New Super Smash Brothers games thread

[Flarecobra]

Because apperentally no one made one yet.

Anyway, we got a returning character... Olimar and his Pikmin buddies are returning to pick a fight. (http://www.ign.com/articles/2013/07/12/pikmin-olimar-join-new-smash-bros-roster) [/bricked]

[Magus]

Also

There's a little guy

named

MEGA MAN

in those

[Bells]

I'll be 100% honest and say that Wiifit trainer AND megaman almost made me buy a WiiU

[PyrosNine]

Why does Pyros not have money? WRRRY? I'd sell my soul for a Wii U, but that's what I did for a Wii and apparently cat souls have depreciated in the current era due to crazy cat lady breeding farms.

I only care about Kirby though. He's my man. Sheik's cool too and all and I could probably roll a tourney with her, but Kirby is inherently part of my asskicking. Also, Kirby eats Megaman and explodes, destroying the arena and knocking out all opponents, with the result being a tie in Kirby and Megaman's Favor.

It is their final smash.

[Flarecobra]

Keep in mind, the game's coming out for the 3DS too.

[Grandmaster_Skweeb]

Why does Pyros not have money? WRRRY? I'd sell my soul for a Wii U, but that's what I did for a Wii and apparently cat souls have depreciated in the current era due to crazy cat lady breeding farms.


Funny thing is I have a wii-u but no money to buy the game!

[Azisien]

Since I'll never own a Wii-U unless someone offers it to me for $10, I'll probably get the 3DS version. I'm not sure how I feel about the visuals on the 3DS, but hell, Smash Bros portable should be awesome. And it's not coming out until 2014 sometime, so everyone ought to have time to save forty bucks.

[Bum Bill Bee]

MEGA MAN




I can't help but think of all the hilarious Captain N the Game Master roleplay I could do if they also keep Pitt and throw in Simon Belmont.

[Flarecobra]

Pit is in it.

[Bells]

Just mod captain falcon to be Simon and there you go

[Kyanbu The Legend]

But he needs the whip. A Belmont is not the same without his/her whip.

[PyrosNine]

Or weird mace with a spikey ball on the end of it, if'n the new Belmonticula is to be counted.

[Bum Bill Bee]

Just mod captain falcon to be Simon and there you go

hmmmmmmnah, that wouldn't quite work.

But you gave me an idea, maybe I could mod Fox McCloud into Kevin.

[Flarecobra]

No surprise here... but Weegee is in. (http://www.smashbros.com/us/characters/luigi.html)

[Flarecobra]

So yeah... is there any real interest in this anymore?

[Magus]

Yeah, of course there is.

Because Little Mac is in it.

[Flarecobra]

And he looks to be very awesome, and in your face.

[Loyal]

Waiting patiently for its release. Mac's super cool and the aesthetic of his opening movie is pretty tight. I could see him becoming a new main of mine dependimg on the state of Captain Falcon and Wario.

[Flarecobra]

Well, Falcon's been in that series from the start, so I don't think there's much of a chance of him being skipped, and Yoshi hasn't been announced either, and he's one of the staples of Nintendo.

[greed]

I lost it at Samus comparing their heights. Poor Mac, Nintendo loves their tall heroines. Which probably equates to someone senior at Nintendo liking tall blonde women.

I'm honestly torn on which to pick on the one hand the 3DS version is gonna have the better online, OTOH the WiiU version is gonna have the better everything else.

[Loyal]

Well, Falcon's been in that series from the start, so I don't think there's much of a chance of him being skipped, and Yoshi hasn't been announced either, and he's one of the staples of Nintendo.

Nah, my main concern is whether Falcon's like his awesome Melee incarnation, or his weaksauce Brawl counterpart.

[Aldurin]

Nah, my main concern is whether Falcon's like his awesome Melee incarnation, or his weaksauce Brawl counterpart.

Well given that the design direction of the franchise is "as much as a fighting game as possible without being a fighting game", since Brawl's tripping mechanic was the director pouting at how competitive Melee play wasn't how he wanted it to be, probably not.

I'm personally more excited for Project M (http://projectmgame.com/en/) to get itself to a stable version than for the next Smash releasing, at least until I see more of what the next Smash will have.

[Loyal]

I am less than bothered with the competitiveness of the game in light of the fact that the fanbase has proven itself amply willing to mod the game as soon as they figure out how.

Again, my main concern is whether Falcon goes back to being fun to play without mods, or if he'll be clumsy, floaty, and weak again.

[Magus]

From what I understand they had backed off of the anti-competitive aspects of it for this one and removed tripping and such. I never did understand the inclusion of things to even the playing field--I never played it particularly competitively with my friends but it was quite to Melee's credit that you could.

Now, if they just remove the blue shell from Mario Kart, we'll be all set.

[Flarecobra]

I myself could care less about the competitive side of it... all I care about is that it's fun. :D

Granted that's subjective....

[Flarecobra]

So a lot of new stuff has come out.

0ABt944KIn8

There is a basic summery of what has come out, but for even faster reference...

