They still sell Sim City?

[Tev]

Well, apparently they don't sell it very well (http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/03/08/simcity-amazon-pulls-game-server-issues_n_2837747.html)...
Despite positive reviews from many critics, EA's disastrous SimCity launch might go down as one of the worst debacles in the history of gaming. How bad is it? So bad that Amazon briefly stopped selling SimCity not 48 hours after its launch.

According to the BBC, Amazon temporarily suspended digital sales of SimCity on March 7 after customers complained that they were not able to connect to the game's servers. While the sale of the game resumed after a few hours, there is now a warning alerting potential buyers to EA's ongoing server woes.

SimCity, the latest iteration of the classic city-building simulation, requires players to be online to play. That aspect is a game-changer in the literal sense; previous titles in the series were single-player, standalone applications.

EA has spun the change in design as a way to introduce a social element to the game, but some critics said that it is primarily an anti-piracy strategy. And the connectivity issues are not sitting well with consumers.

Outrage over the "Always Online" Digital Rights Management (DRM) in SimCity has spawned a Change.org petition asking EA to remove the feature from it and all future games.
But no, I recently started seeing ads for Sim city on TV and was confused because I was pretty sure that game died out in the 90's once we all started playing God on a more personal level with The Sims and its endless iterations.

Anyway, apparently this new relaunch is full of bugs and glitches (beyond the whole "trying to hide online DRM as social networking and failing miserably" thing) and is just downright poor quality all around. I'm kind of sad about that since I was thinking about giving it a spin for old time's sake.

[Bells]

There are a few Sim city-alike games out there. Cities in Motion XL for example... Sim city is just your typical reboot...

EA is burning out spectacularly, they survive on Hype and burning rage alone now... speically since they haven't caught up to the fact that you can bypass the "always online" feature in a pirated game really easy. So, it's pointless for one... and counter intuitive at the same time.

They managed to drive their very own FPS brand to the ground... they actually managed to beat a dead horse to death with that one! Then, there was the entire "Dead space is totally horror sci fi you guys!! srzly!", and now this...

Just you wait untill E3 when they annouce the new Mass Effect 4 Prequel will be Full Online Coop all the time semi-MMORPG game... just you watch...

[Krylo]

is just downright poor quality all around

I've actually heard the opposite, and that the real tragedy is that the game, itself, when you are, on rare occasion, allowed to play, is pretty damn good.

That said, with a launch like this, it may as well be complete trash because buying it is like telling EA that, no, really, you like it this way. Lube and foreplay are just distracting.

[Loyal]

As I mentioned in chat...

(14:29:51) Loyal: Basically Sim City's built from the ground up to support always-online DRM.
(14:30:20) Loyal: because something about game calculations being partially held server-side to help people with slower computers play the game.
(14:30:47) Loyal: so if your internet flickers, you get booted. And playing while on the go or in other non-ideal conditions is just not happening.
(14:31:30) Loyal: Further, despite the extensive testing for exactly that purpose, SimCity still pulled a Diablo 3 and failed to have enough servers running at launch to handle the stress.
(14:32:42) Loyal: There's also complaints about the game feeling too simple, and of cities being more like small villages in terms of size, and airports, and some other stuff that I don't remember because I didn't pick up the game.
(14:37:05) Loyal: But yeah, people are mostly pissed that a single player game once again requires a persistent internet connection.
(14:37:11) Loyal: And there's' no offline mode.

Citation on the calculations bit. (http://www.pcgamer.com/2012/12/20/maxis-explains-the-use-of-simcity-always-online-drm/)

I'm sure it'll be pirated eventually, but it'll take some time because they need to figure out how to get the game to use the PC for all of its calculations and not connect to EA. There's always the possibility EA's lying out its ass about this, but I imagine it'd be mighty embarrassing if their hail mary of anti-piracy turned out to be a bluff.

[Sifright]

As I mentioned in chat...



Citation on the calculations bit. (http://www.pcgamer.com/2012/12/20/maxis-explains-the-use-of-simcity-always-online-drm/)

I'm sure it'll be pirated eventually, but it'll take some time because they need to figure out how to get the game to use the PC for all of its calculations and not connect to EA. There's always the possibility EA's lying out its ass about this, but I imagine it'd be mighty embarrassing if their hail mary of anti-piracy turned out to be a bluff.

doesn't matter how they've done it some one will reverse engineer a way to perform the calculations client side.

Would require a packet sniffer and debug hook into the games dlls but the game being pirated is inevitable.

