*Rant on dangerous pets and their owners*

[Menarker]

Had a bad run in with someone's PITBULL.

No leash, no muzzle, Entire driveway with 3-4 meter sliding fence open as possible as it could be.

Dog instantly and aggressively charge towards me on sight despite me not actually being on his territory.

I dunno if I was brave/smart or stupid/mistaking my "dog lore", but I stood my ground and didn't run (despite being a fast runner myself) so as not to encourage it to chase after me (it slowed down still growling insanely as I slowly moved backwards). Its owner finally shouted and ran to pull the dog backwards (and she ran off into the house so as to avoid me catching her face... which is pointless since I live 3-4 houses away from her!)

Good news is, I'm untouched. Shaken, but nothing worse.

But I'm pissed off as hell. She lives near 3 schools, several bus stops, a senior center, 2 centers of worship. Someone else much more panicky or weaker could have easily been severely injured, especially those younger or weaker than I am.

Now, I've walked that path for 5 years, and never seen it before, so it's possible that dog belonged to someone visiting them or they... *Shudder* bought an aggressive dog all the sudden and have the gall to not take the proper measures to keep it in the yard...

I've always had a distaste for dogs (and a fondness for cats). This event only made the feeling much stronger.



So yeah, I hate owners of pets who are unable or unwilling to properly take actions to restrain their pets, especially if it has a history of aggression. Makes me want to advocate destruction of said animal and to charge owners in the same way as if they used a weapon.

[Krylo]

Isn't that more or less what they do if a dog like that mauls someone?

Edit: Just say kill or death or whatever. You want the dog dead. Not destroyed. Man, this ain't no prime time anime from the 90s. We aren't sending that dog to another dimension. And it's a living being, not an object.

Edit2: It's possible they've had the dog for a long time and it's never been violent before, as well. Dogs tend to get a little crazy in their old age just like any other animal (including humans), and with breeds bred to be aggressive that can often express itself in violence that the animal never actually displayed before. Which is why some people consider them 'time bombs'. While there's a good chance such a dog will never get violent, there's also a chance it will get violent for no reason other than getting old.

[Menarker]

I see the word destroyed used in nearly every book and newspaper I have read regarding santioned killing of animals under these circumstances. It's basically the approved euphemism. But dead's dead.

[Marc v4.0]

Pittbulls are absolute sweethearts unless you in-breed and then beat them for fighting, or they go crazy, but that is true of any big dog really. Blame the people, but don't hate the pup

[Krylo]

Originally Posted by Marc v1.0

Pittbulls are absolute sweethearts unless you in-breed and then beat them for fighting, or they go crazy, but that is true of any big dog really. Blame the people, but don't hate the pup

No. They aren't.

They have a reputation for being vicious because they were bred to be guard dogs. That means that when the breed was first created there were personality traits that were selected for in breeding as well as strength. Amongst those were a strong desire to protect its territory and a 'vicious' attitude in a fight.

Loyalty was ALSO amongst them, but when a dog starts going senile, or losing hearing and sight with age, welp.

I mean, yes, the people who have said that if they raise a pet properly it will probably be fine are completely correct, but on the other hand there is a reason you don't hear of many people raising wolves even from puppies that don't end with 'and then it mauled a child'.

Personality traits can be given a higher incidence through breeding, and while proper nurturing can repress them it's not a 100% thing and if you have a dog like a pitbull or a rottweiler you should be cognizant of that fact and treat it appropriately. Which is to say keep it leashed or fenced in places, don't let it play with small children (who are likely to yank on its tail/ears/do other things to provoke it--even the most mild mannered dogs and cats can react with violence to this, regardless of breed), and definitely don't let it run around your neighborhood where children play.

Just because they act nice and kind to you that doesn't mean they're going to be 'sweethearts' to anyone else who comes near. Especially if they decide to be protective of their 'pack'.

Edit: P.S. Trained attack dogs are also 'sweethearts' with their handlers, but you better believe they will rip a bitch's throat out if they're provoked in the wrong way.

Edit2: Really even ignoring that they are more likely to be mean to people who they don't recognize through selective breeding, they have ridiculously powerful jaws and are basically murder machines. They are weapons in living form, and you shouldn't ignore that fact just because you think they are cute or they have never acted out before. They are capable of killing someone very quickly.

[Premmy]

Originally Posted by Krylo

No. They aren't.

They have a reputation for being vicious because they were bred to be guard dogs.

Actually Pit Bulls were bred not as guard dogs, but as animal-fighting dogs.

Whereas Rottweilers were bred as herd and work dogs(pulling carts and the like)
In a sense they can be considered "Guard Dog" breeds since I'm sure they were often used to protect owners from strange animals, but they aren't necessarily naturally human-aggressive.

That means that when the breed was first created there were personality traits that were selected for in breeding as well as strength. Amongst those were a strong desire to protect its territory and a 'vicious' attitude in a fight.

well yes, a strong Guard attitude, but pitbulls were actually (originally anyway) supposed to be easily separable from fights by human intervention.

Loyalty was ALSO amongst them, but when a dog starts going senile, or losing hearing and sight with age, welp.