3DS version is coming this summer, the WiiU version is in Winter.
Greninja is playable, along with Charizard.
No more transforming characters, so Sheik and Zero Suit Samus will be their own separate characters.
the 3DS gets it's own special mode.
Yoshi is confirmed to return.

[Kyanbu The Legend]

Megaman has the best final smash. Period. There is no denying it, only accepting.

[Locke cole]

Even Mega Man Trigger manages to come on down, for one brief moment among the living.

[Flarecobra]

Oh yeah, have the video introduicing Charizard and Greninja.

xEJBPMcbRkk

[Loyal]

I like that Villager's final smash appears to be ... paying his rent off.

[Flarecobra]

I thought it was funny that Olimar just throws a pikman, and it doesn't even make it.

[Ramary]

CITY TRIAL HAS RETURNED FROM THE DEAD. THIS IS THE BEST THING EVER, ALL-CAPS IS REQUIRED.

Besides that the new fighters I really wanted, Villager and Little Mac, are looking rad. Considering how much of an air game smash has always been, its cool to have a guy who is apparently a monster on the ground.

[Bells]

Now i kinda feel Pokemon is over represented in the game

[Arhra]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7xUWnQu2Grs

Here's the full Smash Direct. All 40 minutes of it!

In addition to the aforementioned: Stages, items, assist trophies, boss fights, some talk about Olimar, Rosalina, Wit Fit Trainer and Mac, a bit about the changes to Zelda, Shiek and Zero Suit Samus, FUN and GLORY multiplayer modes...

The Final Destination reskinning is a really nice touch!

[Loyal]

The destination really doesn't get much more final than that.

https://24.media.tumblr.com/c139479033ea61cf7a9b2d5a41faf5fe/tumblr_n3r1hsXCRF1trllnco1_1280.jpg

Lots and lots and lots of photos in a more easily digestible form. (https://www.flickr.com/photos/48280274@N02/sets/72157643678092364/page4/)

Those stages, those items, those NPC enemies!

[synkr0nized]

Now i kinda feel Pokemon is over represented in the game

It's been over-represented -- tons as items for use in battle, integration with more and more stages, additional names on the roster. This is just the natural progression, unfortunately, that at least is coming in conjunction with a broader roster overall.

Nintendo needs more partnerships with folks to bring in additional characters from iconic game franchises instead of just leaning on Pokemon sometimes.

[Grandmaster_Skweeb]

Nintendo needs more partnerships with folks to bring in additional characters from iconic game franchises instead of just leaning on Pokemon sometimes.

That would entail Nintendo learning how to get its head out of its ass and playing well with others again. We all know that shit ain't gonna happen any time soon, if ever again.

[Ryong]

Now i kinda feel Pokemon is over represented in the game

Don't worry, Star Fox will be represented by Fox, Falco, Wolf, Krystal, Slippy and Fox's father.

[synkr0nized]

Don't worry, Star Fox will be represented by Fox, Falco, Wolf, Krystal, Slippy and Fox's father.

This is a fair point, but the Landmaster is arguably one of the most entertaining final smashes. I hope they do all still use it.

Also Wolf <3. He's like my favourite, just for the ability to stand around and yell at my friends, "I can't let you do that, Star Fox!" / "I can't let you brew that, Starbucks!"

So maybe I just don't like Pokemon and am not paying attention to over-representation in other franchises.


Also pretend this post was full of subliminal "Mewtwo" messages.

[mauve]

Don't worry, Star Fox will be represented by Fox, Falco, Wolf, Krystal, Slippy and Fox's father.

And Legend of Zelda will have Twilight Princess Link, Skyward Sword Link, Young Link, Toon Link, Twilight Princess Zelda, Skyward Sword Zelda, Sheik, Tetra, Gannondorf....


...actually I'd kinda like to play as Tetra, pre-princess mode. She's a pirate captain, so that might be cool. Unlikely, but cool.


I looked at a few of the new characters' intro trailers and am moderately excited, even though I don't have/am still unsure about buying a WiiU or 3DS. Megaman looks rad and I'm interested to see his full moveset. Rosalina is interesting: it looks like she'll play like the Ice Climbers, where Luma acts as an expendable co-op combatant. Greninja basically looks like he'll play like a Lucario clone with a few of Squirtle's moves thrown in. I never liked Sonic as a brawler so I'm not particularly excited to see him back, and I'm still not sold on the Wii Fit trainer yet. Animal Crossing villager, however, is weirdly awesome.

I look forward to seeing what new assist trophies they'll have; so far I've only seen the ones returning from Brawl (including that damn Nintendog...).

[Bells]

New Zero Suit Samus?


OH!!........... oh... hi there impractical space combat high heels....!

[Flarecobra]

Though it is funny that they actually give a reason for her to wear them.

[Magus]

Eh, if they put Mewtwo in, he'll probably be in some lame depowered form I don't want to play as. Like Ganondorf in Brawl.

[greed]

That would entail Nintendo learning how to get its head out of its ass and playing well with others again. We all know that shit ain't gonna happen any time soon, if ever again.

Again? Nintendo has never played well with others they dictate when they're in power and flounder alone when they aren't.