[Bells]

Actually, i know people were trying but i`m not aware of anybody actually succeeding in pirating Diablo 3 completely. So, with the information i have right now... yeah, Always online DRM actually "works" as a means to stop direct piracy... sure...

It is still hugely invasive, counter intuitive and unfriendly to the user. Ea is just shoving it down on us with it, because they are hoping if they do it enough eventually we'll just take it as "This is just how it is"

[Loyal]

NFL Player Chris Kluwe also thinks Sim City's handling is bullshit. (http://www.businessinsider.com/chris-kluwes-simcity-5-review-2013-3)

[Sifright]

Actually, i know people were trying but i`m not aware of anybody actually succeeding in pirating Diablo 3 completely. So, with the information i have right now... yeah, Always online DRM actually "works" as a means to stop direct piracy... sure...

It is still hugely invasive, counter intuitive and unfriendly to the user. Ea is just shoving it down on us with it, because they are hoping if they do it enough eventually we'll just take it as "This is just how it is"

no it doesn't, as an example Settlers seven is always online drm you can't even save games client side as standard.

it's been pirated and all of the protection schemes Ubisoft came up with are emulated client side curtsy of Razor 1911.

If a cracking group decides they want to spend the time to break game protection because they think the challenge is worthwhile it will be broken.

[Aldurin]

Remember back when EA had sensible approaches to development?

Me neither.

[Aerozord]

I am fairly anti-piracy, but I still want DRM to die in a fire burning and screaming. Stop punishing people who legitimately purchase your game. DRM turns the pirated version into the superior easier to use one. Stop giving them ammunition on why your system sucks

[Sifright]

Remember back when EA had sensible approaches to development?

Me neither.

Actually I do, but then again I still have my old Atari 1040 STe under my TV.

EA used to be an incredible publisher of games waaaaay back. Its only in the early 00's they went down the proverbial shit hole.

Edit: fuck me thats more than a decade ago.

[Marc v4.0]

Everything I've heard about the game, from people who have managed to actually get in and play it, has been very positive. The gameplay sucks you in, it looks great, etc.

There's just that giant, pulsating elephant in the room.

[Grandmaster_Skweeb]

EA: Ruin Everything!

The game is a shitstorm with a nice candy colored shell. The biggest problem here is beyond the unstable connection, implementing a system in-game that practically encourages fucking each other over for the sake of fucking each other over, disabling core game elements (cheetah mode, no disasters, no terraforming etc.) for absolutely no reason at all, the list goes on. Here's the gipper:

You want a refund? Sure, you can ask for one. But getting a refund is up to EA's discretion. Actually, don't even bother asking. We'll ban your ass. (http://techreviewsandhelp.com/2013/03/07/ea-is-refusing-to-refund-simcity-customers-and-threatens-to-ban-their-account-when-asked-for-one/)

And Cliff Bleszinksi wonders why people hate EA but love valve. Hrmm. Iono because valve doesn't pull this epic level bullshit over and over and over! Fuckin shitstain bootlick.

[Ramary]

I don't know, even if servers were peachy, all the micro-transaction plans and the cripplingly small city size would still have me declare the game to be not worth playing.

The server bullshit just makes it much easier to say the product is crap.

[Jagos]

I mean... They should have learned from Spore but that didn't work.

They could have learned from Dragon Age and the BS with the DLC but that didn't phase them.

They pulled out some spectacular ass-pulling fucktarded bullshit to go above and beyond the Call of Duty to show people in one fell swoop why DRM sucks, piracy doesn't hurt as much as bad reviews and there's a reason why they're the #1 hated company above and beyond Bank of America.

And to make this worse, EA KNEW ABOUT THIS BEFORE THEY RELEASED THE GAME AND DID IT ANYWAY!

Wow...

[Nique]

I just wanted to play a prettier, more granular version of Sim city 2000.

Maybe I should just play Sim City 2000.

[Marc v4.0]

EA: Ruin Everything!

The game is a shitstorm with a nice candy colored shell. The biggest problem here is beyond the unstable connection, implementing a system in-game that practically encourages fucking each other over for the sake of fucking each other over, disabling core game elements (cheetah mode, no disasters, no terraforming etc.) for absolutely no reason at all, the list goes on. Here's the gipper:

You want a refund? Sure, you can ask for one. But getting a refund is up to EA's discretion. Actually, don't even bother asking. We'll ban your ass. (http://techreviewsandhelp.com/2013/03/07/ea-is-refusing-to-refund-simcity-customers-and-threatens-to-ban-their-account-when-asked-for-one/)

And Cliff Bleszinksi wonders why people hate EA but love valve. Hrmm. Iono because valve doesn't pull this epic level bullshit over and over and over! Fuckin shitstain bootlick.

