm right now sick of Christmas for the meantime.

I blame the five people from the RI State House and immediately move they be punished for inflicting this horror of making us discuss the Winter Holidays after we are all sick of them in the finest of American Traditions...

Tar, Feather, and than drag them through the snow in a one horse open sleigh.

[Krylo]

I maybe an anomaly but I'm right now sick of Christmas for the meantime.

I've been sick of Christmas since 2005.

[Professor Smarmiarty]

My last 3 christmases have been spent 1) In a snow filled park with some whiskey 2) In an airport 3) In the middle of a forest with no phone reception. Christmas is sweet if you avoid it. Though currentely you have to skip the whole of December and like half of November to compleely avoid it which is riduculous.

[Archbio]

well no, while I think War on Christmas is stupid, I also think those that insist on being PC about it are just as stupid. You aren't ignoring non-christians by saying merry christmas and you aren't lessening christmas by saying happy holidays. In grand scheme of things anyone that cares about either is just being overly sensitive. Its just semantics that ultimately has absolutely no affect on your life in any way.

~bothsieds~

[Bob The Mercenary]

Most Christian apologists I follow tend to agree that the best way to handle the "war on Christmas" is not to fight it.

TBH I think the best way to go would be for atheists and secularists and muslims and jews and hindus to go ahead and keep calling it Christmas and steal the fuck out of it anyway, basically because I suspect that this would make the people who are all super-angry about the War on Christmas even angrier, but leave them basically nothing that they can do about it.

I don't really know how you would go about stealing an entire holiday.

Wait...

http://www.laprensatoledo.com/Stories/2007/121207/Grinch.jpg

Well, I guess it has been done before. Little Cindy Who and her apple could fell even the mightiest Fifthfiend.

All I do on Christmas Day is open presents, go to church, watch the football game that's on then party a little at night. Not sure what more you could do to destroy a holiday that is already destroyed...or rather, turned back to what it was before we stole it. What with the emphasis on commercialism and revelry.

[Hanuman]

Stupid people are stupid, it matters little what banner they fly overhead. That being said, Jesus needs to come back and clear some shit up.

[POS Industries]

~bothsieds~
Yeah, pick a side! We're at war!

Oh wait.

[RobinStarwing]

How about instead of calling it Christmas right now (seeing as it's January), let's call it the Unmentionable Holiday till after Thanksgiving(US) 2011? Than we can call it Christmas again for about a month.

[Archbio]

Yeah, pick a side! We're at war!

Oh wait.

That's pretty non-commitally vague, but I guess no more than my own post. However, I'm not sure how my response was necessarily in support of the concept of the "War on Christmas." Precisely, I don't believe that there's even enough of a second "side" for there to be a war. It's a pseudo-conflict that came out fully formed out of the heads of pundits.

However, I think offense as well as ridicule is warranted at the notion that is implicitely expressed by Christmas Warriors that their religious customs are attacked if not given X amount of non-equivoqual linguistic precedence. This isn't the same as being offended by someone saying "merry Christmas."

[Karrrrrrrrrrrresche]

Jesus Christ.

Is who we're fighting for...or against...

Which side am I on again?

[Jesus]

Jesus Christ.
Naw, I don't need people getting all up in anybody's grills on my behalf. Can't we all just chill for a bit?

It's the holidays, after all.

[Archbio]

Which side am I on again?

Abaddon?

He's a side, right?

[RobinStarwing]

Abaddon?

He's a side, right?

Abaddon all hope ye who enter here!

[Thadius]

Hey how about this to shut everyone up?

You call the season whatever the heck you want and celebrate it however the heck you want.

I'll call the season whatever the heck I want and celebrate it however the heck I want.

If I mistakenly call the season 'Christmas' and you don't celebrate it that way, just gently correct me and I'll apologize. I also promise to do the same for you and not get offended.

Now fuck off and let me be. 'Get off my lawn'-mas is coming and I need me a shotgun.

[Azisien]

Naw, I don't need people getting all up in anybody's grills on my behalf. Can't we all just chill for a bit?

It's the holidays, after all.

I'm pretty sure Christmas is the anti-thesis of "chilling for a bit" but that might just be my family.

[RobinStarwing]

Hey how about this to shut everyone up?

You call the season whatever the heck you want and celebrate it however the heck you want.

I'll call the season whatever the heck I want and celebrate it however the heck I want.

If I mistakenly call the season 'Christmas' and you don't celebrate it that way, just gently correct me and I'll apologize. I also promise to do the same for you and not get offended.