[Grandmaster_Skweeb]

Super Nintendo was when they were in relatively good graces with third parties, relatively speaking. N64 and beyond is when they started down the road of fuckin' stupid.

[Bard The 5th LW]

Did they seriously give Zero Suit Samus high heels for the sole purpose of reminding players of Other M?

[Flarecobra]

Apperentally they're "Jet boots designed to give her kicks extra force."

[Bells]

If only Samus had some sort of... like.... some... power, like, suit thingie.....

[RickZarber]

Apperentally they're "Jet boots designed to give her kicks extra force."

...What's next, fishnet stockings for "stealth mode"?

[greed]

Super Nintendo was when they were in relatively good graces with third parties, relatively speaking. N64 and beyond is when they started down the road of fuckin' stupid.

Actually I've heard some horror stories. It was less good graces and more everyone had to do what they said cause they had like 85% market share or something. A lot of companies despised the censorship rules NoA handed down for example. The mass jumping ship to Sony was at least as much driven by getting away from Nintendo as it was by the PSX being a better machine.

...What's next, fishnet stockings for "stealth mode"?

Fishnet stockings would make her too "impure" for Japanese audiences probably. Also vaguely disappointed that Sheik isn't Impa from Skyward personally.

[Jagos]

If only Samus had some sort of... like.... some... power, like, suit thingie.....

Some people online are seriously taking this way too far...

They're high heels from Other M which is a game that never happened.

But it's seriously not the end of the world.

Then I see people getting upset that Little Mac (5'8) was punching Samus (6'3) out of the arena.

Where were these people 10 years ago?

[synkr0nized]

When any game puts together characters from varying "universes", you have to assume that some kind of normalization of power occurs. Otherwise a fat plumber or shrimpy boxer would never be able to defeat fire breathing lizards and heroines in power suits, or warriors with swords, etc. Or, alternatively, Landmasters would wipe the floor with all non-vehicular opponents.

So that's probably just Internet Autism at work.

Finding Samus's heals ridiculous totally makes sense to me, though. Other M is terrible, and nothing from it should be lauded.

[Locke cole]

They're high heels from Other M which is a game that never happened.


Well, no. The heels in Other M were nonfunctional. These are jet boot heels, which come from Smash.

To me, it's almost like Sakurai was given instructions to base the Zero Suit on Other M's changes, and he was all "...Well, if they have to be heels, I'm making them JET HEELS."

[Ryong]

Or, alternatively, Landmasters would wipe the floor with all non-vehicular opponents.

Rosalina can basically turn into a rather fast meteor, Marth can probably pierce a Landmaster's armor, Charizard can break rocks with his head without even trying, Samus' Screw Attack goes through a lot of things like they didn't even exist and I'm sure Pikachu could damage a Landmaster pretty bad without much trouble.

Internet autism and all that.

[Locke cole]

Marth? I don't know. Does magical steel trump whatever space-alloys likely make up the Landmaster's chassis?

[Loyal]

How you'd mention all those things and somehow miss Solid Snake is beyond my understanding.

Though now we also have Mega Man.

[BitVyper]

When any game puts together characters from varying "universes", you have to assume that some kind of normalization of power occurs. Otherwise a fat plumber or shrimpy boxer would never be able to defeat fire breathing lizards and heroines in power suits, or warriors with swords, etc.

Excuse you. (http://fc00.deviantart.net/fs4/i/2004/202/9/a/Itsa_me___Mario.jpg) Monk/sorcerer since 1985, punk. Mario benches giant firebreathing lizards. That's when he's not single handedly defeating entire fleets of airships and columns of tanks, breaking swords that shattered heaven, or just flying around in space.

This man drives go-karts on a thin strip of rainbow light in what I can only imagine is the yawning chasm at the end of all things. He races against a guy whose whole thing is running at supersonic speeds for fun. If he's fat it's because he hasn't come across a physical activity that can give him a workout.

[Locke cole]

How you'd mention all those things and somehow miss Solid Snake is beyond my understanding.

Though now we also have Mega Man.

Snake has killed a tank with grenades. Dude's the most insane "hardcore badass" on the planet.

Then again, I don't think I've ever seen a Landmaster's cockpit open.

[Ryong]

How you'd mention all those things and somehow miss Solid Snake is beyond my understanding.

Though now we also have Mega Man.

Only wanted to mention characters from the new one.

If he's fat it's because he hasn't come across a physical activity that can give him a workout.

Clearly all coins are actually chocolate coins. It's the only explanation.

[Bells]

In a way i get it that she is now her own unique character instead of a variant... apparently there are to be no ''form changes'' at all in the new Smash... So regular Samus should not turn into ZS Samus.

And considering that ZS Samus in Brawl was faster but overall weaker, giving this one some form of a Boost makes sense.

So, in reality its just the nerdy complaint to the fact that from the pool of Rocket ''X'' things to give a character mobility, high heels are the least practical things a bounty hunter could ever pick.


Which also means one of two things...

1 - Bayonetta could show up in smash (snowball's chance in hell... but hey!)
2 - SZ Samus Mod to make her INTO Bayonetta is coming (Probably someone is already working on textures right now...)