That link is horribly incorrect. They aren't threatening to ban you for asking for refunds, they are telling you that they will ban your account if you issue a charge-back through your bank.

You see, charge backs are when the bank or credit company FORCES the company you bought the product from to give you your money back, and then charges them extra for processing. It is against the TOS of most DD platforms because rampant charge-backs can cause a credit company or bank to refuse all payment to them in the future, and if you buy the physical product you also get to keep it.

Steam's TOS allows them to lock your account, as well, if you issue a charge-back, but they typically just remove the item from your account and lock you from new purchases for a time period.

Then again, if EA would just GIVE refunds when requested, like they should anyway, this could be avoided. A great number of the charge-backs are coming from Origin accounts with only Sim City, as well.

To make matters worse they are refusing refunds in some places, like the UK and Australia, that have Consumer Protection LAWS that make them obligated to give the refund at risk of being fined or even banned from operating their business in the country.


EDIT: Was actually thinking of a different chat log, nvm

[Karrrrrrrrrrrresche]

I can't even remember who I had it with but I swear somebody on NPF was telling me that I shouldn't think EA is evil and will continue to be evil in everything they do because of what they did in the past and here we are.
With EA kind of continuing to be evil.
With no sign of it stopping.
With Karesh still saying
EA IS KIND OF SORT OF PRETTY MUCH THE DEVIL GUYS

[lazy man]

What happened to that thing where EA published Dead Space and Mirror's Edge? You know, when they were going to try and take some risks for once and not just make diluted crap for the masses? When they actually seemed a bit decent for a little while?

Oh, wait, Dead Space went Gears of War on us and Mirror's Edge hasn't popped up in years. Yep, guess Karesh is right.

[Arcanum]

I've seen a lot of posts on reddit about people getting refunds, and a fuck-ton of reposts of that "gonna get banned for threatening a credit card charge back" thread, but not a whole lot of individual/unique "ea wouldn't give me a refund" posts. So yeah, take that how you will.

I agree that EA is literally satan's dick, and that this whole debacle is unacceptable. Still, I have friend who bought the game (and were big fans of previous SimCities) and absolutely love the game (when they are able to play it). So basically what I'm saying is apparently the game itself is pretty great, but everything involving EA is terrible.

[Aldurin]

Just wait until EA gets in on the whole console market and comes out with the SEGA EA Dreamcast (though admittedly they probably couldn't beat SEGA's sales with that).

[Bells]

i would love for EA to make their own console, cause that damage would be so great they would probably fall too hard to come back up ever again.

[RickZarber]

Maybe I should just play Sim City 2000.

Seriously though, why not? GOG has it for six bucks (http://www.gog.com/gamecard/simcity_2000_special_edition), formatted to work with Windows XP, Vista, 7, or 8 and Mac OS X (10.6.8 or newer).


Also, great quote from author Scott Lynch on Twitter today: "Comparing the SimCity launch debacle to the Hindenburg is not entirely fair. The Hindenburg had no trouble getting off the ground."

[Magus]

Once again pirates have tasted the pain with this--did I say pirates? Customers, I meant customers. Once again customers have tasted the pain with this amazing DRM!

[Arcanum]

EA offering a free game to those who own and register their game before the 18th. (http://www.ea.com/news/a-simcity-update-and-something-for-your-trouble)

No word yet if the game is player choice, player choice among a selection, or EA going "here's a game, take it, this is the free game you're getting." Knowing this is EA we're talking about, it'll probably be the latter.

[Grandmaster_Skweeb]

Knowing them the game'll also have shittastic DRM slapped on.

The latest lollery on Sim Shity is EA basically putting the fault on players for the game being too gosh darn fun and not making room for new players to join!

[Arcanum]

As said numerous times in this thread, apparently the game IS pretty darn fun.

[Flarecobra]

I'd say less Hindinburg... and more like this. (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Masbrough_boat_disaster)

That said, I'll wait for a bit to get it. In the meantime... I got some classic Simcity to attempt to play.