This is definitely one of those "well that goes for almost everything" things and I know you know that

I mean, yes, the people who have said that if they raise a pet properly it will probably be fine are completely correct, but on the other hand there is a reason you don't hear of many people raising wolves even from puppies that don't end with 'and then it mauled a child'.

Apples and Oranges, man.

Personality traits can be given a higher incidence through breeding, and while proper nurturing can repress them it's not a 100% thing and if you have a dog like a pitbull or a rottweiler you should be cognizant of that fact and treat it appropriately.

Most definitely, yes but you have to be sure of the traits you're dealing with and not confusing them for other, similar traits, such as in the case with animal-aggression and Human-aggression

Which is to say keep it leashed or fenced in places, don't let it play with small children (who are likely to yank on its tail/ears/do other things to provoke it--even the most mild mannered dogs and cats can react with violence to this, regardless of breed), and definitely don't let it run around your neighborhood where children play.

yup

Just because they act nice and kind to you that doesn't mean they're going to be 'sweethearts' to anyone else who comes near. Especially if they decide to be protective of their 'pack'.

That's a matter of training will they be aggressive to other humans? that's up to you, do they have a greater chance to be aggressive to other animals? now THAT'S up to breeding.

Edit: P.S. Trained attack dogs are also 'sweethearts' with their handlers, but you better believe they will rip a bitch's throat out if they're provoked in the wrong way.

Emphasis on the "Trained" part of this statement

Edit2: Really even ignoring that they are more likely to be mean to people who they don't recognize through selective breeding, they have ridiculously powerful jaws and are basically murder machines. They are weapons in living form, and you shouldn't ignore that fact just because you think they are cute or they have never acted out before. They are capable of killing someone very quickly.

I really hope you're not citing that "Jaw lock" bullshit, because it is, indeed, bullshit

Both animals were bred for physical strength for their respective duties, and an enhanced prey instinct towards animals in particular and loyalty to humans.

Basically these dogs were trained to be aggressive(Kinda) to other animals first and foremost.

More often than not aggression can be curtailed to an extreme degree when only around humans, though improper socialization can lead to the presence of other animals flipping that switch, so don't keep them isolated from other dogs.

[Krylo]

Originally Posted by Premmy

Apples and Oranges, man.

The only real difference between wolves and domesticated dogs are a few thousand years of living around humans and breeding/domestication.

So it's not really. It's the same thing. Aggression and territorial instincts weren't slowly bred out of wild wolves. This makes them much more dangerous even when raised from pups.

In the same way aggression was bred into various fighting dogs, which makes them much more dangerous than non-fighting dogs. Not to the same level, but the comparison is there.

Most definitely, yes but you have to be sure of the traits you're dealing with and not confusing them for other, similar traits, such as in the case with animal-aggression and Human-aggression

They aren't really that different. Humans are just animals. Aggression is aggression. The only reason there's a difference to the dogs is that domesticated dogs see humans as part of their pack.

Depending on how much exposure the dog has to people other than its immediate family (and how those people treat it/its family) 'animal-aggression' can very quickly turn into 'aggression toward any humans I don't recognize' because, again, humans are animals.

I really hope you're not citing that "Jaw lock" bullshit, because it is, indeed, bullshit

More like the 'they are a very powerful animal that can maul and kill you quicker than most people give them credit for just because they've been domesticated'.

Edit: I mean really, how often do you hear of a golden retriever mauling people? Compared to a pitbull or rott? There's a reason for this, guys.

[pochercoaster]

Not even a leash? Yeah, that's downright irresponsible. If you don't want to leash them put them in a fenced-in backyard at least.

I was in a similar situation when I got in the elevator the other day with a fellow tenant and their HUGE unmuzzled dog, which was growling quite... violently at me until I got off on my floor. I guess I was lucky that nothing happened- what are you supposed to do in a small, confined space like that? This dog was huge, its jaw was scary.

A lot of people say "oh don't worry he won't bite you he likes people," and yeah while dogs do have their own personalities and can lean towards being "nice," especially if their owners treat them properly, it doesn't GUARANTEE anything. It's still an animal and we can't read their minds so you have to be cautious and especially mindful of other people's safety. Meaning you should leash your dog and not let them run amok, regardless of their breed. Unless they're a toy chihuahua or something equally non threatening, but if you have one of those you probably carry it around in your purse a la Paris Hilton anyways.

[Menarker]

I'm willing to allow that pitbulls as rabid vicious murder on four legs are the minority (more of a trope than reality). However, I hate dogs (or any other animal) of any species that are uncontrolled when they behave in that fashion. (I still hate them when they are controlled, but at least it's not going to harm anyone unless they accidently or purposely bypass the controlling factors.)

Animals in a manner of fashion are worse than humans when they go out of control because they are impossible to negotiate or plactate in general. If it was possible that I could just tell that dog that I'm not stepping on his territory, don't plan to, and was leaving the general area anyhow in a few seconds, even that would be a massive improvement from being unable to do a god damn thing about my situation except being lucky that the owner heard the growling.

[Pip Boy]

Dogs tend to be less likely to attack if you're off of their territory and if you don't back down. Stand your ground and show them you're not afraid. That said, it isn't a perfect strategy. They're living beings, not robots, so if they're rabid or if you're just unlucky, they may attack anyway.