[Loyal]

Unless that someone is working in Nintendo and has access to ZSSamus's resources, it is physically impossible for them to be working on a texture mod right now.

[Ryong]

So, in reality its just the nerdy complaint to the fact that from the pool of Rocket ''X'' things to give a character mobility, high heels are the least practical things a bounty hunter could ever pick.

But she doesn't use them for mobility, she uses them for the true purpose of jet boots.
http://i.imgur.com/B9eB9cR.jpg

[Locke cole]

She uses them for both things.

[POS Industries]

Errybody talkin bout ZSS being a separate character but all I care about is that I'm finally getting Zelda with a proper Down B that won't be balanced around the Sheik transformation.

She probably still won't be good but at least I won't be minus a special move for fear of suddenly having to play an entirely different character.

[Locke cole]

I would've liked for Sheik to be replaced by Impa in this case.

If we want a Zelda character with Generic Ninja Techniques™, then it would've been nice for it to be a character apart from the usual three, and both OOT and SS Impa fit that niche well.

[synkr0nized]

Errybody talkin bout ZSS being a separate character but all I care about is that I'm finally getting Zelda with a proper Down B that won't be balanced around the Sheik transformation.

She probably still won't be good but at least I won't be minus a special move for fear of suddenly having to play an entirely different character.

Whenever I hit the transform, I usually followed it immediately with some style of cursing. To me, Sheik is a handicap that I tried to avoid, outside of gimmicks or doing something stupid like repeatedly chain-whipping someone trying to climb up from an edge.

Zelda's aerial kicks are (were?) a thing of beauty, easily sending my foes off the screen. Landing that, Jiggly's insta-KO sleep, and Fox's upwards aerial kick always had me satisfied (not that there aren't other amazing moves, of course!). At least in Melee; Brawl felt like everything was toned down a bit (though, in fairness, I got to play a lot, lot less Brawl).

[Flarecobra]

This is how you see the pokemon situation?

https://31.media.tumblr.com/2873b720e5efad73d0b8a7b5fcf6aadb/tumblr_n44gl1FKtu1s8lxcio1_500.jpg

[synkr0nized]

In looking up GIFs to use in response, I have learned that Mewtwo has two "mega" evolutions that are both pretty awful-looking. That made me sadder.

[Flarecobra]

Considering they're just temporary forms, and totally optional...

[Locke cole]

At least one of them is almost certain to be part of his Final Smash if he makes it into Sm4sh, though.

[Shyria Dracnoir]

TH3QsczwIa4

[Jagos]

Hmmm...

Should we take Samus as a different one than we knew in the Prime series?

And just to make sure people understand what happened with the Samus gripes...

Linkage to Gaijin Goombah's response (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fA7PHtpzSFQ)

[Locke cole]

"Whereas before, she didn't have any character"-

Ugh...

[Loyal]

Hmmm...

Should we take Samus as a different one than we knew in the Prime series?

No.

Samus is Samus is Samus. It's all a single chronology, blessed by the creator himself, Yoshio Sakamoto, and wishful thinking isn't going to change that.

Even within the comic, Samus was strong, willful, headstrong, brave, and noble. She suffered an attack at the sight of Ridley, but then got her shit together, and outside of that was the same stoic badass with a hidden caring side we all knew and loved.

But in Other M, Samus is reduced to a subservient wreck largely incapable of independent thought or action. Her entire personality flanderized to two or three simplistic, pathetic points exaggerated to such an extreme as to make her unrecognizable. Besides obsessing constantly over The Baby, Samus is never not leaning on Adam for support and guidance, despite doing just fine without him for years before, and unquestioningly obeys his every order, even at senseless risk of life and limb, for no good reason. On top of that her reaction to Ridley is just insult added to injury, particularly since she'd battled and/or slain Ridley a good five times chronologically prior to that.

In short, Other M was a shitty retcon of an amazing character, and even if it was what Yoshio Sakamoto had intended for the character all along, it should have been well clear that in twenty or so years of gaming, Samus had evolved past that.

And now, after all that, this completely avoidable clusterfuck, this abortion of character development, what do we get but high-heels, a dainty beauty mark, and a boob job. On Samus Fucking Aran. (http://i.imgur.com/yQfn30E.jpg)



Also, the argument that pre-Other-M Samus had no personality or character is patently false dating all the way back to Super Metroid.

I'm not going to address the video at this time because the first five minutes sounds like inane babbling and reaching at straws, and I'm too tired to parse through it at the moment.

[Jagos]

Sakamoto gave us Fusion.

Yokoi gave us Samus.

Other than that, having Other M fit in the timeline doesn't help the game. But how people take Samus for the heels is seriously amazing... She gets to jump higher and because the heels are from Other M, that baggage comes along for the ride.

I just took it that it never happened and/or that this isn't the same one but I guess to each their own.

[Locke cole]

I like to ignore Other M as well, for the way it contradicts some other games. Mostly Fusion, weirdly enough.

[Bells]

To me the issue with her looks is not that she shouldn't be allowed to wear spandex or heels... my problem with her design is not that it's over sexualized, because for me... it's really not.