[Jagos]

http://www.ign.com/articles/2013/03/08/simcity-burning-a-warning-to-microsoft-sony-and-all-publishers-on-the-dangers-of-always-online-drm

If you screw with consumers, expect a backlash.

https://www.eff.org/deeplinks/2013/03/tale-simcity-users-struggle-against-onerous-drm

Customers and the public HATE DRM!

http://www.computerandvideogames.com/395022/ea-refuses-refunds-as-simcity-server-fiasco-enters-day-4/

And they will start to petition the government to avoid DRM.

[Grandmaster_Skweeb]

Here's another one for Jagos' links of grand amusement:

EA asks affiliates to stop promoting SimCity for time being. (http://www.computerandvideogames.com/395212/ea-halts-simcity-marketing-support/#)

Looks like the PR team is operating at peak efficiency
http://i48.tinypic.com/x5umoi.gif

(captcha: rack and ruin HAH!)

Turns out the european servers are buckling under stress too. What deliciousness this is.

[Bells]

i must say it IS kinda amusing seeing how polarizing the opinions are on this game...

[Azisien]

The game is fantastic. Maxis did a great job. City size is a negative, it feels more like SimTown, but it does make you plan more carefully. And you could just play in a large Region by yourself and micro-manage 16 cities, if you feel up to it.

It is also not the worst DRM or launch ever. I'd argue Diablo 3 was significantly worse.

But, it is still awful horseshit. Paying customers shouldn't have to put up with this shit. I implore everybody to download the cracked version and enjoy, and stick it to EA. Anybody with the unfortunate situation of owning the actual game, add me on Origin/SimCity and I'd be down for having a shared/NPF Region. EA should probably do some kind of incentive to their paying customers, reparations of some kind, once they get the game itself stable. Anything else just promotes irresponsible business, and they'll pay for it down the road.

[Bells]

sadly, this only changes when players vote with their wallets. There is simply no other use... cause doesn't matter how much people protest, if in the end of the quarter the executives at EA get to present their stock holders with record positive numbers that means their way of doing things is working, and that's just that.

Take this opinion for instance...

mf5Uj4XIT1Y

Just to deflect a bit from the EA rage... but also on the fact that the GAMERS are partially to blame for all the stupid shit we have been putting up with lately.

[Azisien]

Well, I guess Maxis is trying to make some amends after all. It's something, at least.

Message from Head of Maxis (http://www.simcity.com/en_US/blog/article/a-simcity-update-and-something-for-your-trouble)

The good news is that SimCity is a solid hit in all major markets. The consensus among critics and players is that this is fundamentally a great game. But this SimCity is made to be played online, and if you can’t get a stable connection, you’re NOT having a good experience. So we’re not going to rest until we’ve fixed the remaining server issues.

And to get us back in your good graces, we’re going to offer you a free PC download game from the EA portfolio. On March 18, SimCity players who have activated their game will receive an email telling them how to redeem their free game.

I know that’s a little contrived – kind of like buying a present for a friend after you did something crummy. But we feel bad about what happened. We’re hoping you won’t stay mad and that we’ll be friends again when SimCity is running at 100 percent.

SimCity is a GREAT game and the people who made it are incredibly proud. Hang in there – we’ll be providing more updates throughout the weekend.

[Arcanum]

Well, I guess Maxis is trying to make some amends after all. It's something, at least.

Message from Head of Maxis (http://www.simcity.com/en_US/blog/article/a-simcity-update-and-something-for-your-trouble)

EA offering a free game to those who own and register their game before the 18th. (http://www.ea.com/news/a-simcity-update-and-something-for-your-trouble)

No word yet if the game is player choice, player choice among a selection, or EA going "here's a game, take it, this is the free game you're getting." Knowing this is EA we're talking about, it'll probably be the latter.

:(

[Bells]

Azi, if you keep neglecting Arcanum like that, child services is just going to take him away and you are going to have to invite the child services agent into the pool and then remove the ladder of the pool to watch them drown... and it's just such a mess...

Also... here is metacritic being metacritic

http://www.metacritic.com/game/pc/simcity

[Loyal]

http://i.imgur.com/yojwKTz.jpg

[Aerozord]

sadly, this only changes when players vote with their wallets. There is simply no other use... cause doesn't matter how much people protest, if in the end of the quarter the executives at EA get to present their stock holders with record positive numbers that means their way of doing things is working, and that's just that.

Take this opinion for instance...

mf5Uj4XIT1Y

Just to deflect a bit from the EA rage... but also on the fact that the GAMERS are partially to blame for all the stupid shit we have been putting up with lately.

only thing I'd counter with that is why there are store exclusive content. Thats because major retailers have developers by the balls (well for console games). If, lets say Target, because I'm taking a break from ragging on walmmart and gamestop, doesn't carry their game thats a pretty huge chunk of their distribution just gone.

