Miyamoto: "Nintendo Wii U is okay I guess sort of not really"

[Magus]

Is it just me, or does most of the news coming out of Nintendo regarding the Wii U seem obsessed with downplaying it and pointing out is numerous flaws? I guess Nintendo's new marketing strategy is "don't get your hopes up it's kind of cool but not really in the same league as our competitors why don't you look at them instead?" I do suppose on the one hand this is a step-up from how the Wii was touted as the ultimate motion-controlled gaming revolution, but it seems pretty dire for Nintendo that they can't actually seem to come up with much good to say about the thing. It's definitely better for their sales figures if I am lied to and buy it than if they just tell me up front it's not all that great. OR, in the best of scenarios, they make a product I won't be disappointed in and sell it on those strengths?! Eh, maybe they can at least focus on trying to sell the thing instead of listing reasons not to buy it.

Things the Nintendo Wii U will be the same or worse at than XBOX360/Next gen XBOX and PS3/PS4 (as pointed out by its own creators numerous times for some reason):

Online gaming (http://www.escapistmagazine.com/news/view/111261-Nintendo-Doesnt-Care-About-Winning-Online)
Playing movies (http://www.dailytech.com/Nintendo+Wii+U+No+DVD+or+Bluray+Playback+for+You+/article21910.htm)
Graphical power and third party support (http://uk.ibtimes.com/articles/166891/20110621/nintendo-wii-u-wiiu-console-graphics-power-release-cost.htm)
Probably isn't going to play Dragon Quest X (this would help it sell consoles) (http://www.escapistmagazine.com/news/view/111227-Wii-U-Fuddles-Merits-of-Dragon-Quest-X-Development)

This is not to say it might not be better than the current competition (this article for example points out that it will probably look better than the XBOX360 and PS3 (http://www.joystiq.com/2011/06/14/wii-u-graphics-chip-outed-as-last-gen-radeon-which-is-still-pre/)), but it doesn't seem to be attempting to push the envelope graphically at all. AND THE CREATORS CONTINUALLY POINT THIS OUT LIKE IT'S A GOOD THING. Well Miyamoto does, anyway, and since he's basically the public face of Nintendo now I think it is rather telling.

This isn't so much a discussion of the Wii U's merits. Right now as long as it has next-gen Zelda or Mario I think it's probably going to be fairly successful. What I really want to ask is: why is Nintendo's strategy to continually play catch-up with its competition, offering minor monetary savings in exchange for massive deficiencies...and then to point this out all the time like its the most amazing sales strategy ever? No wonder their stock price is taking a hit. They can't even prevaricate about how their new machine is going to be a wondrous and amazing new device to change the face of gaming forever! They just keep pointing out how it's definitely not that and you probably shouldn't really be paying much attention to it.

My advice to Miyamoto and his fellows at Nintendo: research the term "puffery" and then apply it to your statements. Attempt to sell your machine on its strengths (if there are none, make them up) instead of pointing out how its various deficiencies are actually apparently selling points.

[Amake]

The thing is they don't really have any competition. Sony and Microsoft are offering videogames for gamers, while Nintendo offers games for playing. They're not quite in the same business. What Nintendo is doing here looks to me like effectively distancing themselves from the technology porn hardware race that makes up most of the videogame industry, which furthers their distancing from the hardcore gamer fanbase, which makes it even easier for them to sell the crap we find insulting to basically the same target group who buys and Monopoly and Scrabble and playing cards. And if you recall the sales figures of the Wii, it's not a bad business. At this point they shouldn't even have to market their next thing in order to make it the best selling thing since Wii, but if they do they certainly won't be using its technical specs as a selling point. How many people do you figure base their purchase of an easy-bake oven on how fast it reaches the optimal temperature?

By the way I seem to recall Nintendo being a privately owned company that doesn't sell stocks, much to the disappointment of everyone who dreamed of becoming a billionaire and being able to own Nintendo and tell them what games to make. Where are you getting that their stock is sinking?