It's not that they sexed her up, it's because this design dumbs the character down. Samus loosing her power suit and turning into Zero Suit made somewhat sense because showed her in an almost tactical light... was like a character sacrificing power to overwhelm an opponent in a instant, but then, she would STILL be fairly competent on her own afterwards.

Now, she is still competent it seems, which is fine, but character wise... it's dumb. Is like having Link without the master sword because ''he has do many other gadgets'' instead... or having Peach in her Biker suit from Mario Kart because ''it's better for fighting than a dress'' , it just silly design really...

[synkr0nized]

I really enjoyed the transformation into Zero Suit Samus in Brawl, as I liked that dumping the armor got me that increased speed and the melee/whip moves. Which probably sounds arbitrary and stupid after having stated that I hated Sheik.

But I've never been a pro/tournament player in any fighting game and just pick the characters I enjoy, and the Zero Suit was fun. Being able to pick just that appeals to me, despite the stupid Other M implications. I think, at the end of the day, I would have a smile on my face after firing jets out of high heels, especially since they seem to be a key element of her various kick attacks.

[BitVyper]

Samus overall actually had pretty much my favourite gameplay in Brawl. The switching was kind of nice because I liked playing as both of them.

Tournament players ruin everything anyway. While I'm not against balance or balance-for-competition in general (although I think over-focusing on it ruins games), my experience is that 99% of what competitive fighting game players call for, is for reality to conform to their playstyles.

---------- Post added at 10:56 AM ---------- Previous post was at 10:41 AM ----------

Also, the argument that pre-Other-M Samus had no personality or character is patently false dating all the way back to Super Metroid.

Metroid 2 if you do no inference whatsoever, still has some character development. And if you're not completely inflexible, there have always been underlying details about Samus' character that you could infer. I mean she's essentially an independent military contractor who takes exceptionally dangerous commando missions deep in hostile territory with a lot of killing. Not just anyone does that; even outside of the missions themselves, she has to be able to like, negotiate a fee and make people take her seriously and be able to walk away and all this other stuff that requires a level of self respect well beyond anything seen in Other M.

Metroid 2 Samus personally killed off an entire species either for money, or because someone wanted to use them as a weapon. And then she handed over the last remaining member of the species to scientists who kept it in a tiny glass tube to do experiments on it. Her ideals have to be disgustingly humanist (or whatever you call humanism when aliens who are basically humans get involved). Other M giving her this huge maternal attachment to the metroid larva doesn't even make sense unless she is an insane narcissist recontextualizing her relationship with it AFTER it had saved her life, and if she was an insane narcissist, I would expect her interactions with the rest of the characters to be very different. She didn't save the larva so that it could grow up and go to school and fall in love and have metroid babies; she saved it to hand over to researchers who kept it in apparently abominable conditions. When we actually get narrative and she describes the event, she doesn't say something like "I couldn't bring myself to kill it," she's like "welp, handing this over to science." After that, she ONLY talks about the results of the research, and when she's satisfied that the scientists are doing something productive with the hatchling, she leaves.

I guess that second paragraph was mostly Super Metroid, which is what you mentioned. I'm just adding it for completeness. Also because I want to point out that while I respect the Samus who lives in my heart, I'm pretty sure I hate her.

[Ryong]

Metroids and the X-Parasites are far from being intelligent, though. They're regarded as more of a pest than anything.

Space Pirates are intelligent, sure, but they're also super evil.

[Locke cole]

The X developed intelligence over the course of Fusion, though. They began doing stuff like dropping their temperatures to damage Samus on absorption, infecting crewmates in order to bypass security and mess with the engines, and looking for ways to escape and take over galactic society at large.

Of course, that made them a bigger and bigger threat, as well.

[Ryong]

Sure, but the entirity of their intelligence was "what is the best way to expand?" without regard to concepts like "peacefully".

[BitVyper]

Metroids and the X-Parasites are far from being intelligent, though. They're regarded as more of a pest than anything.

This is basically a summary of the exact attitude I have a problem with(hell, even OUR society values life more than the Galactic Federation apparently does). It's a vague rule that defines a group which conveniently includes ourselves and anything we happen to like (although they still count lower than us, so it's okay to be horrible to them), and then makes everything else fair game for whatever (at least so far as Samus' government is concerned). I mean lets be honest here, there was no NEED to kill off the Metroids; they weren't exactly a weapon that could be deployed in mass numbers. The Space Pirates had to devote a lot of space just to maintain a few (and had frequent problems with containment). Metroids have killed more Pirates than they did anyone else. Cripes, their own home planet only supported like 40. And there's huge logistical problems with employing even a few. If it was ever THAT big of a problem, well all the metroids are in one place; blockade the damn planet. I suspect the Metroid genocide was something along the lines of TSA-level, fear-mongering, budget-justifying, bureaucratic obfuscation. This isn't even on the level of pest removal, because pests are generally actually causing you some harm; the Metroids were just minding their own business until some asshole showed up with an arm cannon and butchered their entire species.