Of course the reason thats pre-order reward and not just store copy exclusive is exactly the reasons he said. Just saying even if we fixed the pre-order issue we'd still have that one.

Personally the only things I get at launch are games I plan on getting regardless. Not to say I mindlessly fanboy, its just ones I'd want to decide for myself if its a good game or not. If not, well they lose me on the next one.

[synkr0nized]

Setting aside server issues and what-not, Blizzard forced all Starcraft players to have a battle.net account and be online in order to even practice or play the single-player content. Many Steam games have no offline mode when they could/maybe even should. And complaining about that hasn't gotten players anywhere, so all the rage about having to be online to make a city seems futile.

edit: "Futile", I post, and not "not worthwhile" or "unfounded".

[Bells]

i dunno... i take Android as an example of this. If you want me to buy your app, you better allow me to use it even if there is no WiFi around... that goes for games AND regular apps.

Imagine that, i can't play some tower defense singleplayer game cause the tablet can't find my internet connection... well, sucks to be you, but that's an uninstall right there. ANd don't even get me started on Organizers, Planers and schedulers that require me to be online to allow me to create events or appointments for myself... for fucks sake, i just want to check my schedule for the day, i can do that without the need to merge with the hive mind of the cloud!

[Arcanum]

StarCraft 2 actually has an offline mode. However, I do not believe it was included at launch, and you still need a battle.net account (and you can only play the game offline if you've logged into your account online in the past 30 days) but at least they put something there.

[Bob The Mercenary]

http://derbyimages.woot.com/1855728/The_Reticulating_Splines-51o3ty-s.jpg

That's literally the first thing that pops into my head whenever Sim-anything is mentioned. I'll probably end up buying this game. I've been playing SimCity 4 and CitiesXL for a while. I hope even with all the cons the modding community gets as much content into it as they have in the past.

Maybe add a burning server as a disaster type.

[Sifright]

http://derbyimages.woot.com/1855728/The_Reticulating_Splines-51o3ty-s.jpg

That's literally the first thing that pops into my head whenever Sim-anything is mentioned. I'll probably end up buying this game. I've been playing SimCity 4 and CitiesXL for a while. I hope even with all the cons the modding community gets as much content into it as they have in the past.

Maybe add a burning server as a disaster type.

seems unlikely as game saves are stored server side. I would presume modding the game with out jail breaking it first would be almost impossible.

[Ramary]

http://derbyimages.woot.com/1855728/The_Reticulating_Splines-51o3ty-s.jpg

That's literally the first thing that pops into my head whenever Sim-anything is mentioned. I'll probably end up buying this game. I've been playing SimCity 4 and CitiesXL for a while. I hope even with all the cons the modding community gets as much content into it as they have in the past.

Maybe add a burning server as a disaster type.

You wont be able to mod this new sim city unless you pirate it, and that will take a little bit of time.

[Seil]

Hey, I just found out that they're making a Deadpool video game (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NoSmHYH02nk). So yeah, they're just throwing everything out there.

[Ramary]

Activison is publishing that one, but the dev, High Moon, made the pretty good transformers games so it is not dead on arrival yet.

[Bells]

After seeing the trailers for the Deadpool game i can say it's pretty dead on arrival to me...


EDIT:

Also, take a look at this...

https://petitions.whitehouse.gov/petition/institute-industry-wide-return-policy-video-games-rely-remote-servers-and-drm-function-properly/nMy1wrtC

[Loyal]

Let's have just one more article on the subject. (http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/2013/03/11/simcity-is-inherently-broken-lets-not-let-this-go/)
EA reports that SimCity is slowly getting into a state where it’s playable. Many of the launch issues are getting sorted, and soon it may well be in such a place that it becomes functional. So we should forgive and forget, right? Wrong.

Nathan wrote a piece about SimCity last week, discussing how the situation should never have happened, but that EA had done well in response. I don’t entirely agree. Because there was only one valid response from EA after the clusterfuck of SimCity’s launch: capitulation. A full admission that the DRM that infests their game was needless, a bad mistake, and that they’re working to strip it out for single-player games as quickly as possible.