Now fuck off and let me be. 'Get off my lawn'-mas is coming and I need me a shotgun.

http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_0YTZJpJ8Jp8/SWk8l7C6SXI/AAAAAAAAFJk/DoOLjTaDtYw/s400/funny-pictures-cat-scratches-post.jpg

[synkr0nized]

Abaddon?

He's a side, right?

Man, I already kicked his ass into oblivion. I see no benefits to taking his side.

[Magus]

Well I would say ostensibly Abbadon is on Jesus' side cause he is all about chaining Satan in the bottomless pit for a thousand years, but: 1. maybe he is just doing this 'cause he wants to take Satan's place and 2. how does Satan get out of this pickle anyway? Does he bribe the jailer? And is this jailer Abaddon?

Oh, wait, what is this topic about anyway

Oh, War on Christmas. Can we fight nonexistent things? I dunno. They have been stating that there is a war on Christmas for years now but if so they are doing a particularly bad job at prosecuting said war because it's still totally called Christmas by like everybody.

I mean at worst I had a bunch of kids wishing me a Happy Kwanzaa because they had no clue what the heck Kwanzaa was but it sounds like a funny word which is much more humorous than Merry Christmas which is pretty much old hat. Wishing people Happy Kwanzaa, though, still maintains a level of hilarity that Merry Christmas has not had for centuries. I mean, back when they first started saying Christmas I bet all the pagans and such thought it was hilarious to do since ostensibly they didn't celebrate it. Nowadays tons of people are, it's just not hilarious to go around wishing people to have a happy one. Kwanzaa, though, we can agree it is still pretty funny and/or ironic to wish people Happy Kwanzaa, especially white people because then they're all like "What, I don't celebrate Kwanzaa, haha, you young scamps!", etc. which in the spirit of Christmas is then followed by a jolly snowball fight.

And if you tell someone who does celebrate Kwanzaa to have a happy Kwanzaa they aren't offended, thus I feel wishing everybody a Happy Kwanzaa from here on out is the best course of action.

[RobinStarwing]

How about Happy Yule/Solstice! Us Pagans demand equal representation!

[Fifthfiend]

Yeah, pick a side! We're at war!

Oh wait.

This war, in which both sides are clearly equally at war, in our world where there is always one side that is exactly as much at fault as the other side.

[Fifthfiend]

I'm declaring war on people who call things PC.

and by "war" I mean saying that "PC" is always and forever a ridiculous euphemism for "not acting like an asshole".

I'm declaring Saying that PC is Always And Forever a Ridiculous Euphemism for Not Acting Like an Asshole on people who call things PC.

SO IT IS DECLARED

the gauntlet, cast

[Magus]

Since the main course of action to oppose you would be to start spouting racial epithets to thousands of viewers "because I can", I will defer to Dr. Laura Schlessinger, I guess.

Or Paul Mooney.

[Fifthfiend]

I declare pre-emptive war on Dr. Laura Schlessinger!

And by "pre-emptive war", I mean "Dr. Laura Schlessinger is one sexy older lady! Rowr!"

I declare Dr. Laura Schlessinger is One Sexy Older Lady! Rowr! on Dr. Laura Schlessinger!

...Call me, Laura!

[Geminex]

What's she a doctor in anyway?
For that matter, what's Dr. Phil a doctor in?

What are their relevant degrees?

[bluestarultor]

What's she a doctor in anyway?
For that matter, what's Dr. Phil a doctor in?

What are their relevant degrees?

Biology and ????.


Edit: Apparently, Dr. Phil really DOES have a Ph.D in psych. He got his MS in experimental psychology and his Ph.D in clinical psychiatry with his dissertation on mental treatment of chronic pain.

Of course, really, Wikipedia makes mention pretty much across his career of stirring up controversy and having run-ins with other psych professionals.

[Funka Genocide]

The language used in the resolution seems counter-productive from the Christian fundamentalist perspective. It refers to a period of time "from Thanksgiving of each year to January of the following year" while completely neglecting the inferred reason for the resolution, namely Christian mythology.

The tree itself is without any sort of biblical precedent. The symbology is just a wholesale import from earlier religious customs.

So judging by the limited information we've been afforded, this has nothing to do with Christian fundamentalism and everything to do with banal customs and mindless traditions that, apparently, are in dire need of defense for some inscrutable reason.

Do pine trees even grow in Bethlehem?