For the record, just based on the larva's actions, Metroids are clearly pretty intelligent too. Samus stalks and kills every last one of them without question or a thought for the consequences on SR388's ecosystem though (and lord were there ever consequences). No explanation for this is going to make her look good. Although I suppose if you count the comics, she may be slightly justified in perceiving the Metroids as a weapon, but then her inability to step beyond that perception becomes a failure with tragic consequences. Maybe having her body partly destroyed in Fusion is the necessary redemptive suffering to purify her soul and reach catharsis.

Destroying the X is a matter of survival however. They actually will eat everything if they are not 100% eradicated, so killing them? Pretty much acceptable. It's not possible for them to coexist with any other life in the universe. It doesn't matter how intelligent they are

Anyway, I pretty much agree that something like pest control is probably what Samus was thinking when she personally hunted down and killed every last Metroid. That's the entire reason I probably wouldn't like her.

[Jagos]

Oh crap...

I just got the image that Samus is basically the female version of a black op specialist...

Thanks, Bit... Now her entire history as a bounty hunter for hire marks her as a CIA contractor that hides behind the vague threat of "national security" while she destroys planets...

Side note: It may just be time to overhaul some of these old characters and give them something new. We go through every part of the mythos and we can pull a LOT of stuff from it based on our own experiences. Personally, with Samus and her influence from the Aliens movies, I'd possibly want to redo those games and redo her backstory so that we get a clearer picture of who she is besides a robotic shell of a female (in most senses, that's what she is. Caring maybe, but the games don't quite make her a clear model for anyone if we see the story that Bit is saying as true) and can make the games tell a better story similar to what the Prime series did.

[Ryong]

The Prime series clearly depicts Metroids as having a ridiculous potential for destruction, but then again, it mostly involves being in near proximity to a sentient radioactive thing capable of some degree of movement that also happens to be able to shoot itself across space.

[Loyal]

I figure Prime's not an especially good place to look at Metroids beyond their inability to be effectively contained, since, Prime/Dark Samus aside, they seem to have been largely weakened by Phazon influence. Especially in that you could down them with nothing but the Power Beam, though I'm not sure if this is a Phazon issue or a Tallon Metroid issue.

The Omega Metroid in II (and especially Fusion) is a pretty good example of their destructive power, though what it takes for a Metroid to reach that stage is unknown.

[Locke cole]

Yeah, Tallon Metroids seemed weaker. The scary thing about standard Metroids, which Tallon Metroids and Mochtroids lack, is their lack of weaknesses. Standard Metroids only have a weakness to extremely low temperatures, followed by a volley of high explosives, and removing one that's latched on requires a tactic that pretty much only Samus has.

If you don't have either of those things to hand, then one latching on is death.

Of course, in ordinary circumstances, that isn't a big problem; just stay the hell away from SR-388. It's when spacefaring societies spread them across the galaxy that things get real dangerous.

[BitVyper]

The Prime series clearly depicts Metroids as having a ridiculous potential for destruction

What ridiculous potential for destruction? Functionally, they're barely more dangerous than a bunch of grizzly bears would be. They're individually dangerous and aggressive, sure (although it's notable that we know their aggression is amplified by phazon exposure), but they aren't wiping out ecosystems or knocking over buildings or anything. They aren't going to breed out of control and consume everything because A. no possibility of a queen off SR388, and B. even with a queen, we've seen that they just don't reach high populations. Most of the "damage" they do, is in places where they were being contained specifically for use as weapons. If you teach your bear to be extra aggressive and he wrecks up the place when he gets out of his cage, you really have no one to blame but yourself. They can't even get through shield doors in their jellyfish stage. They're a dangerous, aggressive apex predator, but they aren't even AS dangerous as conventional military arms. A Metroid will kill a dozen people and fuck off to go lurk because it's an animal; bombs wipe out cities and are a billion times easier to keep, maintain, and deploy.

And once again, Prime shows us that they're more dangerous to the guys trying to use them as weapons than to anyone else. The best the pirates are able to do is stick a few of them in particular areas as a defensive measure.

The Omega Metroid in II (and especially Fusion) is a pretty good example of their destructive power, though what it takes for a Metroid to reach that stage is unknown.

It absolutely requires their native environment, and once again, not actually all that dangerous when examined on the large scale; the one that got loose wrecked up what, a couple hallways? And then it just lurked and waited for prey. And the hallway thing was probably because it was panicking. Sure, it would be a catastrophe to let one loose in a populated area, but again, you need to capture it, keep it caught, keep it fed, and transport it to the city you want to mess up. And then you kill what, a hundred people and mess up some infrastructure? Not exactly a rousing victory for terrorism. Although now I'm imagining a world where terrorists let grizzly bears loose in airports instead of using bombs.

And Fusion also shows us that GFed technology is capable of keeping Metroids in all life stages contained about a hundred times better than the pirates ever did, so realistically, they're not particularly unstoppable either.

I mean, lemme be clear here: Metroids are total badasses. I will bet on them in a fight against any other alien monster. They just aren't badasses that are in any way applicable to large scale military tactics. They were created to be apex predators and they do that very well, even keeping their population at a level where they don't eat their entire food supply. We know it takes tons of energy for them to molt (and also their native environment), and I'm betting they were designed that way specifically as a population control.