Claiming SimCity fixed, by removing the server queues, random crashes, lost cities, server drops, and the artificial restrictions placed on the game just to make it run, is like claiming a broken leg fixed because you’ve mended the crutches. The game, by its very design, is hideously broken, and like Diablo III before it, it has only served to scream a complete disregard for sense and a massive disregard for customers. So what we mustn’t do now is say, “Well, teething problems.”

[...]

To see anyone defending EA and Maxis for the state of SimCity, even were it in perfect working order on launch, depresses me to my core. This self-flagellation-as-skincare notion, where gamers loudly and proudly defend the destruction of their own rights as consumers, is an Orwellian perversity. That it might be considered in any way controversial to call them out on their crap, to point out that no, always-on DRM is not an advantage to anyone, is bewildering. It’s a sign of just how far the gaming world has fallen into the rabbit hole of the publisher’s burrowing.

[Azisien]

I'm not well versed in the Glassbox Engine but I've been hearing some folks claim that there is some justification to the always-online because the EA servers offload a "lot" of the simulation calculations to increase the playability of the game on all configurations. And naturally, to make the minimum specs lower, as a result.

As an end user, though, just addressing the claim directly, it appears to be horseshit. All the EA servers seem to do is store save data, and authenticate stuff, and perhaps perform some of the regional-level calculations? Because once you actually load into a city and start playing, you can outright lose your Internet connection and it won't kick you out or anything (hey, already better than Diablo III). You can play for ten hours straight in that state, and all that'll happen is a little red error code in the top left saying no connection to EA servers. Which, if you've played the game at all, you are already used to.

So I'm wondering what exactly is being "offloaded" if I can play the game fine while offline, once I'm actually in the game and past all of the hula-hoops EA makes you jump through. Note, what you CANNOT do once offline in this case, is quit out and expect your city to save properly. I think your computer does have a local version of the save data though, because I failed to sync my data once, gave up, checked my Region on a different computer and it didn't have the save. But as soon as I logged back onto my PC and connected to the servers, the region was updated with the most correct, up-to-date information.

Right, yeah, offloading my arse.

Other than that, the game experience itself is definitely stabilizing. I'm still getting infinite map-loading hangs, though, pretty frequently. Sigh. Just wanna build some god damn gorgeous cartoon cities, man.

[Bells]

I'm not well versed in the Glassbox Engine but I've been hearing some folks claim that there is some justification to the always-online because the EA servers offload a "lot" of the simulation calculations to increase the playability of the game on all configurations. And naturally, to make the minimum specs lower, as a result.

In my own ignorance this might even be true, but as i read that all i can think of is "Blast processing" .

[Aerozord]

With internet connections what they are now its possible. Cloud gaming like onlive does exist after all so they definitely can do things like that. Not saying they do, just that its possible.

[Loyal]

There's always the possibility EA's lying out its ass about [Glassbox], but I imagine it'd be mighty embarrassing if their hail mary of anti-piracy turned out to be a bluff.

Wwwwwwwelp! (http://www.geek.com/articles/games/modder-proves-simcity-can-run-offline-indefinitely-20130314/)

[Azisien]

Wwwwwwwelp! (http://www.geek.com/articles/games/modder-proves-simcity-can-run-offline-indefinitely-20130314/)

Not to mention some official, unofficial admission (http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/2013/03/12/simcity-server-not-necessary/).

Of course anyone in their first semester of software development can see through EA's bullshit in a second. Maybe there would be a decent amount of overhauling to convert it to an official, offline mode, or let dedicated servers run Regional calculations instead of hosted EA servers, but having work to do and being impossible are pretty wildly different statements.

Anyway, my Simcity play finally reached a conclusion. The city plot sizes are just so small, it's not all that fun to specialize your city. It's not fun because you can only take specialization so far, and it's currently gimped by the fact that you NEED to remain self-sufficient because regional simulation currently does not work (-----> EA servers, plus possible design flaws on top of that). I decided to play with three friends on a plot with 4 city blocks all connected by Highway (by far, the best regional connection available, as you can share all city services with each other). I made my city, the middle, into a regional hub, with the intent of providing all power, water, sewage treatment, police, fire, health, waste disposal, and some education services to all three adjacent cities. My city would be extremely profitable from all that income, in theory, and especially from the recycling operation, even if my city did not internally produce anything.

Then, all three other cities would free up enormous amounts of room, because they need minimal, or zero, power plants, water plants, sewage plants, hospitals, police stations, etc etc. They could specialize to the max, and we would form a mutual dependency. This is the foundation of the new SimCity, the absolute maximum of the social capabilities of the game.