[Krylo]

The thing is they don't really have any competition. Sony and Microsoft are offering videogames for gamers, while Nintendo offers games for playing.

This has not been true for awhile. Kinect and PSMove both have lots of wii-esque games, and they both do it much better (Kinect via better control system, and Move through much better sensitivity and control). The only reason Nintendo still has that market is because they hit it first and cheaper.

Annnnd that market doesn't really give a shit about graphical superiority.

[Amake]

Yeah, the supposed competition is offering a late stage ripoff that's technologically superior at a much higher price. I'm sure that's cost the N man a measurable market share, but can you really call it a contest? I suspect there's more wiimotes sold than there will ever be Kinects and Moves combined.

[Professor Smarmiarty]

Nintendo is at a bit of a dead end- the "hardcore" market is limited and less profitable than other markets, the "casual" market has been saturated for a while so there is only one solution- move into prostitution.
Think about it- you're out on the town, you want a hooker but brothels are a bit seedy and a bit dodgey but then you see the glowing seal of approval hung above a door, and you know you are safe, you are welcome here.

[Locke cole]

Graphical power and third party support (http://uk.ibtimes.com/articles/166891/20110621/nintendo-wii-u-wiiu-console-graphics-power-release-cost.htm)

That seemed more like him going "Ehhhh. I dunno. Maybe. Depends on the price."

[Tev]

What will make the Wii U the best thing since the Wii is the fact that it will most likely be hundreds of dollars less than the competitions' consoles. Parent's use "grown-up" devices like actual Blue-ray players and Digital Boxes/DVRs forced on them by their cable/satellite companies to watch things. When they go out to buy a gaming console for their kids, the Wii U will be the cheapest thing on the shelf that doesn't conflict with whatever else they have already got plugged into the back of a TV. And if the Wii U supports Netflix like the Wii does or better for online streaming of movies....it won't even be a contest.

Sony painted itself into a corner trying to compete with itself for the DVD/Blue-Ray market. Microsoft fell into the same trap trying to convince adults that gaming consoles could take the place of more commonly perceived adult technologies.

[Locke cole]

I do like the idea of my system just doin' games. That's all I buy them for.

[Krylo]

What will make the Wii U the best thing since the Wii is the fact that it will most likely be hundreds of dollars less than the competitions' consoles. Parent's use "grown-up" devices like actual Blue-ray players and Digital Boxes/DVRs forced on them by their cable/satellite companies to watch things. When they go out to buy a gaming console for their kids, the Wii U will be the cheapest thing on the shelf that doesn't conflict with whatever else they have already got plugged into the back of a TV. And if the Wii U supports Netflix like the Wii does or better for online streaming of movies....it won't even be a contest.

Sony painted itself into a corner trying to compete with itself for the DVD/Blue-Ray market. Microsoft fell into the same trap trying to convince adults that gaming consoles could take the place of more commonly perceived adult technologies.
The average gamer is over 30.

Jus' sayin'.

[Magus]

By the way I seem to recall Nintendo being a privately owned company that doesn't sell stocks, much to the disappointment of everyone who dreamed of becoming a billionaire and being able to own Nintendo and tell them what games to make. Where are you getting that their stock is sinking?

The Wall Street Journal. (http://blogs.wsj.com/marketbeat/2011/06/09/nintendo-shares-take-second-day-hit/)Though I originally heard when it was playing on Bloomberg for about five days after the announcement, anyway (yes I watch Bloomberg). Not sure if it's still down because they decided to go back to talking about oil prices. Clearly their priorities are all screwed up. But anyway Nintendo stock dropped 10% in two days after they announced the Wii U.

That seemed more like him going "Ehhhh. I dunno. Maybe. Depends on the price."

Kind of my entire point. They seem very uninterested in selling their own product as anything. If they want to go with how it's going to be more fun than the games on other systems while being graphically the same, then they should focus on that, but they don't seem to be very interested in that either. They need to pick a way to market it.