Edit: Personally, I suspect that it's actually the X that Metroids need the presence of in order to molt. It would make a lot of sense from the Chozo perspective to have designed them that way.

[Locke cole]

I guess the major fears the Federation had about Metroids were the possibility of the Pirates either harnessing their energy absorption for their own ends (or engineering similar stuff into their tech), or breeding away their cold weakness (them already being damn hard to kill).

As for their population size, apparently the Pirates had some sort of cloning beam tech that could easily reproduce them from a single specimen.

All that said, the mission given to Samus was apparently the result of a research ship being lost on SR-388, followed by the loss of the rescue ship sent for the first ship, and then a ship of soldiers sent to rescue the rescue ship. I'm not sure whether that means they really are that dangerous, or if the soldiers are just as dumb as Science Team, but that was apparently enough to get rumor and fear going.

That being said, it's hard to imagine one Metroid wiping out a planet on its own, as was suggested in the Metroid 2 manual, unless said planet had nothing close to Samus's ice beam, or anyone living in arctic regions.

Again, they might have been fine if they'd just put a blockade around SR-388 to keep the Pirates out.

[Krylo]

All that said, the mission given to Samus was apparently the result of a research ship being lost on SR-388, followed by the loss of the rescue ship sent for the first ship, and then a ship of soldiers sent to rescue the rescue ship.

I've got something they should read. (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sunk_costs)

[BitVyper]

As for their population size, apparently the Pirates had some sort of cloning beam tech that could easily reproduce them from a single specimen.

Doesn't matter because they only get larval metroids, and they still can't manufacture large numbers because of the cost in space. They have huge facilities that produced and houseed like, six larval metroids. And that's such a volatile situation that as soon as there was a problem, the metroids broke out and started hunting their staff.

All that said, the mission given to Samus was apparently the result of a research ship being lost on SR-388, followed by the loss of the rescue ship sent for the first ship, and then a ship of soldiers sent to rescue the rescue ship. I'm not sure whether that means they really are that dangerous, or if the soldiers are just as dumb as Science Team, but that was apparently enough to get rumor and fear going.

That might not even have been Metroids; SR388 is an environment so hostile that Samus is in danger there. Regardless, I 100% agree that Metroids are incredibly dangerous alien monsters that can kill some ground troops no problem. Big deal. If they were like xenos or zerg or something where a single one of them can become an unlimited supply and they will just keep eating forever, that would be one thing, but they aren't. They're only producible in very limited numbers, at enormous cost, and they can't reproduce or even molt outside of particular environmental conditions. They're just totally untenable as any sort of military solution.

[Locke cole]

The Pirates might not have known or cared about stages beyond the larval stage, as those are still flying predators with few vulnerabilities. With X, the major danger is how fast they reproduce. With Metroids, it's more how hard they are to kill without an ice beam.

Or maybe they wanted to figure out their energy absorption thing, instead of using the creatures themselves.

And I kind of think having 6 or so in Tourian a few hours after stealing the Hatchling (with time to make a few Mochtroids on the side) is rather impressive speed.

[Grandmaster_Skweeb]

alls I knows is metroids is a good source for resupplying missiles, bombs, and energy.

[PyrosNine]

Metroids are apparently galactic terrors because they don't eat blood, they eat energy. People, Robots (the Dead Torizo), Ships. They can in fact, feed on just about anything. The lifecycle of a Metroid is based largely upon feeding, and upon eating enough energy,they can transform into their next highest state, until they become either an Omega, or a Queen, and this process can occur within a very short time: The Omega metroid in Fusion transformed ridiculously quickly,and in the face of a hostile predator (and admittedly, in a station filled with a glut of it's natural prey)

A single Metroid dropped in a populated city, given time to mature and become a Queen, could give rise to a swarm of doom. Standard military arms designed for Metroids, used by both Pirates and the Feds, are heavy, bulky, and have a slow rate of fire, good for one Metroid, but not a swarm. You'd need some kind of cold/reverse nuke, and the more technology you throw at them the more likely they'll just eat it and grow bigger. The reason why the Space Pirates are dangerous is that they're crazy enough to try, and willing to sacrifice entire battalions of pirates to obtain and contain them, and inevitably let them loose elsewhere.

The real danger of a Metroid is if they can get them jarred, sealed, and then dropped them wherever they pleased, it' would create a whole lot of trouble for anyone that wasn't Aran.

The Space Pirate bred metroids on Tallon IV, Aether, and on other planets were weak due to phazon poisoning, and careful Pirate decisions. Presumably, they did their best to prevent their experimental test subjects from transforming into oversized monsters, and by doing so also prevented the metroids from reproducing normally,so they didn't wake up with surprise Omega metroids on their hands. They likely did this by simply preventing the Metroids on a strict diet and keeping them cold. The GCF must have similarly retarded their growth and development, hence why the only time we see an Metroid evolve in Fusion, despite having been in containment for the entirety of the adventure, is after the containment was breached and the metroids were able to feast to their heart's desire on X and the Spacestation.