It doesn't work.

The queue to make services run through the EA server is so ridiculously enormous, I'd say maybe 5% of the services I offer actually get recognized in the other cities. The way the game handles offered services is also horrific. Firstly, there is no authentication on from either player when services are offered. When someone wants to buy power from you, they just click "Buy power" and bam it's done. The power exporter doesn't get a message along the lines of "____ City would like to buy power from you. They need _____ amount. Yes/No?" This seems like an odd player choice to leave out, especially in a city management game. You also only export if you have a "green" surplus of power. The moment you drop to "yellow" surplus (which I think is like plus or minus 10% of your overall capacity), you immediately stop all exports. With no warning messages or feedback that the game does so. Exports also only supply a BARE MINIMUM to other cities. If a city needs exactly 10MW of power to run, you will export exactly 10MW of power. And Gods Help that city if they buy even a single building and need 10.001 MW of power. Their residents will become angry, and their city will remain unpowered, until the rumbling Snorlax of an EA server finally ticks (this could take minutes), and adjusts the power export balance, which it would take to 10.001 MW. Hey, why not add in a safety margin of 5-10% to allow for city growth between regional ticks? Or, I dunno, make regional ticks every few seconds instead of every five minutes.

This applies to every single city service. You can't play a hub, so you can't enjoy that style of play, or really dig into specializations without juggling 4-5 of your own city plots. With rather long load times, this is a pretty terrible experience. Back to SimCity 4 Deluxe for me. Or rather, other genres.

[Arcanum]

My favorite clusterfuck news regarding SimCity is still the fact that the Sims use the same agent-based simulation as the power or water simulation. Sims will just move towards the nearest open job slot, and when they're done work they will go to the nearest open home slot. So you really can't follow a single sim throughout the day, 'cause every sim just goes the a random job and then a random house, as long as it's the closest available slot.

And if the path to the nearest open slot is too far or too complex, shit like this happens. (http://www.nuklearforums.com/showpost.php?p=1225642&postcount=3215)

[Kyanbu The Legend]

Oh EA, things just keep getting worse for you.

Not surprised that the game really can work offline and that the "always online" bit is mainly for DRM.

[Azisien]

My favorite clusterfuck news regarding SimCity is still the fact that the Sims use the same agent-based simulation as the power or water simulation. Sims will just move towards the nearest open job slot, and when they're done work they will go to the nearest open home slot. So you really can't follow a single sim throughout the day, 'cause every sim just goes the a random job and then a random house, as long as it's the closest available slot.

And if the path to the nearest open slot is too far or too complex, shit like this happens. (http://www.nuklearforums.com/showpost.php?p=1225642&postcount=3215)

I had to destroy and rebuild a fully upgraded police station because 32 police vehicles jammed themselves up, permanently, right outside the police station. A crime wave proceeded to bring my city to its knees for 2 months.

also lol
yySa34R0D_4

[Sifright]

This applies to every single city service. You can't play a hub, so you can't enjoy that style of play, or really dig into specializations without juggling 4-5 of your own city plots. With rather long load times, this is a pretty terrible experience. Back to SimCity 4 Deluxe for me. Or rather, other genres.

Now imagine that problem but the servers have to actually do all the computational work as well ala cloud computing.... which is what this game is the first step towards.

Yea....

[Ramary]

For people who want a city builder that is pretty awesome, and different from Sim City. (http://store.steampowered.com/sub/19282/) And for the next couple hours, only 10 bucks.

[Azisien]

Now imagine that problem but the servers have to actually do all the computational work as well ala cloud computing.... which is what this game is the first step towards.

Yea....

We need to collectively embrace this new server-first approach to EA Games, heavily laden with day-one DLC and microtransactions, and just buy absolutely nothing ever. But you know, keep them thinking that we might. They'll never see it coming.

[Overcast]

Ignoring every post before me I'm going to try to get my brain together on what I felt as I played through the first week I had in Simcity. I was stuck in for the first two days as they were having trouble with people being able to claim cities on their servers, I found little to help me until my boyfriend who had also bought it personally invited me to one of his little locations. It seems he has played little since then and I began working with no real direction through my first city. Rushed quick, did well, became well educated, conducted much trade with the global market, and it seemed everything was looking up. Then I made a rather significant screw up when one of my buildings deleted my nuclear power plant.

I could have recovered, I didn't want to.

Second game, rushed even harder, I worked toward a tourist center but at some point my nuke plant melted down. this created an continuous encroaching ground pollution of doom creeping toward the rest of my town and doing some measure of damage to my tourism.