[Kyanbu The Legend]

It really feels like Nintendo or least Miyamoto is losing faith in their consoles. I can't help but feel like Nintendo Wii U is feeling a lot like Sega's Dreamcast right now.

This downplaying Miyamoto's been doing, feels a bit depressing. Like it's their last console.

[Locke cole]

No. Don't even joke about that, dude.

[Kim]

This thread hurts me.

All of you.

Just... shakin' my head.

[Kyanbu The Legend]

Although looking at it from a different point of view.

Nintendo is letting the third party devs promote the system instead of doing it them selves. And down playing it is to lower expectations. Leading to better reviews for the console and less folks being disappointed in it.

[Kim]

Nope, still wrong.

[rpgdemon]

I just think the slate o' controller looks huge and awkwardly designed.

[Kyanbu The Legend]

What could I be missing though?

There aren't many other points beyond Nintendo shooting itself in the foot and having no idea how this thing's going to turn out come 2012.

[Marc v4.0]

Big Console Controlers, for Big Console Players!

[Kim]

RPG - The controller is comfortable, light, and doesn't feel as big as it looks. This should be the least of your Wii-U concerns.

Kyanbu - You're all making hyperbolic assumptions based on PR control that Nintendo desperately needed to put out because the weeks leading up the Wii-U reveal were filled with shameless, baseless speculation on the part of games journalists. You'd do well to recall how much said journalists blew the 3DS' capabilities out or proportion.

The fact is that when the Wii-U was shown off at E3, it was not the final build, and chances are they themselves aren't 100% sure on a lot of details about it.

Games journalism is in a sorry state where rumors get blown out of proportion and people shamelessly make shit up. Controlling these rumors is very important, and it would probably do more harm than good in the long run to let them keep going. So yes, Nintendo probably is underselling their console as they try to combat the mindless internet machine, but this ultimately doesn't tell us much of anything about it. For the time being, we're best off waiting until next year's E3 before making up our minds one way or the other.

ALSO: Magus, DQX not being a Wii-U exclusive does not mean it won't be available for the Wii-U.

[Locke cole]

Besides, Reggie was a lot more enthusiastic about what the Wii-U will be able to do.

I know he's probably lower on the whole chain than Miyamoto, but not by much.

[Ecks]

I'm getting the idea that they didn't WANT to put out a new console, and that the shareholders basically pushed them into it. That or NonCon's theory. That makes a whole lot of sense.

[Jagos]

I'm getting the idea that they didn't WANT to put out a new console, and that the shareholders basically pushed them into it. That or NonCon's theory. That makes a whole lot of sense.

If we're going with the first theory, why would the shareholders want Nintendo to put out a new console when the Wii was in such a dominant position?

[Ecks]

Pressure for updating to an HD format? Iunno, I've never ever seen Nintendo basically go and say "Okay look, we're doing this, but it kinda sucks. Don't buy it." They're usually more of the tone: "This is the greatest thing ever devised, and if you don't buy it, it won't matter, because thousands more will devour it anyway!" and "IT PRINTS MONEY!"

[Kim]

EckScizor... no. Just no.

[Aerozord]

If we're going with the first theory, why would the shareholders want Nintendo to put out a new console when the Wii was in such a dominant position?

my guess, market saturation. Eventually sales will drop simply because just about everyone that wants one has one.

Also possible they are looking to expanding just as sony and microsoft expanded into casual market.

I think thats kind of dumb though. If a gamer could afford a Wii they'd have one and if they cant afford another system well they cant afford another system. Have to wait and see, casual crowd isn't as big on keeping up on latest gaming hardware

[Professor Smarmiarty]

This is the exact reason why they would potentially target the "hardcore". Casual market isn't going to be massively fussed about upgrading.