On Samus:
I think Samus Aran is cool guy who isn't afraid of anything, mebbe gets a sad moment for baby, but goes on with life, yes? Only knew baby for like, a space week, and now that she doesn't have to babysit it because a: dropped with off with adoptive parents, and b: adoptive parents got eaten by Ridley and then baby got blasted by Mother Brain, she is free to hit the singles party and buy herself jetpack high heels.

On the whole, a good story about Samus Aran is about her and her origins, and Bird people, and any game that doesn't feature her origins, AND Bird people, has a dumb plot, because all the magical ancient science that makes the games wonderful gets replaced with handwaving "military science" and "authorization".

Samus is kinda a Space Scifi Indiana Jones/Lara Croft, and whenever that element is removed, she's just generic space heroine in generic space story, because they cut out all the "RAISED BY BIRD PEOPLE" that should y'know, feature more heavily in her poor interaction with the GCF than her daddy issues. Like as Robin says to Slade in Teen Titans, "I already have a father" and then a bunch of birds fly in front of the camera. And when she thumbs down, it's because of humorous cultural differences between bird people and humans.

[Bard The 5th LW]

I felt that Samus was sad about the Baby Metroid dying, but sort of in the way one would feel sad about their dog dying.

[Flarecobra]

And we have a returning fighter... Ike. That rounds out the number fighters at 30 so far.

[Locke cole]

They had a trailer thing that showed off the participants and rules and stuff for the upcoming E3 tourney.

But more importantly, they revealed a Gamecube Controller adapter for the Wii U.

[Flarecobra]

So Miis have joined the fight.

HM0UHEM5DpY

And Palutena has been announced.

6yDP7KI4aRk

[phil_]

Still no Ice Climbers :(

[Flarecobra]

We have a release date: October 3rd.

EDIT: wat.

CBI4uAOSq0c

[Kyanbu The Legend]

Hey it's classic Pacman!! :D

Awesome! i think that's going to ease the mind of a lot of Pac fans.

[Arhra]

Hey look, it's that character who everyone wanted to make it in!

SAKURAAAAAAAAAI!

[Loyal]

Lucina, Robin, and Falcon. Today is a good day.

Also, for those having trouble accessing the site:

N9ytrX0wweA

[Revising Ocelot]

Shulk? More like Sulk.

I'll be getting this on 3DS but I have nobody to play with :(:(:(

[Solid Snake]

I'll be getting this on 3DS but I have nobody to play with :(:(:(

YOU SURE ABOUT THAT, BUDDY?!?

[Ramary]

Best part of the trailer. Falcon deflects blades with his BARE HANDS.

[Flarecobra]

YOU SURE ABOUT THAT, BUDDY?!?

I'll gladly take you boys on. :D

[Kyanbu The Legend]

Best part of the trailer. Falcon deflects blades with his BARE HANDS.

Because he's Captain Falcon!!! F#*% YEAH!

[Loyal]

No, no, this is the best part. (http://lfitloyal.tumblr.com/post/91753392954/yo-did-my-homeboy-captain-falcon-just-cancel-a)

[Doc ock rokc]

No, no, this is the best part. (http://lfitloyal.tumblr.com/post/91753392954/yo-did-my-homeboy-captain-falcon-just-cancel-a)

That was my reaction

I literally said "OH SHIT CAN WE CANCEL THE PUNCH!"

[Revising Ocelot]

YOU SURE ABOUT THAT, BUDDY?!?

Different country, bro. Cross-Atlantic lag is tolerable in some cases, not in others. I don't see Smash Bros being good in that regard.

Also, I still need to unwrap my FE:A box. Currently I've been playing A Link Between Worlds on Hero Mode during downtime at work.

---------- Post added at 12:48 AM ---------- Previous post was at 12:41 AM ----------

Like I've had to turn down requests from Mumu and Ryong to actually co-op that Borderlands 2 because England -> Brazil. Broke my heart.

[Aldurin]

I'm getting increasingly nervous that Jigglypuff might be getting dropped off the roster.

Please, HAL, I need my god of war.

[Kyanbu The Legend]

I'm getting increasingly nervous that Jigglypuff might be getting dropped off the roster.

Please, HAL, I need my god of war.

I think all of the original roster from SSB64 are safe. Like Falcon, Jigglypuff will probably be off handily mentioned as still being in the battle.

[Loyal]

https://38.media.tumblr.com/59d86ceb52a39c2cfd66729c4d11047d/tumblr_n8pyl6hiUK1tqe6hto1_250.gif

[Flarecobra]

I think all of the original roster from SSB64 are safe. Like Falcon, Jigglypuff will probably be off handily mentioned as still being in the battle.

Ness, or anyone from the Earthbound series, have not shown up yet.

[Marc v4.0]

Ness, or anyone from the Earthbound series, have not shown up yet.

It's very clear Sakurai likes fucking around with our hearts.

He's also a cutie.

[akaSM]

Lucina, Robin, and Falcon. Today is a good day.

Also, for those having trouble accessing the site:

N9ytrX0wweA

hypehypehypehypeHYPE