Not sure if recovery was possible, but I definitely didn't feel inspired.

Between these two my largest problem so far with the multiplayer seems to have arisen. I have no reset button. Every time I learn some new lesson the hard way I have to back up, move to a new block, and stare at the remains of one greater failure while I attempt again. Something about that is just plain unfun, aggravating, painful. Unlike earlier simcities I am forced to accept that unleashing a giant lizard on my town is something I cannot take back after having my fun. Damning.

[Magus]

The only thing they will listen to is the sound of you not buying their game (uh, the metaphorical sound).

It's not like this game is THAT great--someone I know bought it and has been bitching that the little sims don't actually have very intelligent AI and tend to spend their time in different houses each night with entirely different families. Maybe SimCity is a utopian paradise without traditional familial demarcations, I dunno.

[Aerozord]

The self feeding loop. Because of the draconian DRM people pirate it. The execs go "Wow this game is really popular look at how many people are downloading it. If only they were paying customers. Oh I know, lets use even more strict DRM."

Its why I say if you dont like something dont pirate it either. To them every stolen copy is someone that would otherwise buy it.

[Ramary]

And now they are not even trying to lie to us anymore. (http://www.escapistmagazine.com/news/view/122732-EA-Admits-That-SimCity-Could-Have-Been-Offline)

[Bells]

I know what you meant Ramary, but...

In a newly-published entry on the official EA blog, Maxis general manager Lucy Bradshaw attempts to offer blunt honesty on the situation. "... could we have built a subset offline mode? Yes," Bradshaw states in no uncertain terms. "But we rejected that idea because it didn't fit with our vision."

"We did not focus on the 'single city in isolation' that we have delivered in past [SimCity games]. We recognize that there are fans -- people who love the original SimCity -- who want that. But we're also hearing from thousands of people who are playing across regions, trading, communicating and loving the Always-Connected functionality."

This is hardly "not even trying to lie"

I mean, for fucks sake!! this is so stupid and shaddy, it's right down insulting... Do these companies actually truly believe we as consumers are THIS stupid!? To believe THAT?! For fucks sake!!

[Ramary]

Do these companies actually truly believe we as consumers are THIS stupid!? To believe THAT?! For fucks sake!!

Yes.

---------- Post added at 04:15 PM ---------- Previous post was at 04:12 PM ----------

And yeah maybe I should of said "Not trying to lie about the offline part, but still lying about everything else right down to what they had for lunch".

[Aerozord]

I know what you meant Ramary, but...



This is hardly "not even trying to lie"

I mean, for fucks sake!! this is so stupid and shaddy, it's right down insulting... Do these companies actually truly believe we as consumers are THIS stupid!? To believe THAT?! For fucks sake!!

to be more exact, those that currently believe it was just DRM, well nothing they say will convince people otherwise. However this will certainly be enough to keep those that believe there was just cause to continue thinking thus

[Azisien]

It's not like this game is THAT great--someone I know bought it and has been bitching that the little sims don't actually have very intelligent AI and tend to spend their time in different houses each night with entirely different families. Maybe SimCity is a utopian paradise without traditional familial demarcations, I dunno.

Well, one has to assume one likes the city/empire building genre of course, but that being said, and assuming all of the game systems were in working order on launch instead of butt-blasted by EA servers for weeks, it's a pretty great game. I feel bad for the actual game designers, who designed a pretty great game, feasted upon daily by the vampiric game producers, who in turn were soul-sacrificed by publisher executives. Standard practice, though, so what can ya do?

[Tev]

Good news, everyone? (http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/03/18/john-riccitiello-ea-resigns_n_2902864.html?utm_hp_ref=technology)

SAN FRANCISCO (Reuters) - Electronic Arts' Chief Executive Officer John Riccitiello has resigned, saying he was "accountable" for the company's missing operational targets.

Riccitiello will step down from his post as CEO and member of the board of directors on March 30, the video game company said on Monday.

One down over this disaster....how many more to go?

[Bells]

Wait for it... first we must see if this is a Hydra scenario, one head goes down, 2 more pop back in its place.

Gotta see who is taking over for him...

I would like to imagine though that he was simply sick of having his name tied to EA...

[Aerozord]

I do feel the need to point out that by virtue of taking responsibility, that also means the only one that believes in accountability has stepped down.

Kind of a catch-22. The ones you really want to see let go are the ones continually going "well its not MY fault."