[P-Sleazy]

To put the whole "stockholder pressure" theory to rest. The company is HIGHLY leveraged, like many Japanese companies. Interest rates are in Japan are MUCH lower than in the US so it makes it ALOT easier, not to mention cheaper, to fund your company with loans rather than equity. That being said, they only have just over 10 million shares of outstanding stock. Thats not alot. Especially for a company the size of nintendo. THe amount of control stockholders have is minimal in comparison to how much leverage the banks may have, but even then, I don't think they had much.

[Aerozord]

that and stock prices fell after announcement of the Wii U, so at the very least they weren't happy about it

[Locke cole]

Stock prices drop after any announcement.

[P-Sleazy]

keep in mind that the stock price had also been built up based on alot of rumors. So when Nintendo made the official announcement, alot of rumors went "poof" along with any stock increase for the expectations.

[Mondt]

This thread hurts me.

All of you.

Just... shakin' my head.

Nope, still wrong.
EckScizor... no. Just no.I see you like being helpful.

One more statement you think is dumb before you decide to actually inform us! :D

[Ecks]

Hey I had an idea and just decided to run with it. Nintendo's attitude toward prior consoles and innovations has usually been positive. I just find it strange that Miyamoto of all people is less than enthused about this particular project.

[Kim]

I see you like being helpful.

One more statement you think is dumb before you decide to actually inform us! :D

Well, you're all acting as though Nintendo has no faith in their console, which is quite honestly stupid as hell. Of course Nintendo has faith in their console and wants it to sell well. There are perfectly valid explanations for why they're saying these things, and among them is that this could very well be rumor control after how out of hand rumors got about the 3DS' graphics capabilities. Have we already forgotten sites claiming that the 3DS had Xbox 360 graphics, only to find out the actual product was closer to the PSP's capabilities. Wii-U rumors are going to get out of hand, and they have, and it's far more reasonable to assume that Nintendo is trying to control these rumors, but failing to realize that such fine folks as yourselves are going to blow said rumors out of proportion.

[Loyal]

I find it slightly humorous that attempts to control rumors about how awesome the WiiU's capabilities are have led directly to rumors about how lame Nintendo thinks their console is.

[Kim]

I find it slightly humorous that attempts to control rumors about how awesome the WiiU's capabilities are have led directly to rumors about how lame Nintendo thinks their console is.

Well, even my own thoughts are assumptions. I just think that "Nintendo's rumor control is pretty shitty" is a far more reasonable assumption to make than "Nintendo has no faith in their console they think it's going to suck it's the new Dreamcast oooohhhh noooooo." But that's just me.

[Ecks]

Well, you're all acting as though Nintendo has no faith in their console, which is quite honestly stupid as hell. Of course Nintendo has faith in their console and wants it to sell well. There are perfectly valid explanations for why they're saying these things, and among them is that this could very well be rumor control after how out of hand rumors got about the 3DS' graphics capabilities. Have we already forgotten sites claiming that the 3DS had Xbox 360 graphics, only to find out the actual product was closer to the PSP's capabilities. Wii-U rumors are going to get out of hand, and they have, and it's far more reasonable to assume that Nintendo is trying to control these rumors, but failing to realize that such fine folks as yourselves are going to blow said rumors out of proportion.

I suppose you're right about that. I guess I just didn't pursue that particular train of thought due to being a jaded dunderhead.

Oh, and by the way, 3DS grapical capabilities were blown out of proportion? I disagree. Ocarina is amazing.

Postan from a 3DS.

[Kim]

Oh, and by the way, 3DS grapical capabilities were blown out of proportion? I disagree. Ocarina is amazing.

This... really isn't debatable. It was sold as having 360 quality graphics before it was shown off. They scaled that back quite a bit since then. I'm not saying games for it don't look good. Ocarina of Time looks really nice. But "looks nice" doesn't mean we weren't misled about the quality. I can say the same about the PS Vita.

[akaSM]

Huh, I don't think OoT looks that great, e.g. Epona :/. OTOH, stuff like Kid Icarus look on par/better than GCN games so, I'm really confused about what the 3DS can do.

[Kim]

Huh, I don't think OoT looks that great

It can be hard to see what an improvement it is, but it really is a much better looking game than the original. Better shading, textures, animations, etc. The general sentiment is that it's not immediately obvious how much better it looks because it apes the art style of the original so well.

[akaSM]

Hmm, I'll have to look at more pictures and videos of the game, and if possible, the game itself. Then again, I'll probably get the game (and 3DS) anyway...when some a lot of money comes around. That thing ain't cheap D:

[Kim]

Find a vid that compares the intros, or use youtube doubler to do it. It really is an impressive difference. If there's a complaint I have with what I've seen of OoT 3D, it's that the audio doesn't sound as good as I'd like, just in terms of actual audio quality. Of course, the ZREO team has set my expectations for Zelda music pretty high.

[Marc v4.0]

I have to say, I could care less if they made OoT look any better at all, cause I am a sucker for my favorite game of all time

[Ecks]

I downloaded the 3d trailer for MGS 3D Snake Eater. Freaking awesome, and looks better than the original PS2 version. Also, taking photos with 3DS camera and turning them into camo? I am gonna abuse that SO hard.

[MFD]

So your theory is that a company is spending millions of dollars on launching a system they don't really believe will succeed? That they're throwing away good money on a crock of shit that will end their company as they know it (I.e. the Dreamcast).

That sounds the opposite of plausible. It's much mote likely they're distancing themselves from having the revolutionary new console that will change gaming forever. That's almost the only way to follow the Wii's success.

[Magus]

I didn't bring up the Dreamcast. Nor did I say the Wii U will be bad. Just that it is silly marketing to continually point out that it isn't totally amazing and great.

What I am saying is that me and America are ready to be lied to again by Nintendo. We need it. We crave it. More than enough time for fingerpointing and disillusionment after the thing launches and we all buy one and find out it isn't Electric Jesus.

OR we find out it actually is Electric Jesus. Because I am ready to look forward to buying Electric Jesus. Instead I continually am told that I should only expect to get Electric Mithras or maybe Electric Zoroaster at best.

[Kim]

Nintendo has confirmed they don't plan on localizing Last Story, Xenoblade, or Pandora's Tower.

[Nikose Tyris]

Suddenly that whole "We hate money" theory is sounding more feasible. [/teasing]

[Locke cole]

And yet, English versions in Europe.

[Ecks]

Dammit, they're pulling a Square on us? If Ocarina weren't everything I dreamed of and wished for in a remake, I would so be pissed at Nintendo... no I wouldn't. Dammit, 3DS is quickly becoming a "God damn I'm glad I have one now, because the next few games up for it are gonna rock!" system for me.

[ZAKtheGeek]

People get asked questions and then they answer them. I don't understand why you think lying is a good idea.

Online? No, they're not trying to be the best online company. The best online company will operate primarily on PC. Claiming that you'll have something better will just make you look like a fool when you fail. I will concede, though, that generally it looks like Nintendo still doesn't "get" online.

Movies? No shit. What did you even expect and who gives a fuck? It plays games. That's what it's for.

Graphics? There have been lots of waffley statements about that. Sounds like no one knows what's going on. Looks like it won't be mind-blowing. They abandoned this direction several years ago, so again, not really surprising.

DQX? WTF? Wii U has BC. It can play Wii games. Not like DQX is even being made by Nintendo or anything so I seriously cannot understand what this has to do with anything.


They have some crazy-ass control scheme and they think the way it works is gonna revolutionize your family or something. That's what they are making the console for. They're not making it to play movies and they're not trying to stroke off technophiles for the first few years before modern PC's inevitably overtake them. They also have a strange attitude about online. You can think what you want about all this, but they have their objectives in mind, and those are what they're working toward. If you ask them about something they are not trying to do, obviously they'll say, "that's not really our focus."

Maybe what you want to say is that Nintendo's focus is bad, or at the very least that it doesn't appeal to you. You seem to think they're trying and failing to achieve something, when in fact it doesn't seem they are trying to achieve that thing at all.