Another Big Big Thread of Religious Discussion

[Fifthfiend]

I think 90% of my personal theology boils down to "If there's a God, he's a dick."

[Red Fighter 1073]

Life is not a thing which has "meaning," as far as I can understand. Words and phrases have meaning. Gestures have meaning. In short, things which are expressive to somebody are things that have meaning. Who's life supposed to be an expression for? What does this question mean?

But even then, that's what I would at least want out of my life though, for it to have a meaning, or a purpose, if you don't really relate to how a life has meaning. That's at least what I strive for, is to find my purpose in life.

But then again, I guess Meaning and Purpose can be interpreted as different things in this situation. With Meaning, I think of it as how I live my own life, and Purpose is how I help other people. As for Meaning, I would say that the meaning of life is to be happy right?

Personally though, I hate that belief where if you don't believe in a religion, you go to hell or that god is out to get you if you don't believe in his/her religion. I mean, if he/she really was looking out for us then why the fuck should he punish non-believers just because they don't believe in his religion?

But also, I'm pretty religious, and I really couldn't care less about whether or not you are. Whatever makes you happy really. See, that's what I think the goal of any religion is, helping people find happiness. It's all about finding that balance that keeps you living the best life possible. However much you factor religion into your life is fine as long as it makes you happy.

[Tendronai]

Originally Posted by Fifthfiend

I think 90% of my personal theology boils down to "If there's a God, he's a dick."

There's just such elegance in that I couldn't help mentioning it.

I'm personally reminded of Kierkegaard's philosophy in this instance. He was the one pretty much responsible of existentialism. One part in particular really got to me, and shifted me from agnostic to atheist.

I'm quoting from memory, so I probably screwed it up in some instances, but he said "I can imagine after I die, I ascend into heaven and meet God. He tells me 'I have let atheists into Heaven, because they had the courage to believe what they wanted to, but you I shall deny entry because you blindly followed the Bible without ever questioning it.'"

Kierkegaard was trying to get people to become more active in their faith, but the point I took away from it was that I really have no reason to believe in any God. This isn't about some divine plan or grand tapestry of people which culminates in an ultimate paradise - it's about every single person being an individual.

As such, I don't really care about the Meaning of Life. I don't care about the Purpose. I know at some point I'm going to die, and it could be anywhere from old age in eighty years to being hit by a bus when I go out today. All that really matters to me is that I am happy with what I have done. As long as I try to be happy, that's all that counts.

The afterlife is all a big unknown. Bill Maher once pointed out they didn't know shit about it either, because they were alive, but they kept it up over the years because fear was such a great way to control people. I live as I see fit because I know that most mentioned outcome is just as likely to be creative license than any other theory out there. After I'm dead, I'll have time to feel regret if I got it wrong. Until then, though, there's no need to worry about what might be.

[Corraiv]

*giggles* Mes is a bard--of the male persuasion! I love you, you frost joker.
Yes I'm a Rotard. I'll let you call me(and just me, mind you) that.

((( ))) A blossoming parenthetical bouqet for you, my friends. I need the gluey stuff.

Let's see here. The meaning of life for me. I could signpost and contend that life has become about finding joy in serving God and serving others (with my hands, not just lip service), not to live for myself. Then I could argue that since my sin(past present future) is wiped away, I am free to love, to sing, to dance in ways I have never been able to while the shackles of guilt and shame were still clamped around my ankles. Then I could share some more testimony about how ridiculously blessed I feel to have a loving, non-judgmental, utterly human but utterly sweet Christian family where my own family(and this from personal experience seems to be common to those of us Americans) is dysfunctional and I just don't feel like I belong.

...

But most of all(the sheer weight of this truth still scares me, a poor, overprotected introvert), I wish in my heart of hearts I could put on a "FREE HUGS" t-shirt, jump through the computer screen and give breath-stealing bearhugs to everyone before they know what hit them.

And to my chagrin, I don't think that(me) will be enough. I encourage you, if you want to know what really catches me on fire, I encourage you the next time you have access to a new testament to read through the Gospel of John. Contained within is my favorite verse in the entire bible, John 16:33.

I truly wish there wasn't this wall of glass and all this time, space and distance separating us. But love knows no distance, no nationality; sees beyond the opaque anonymity of the internet. If you met me in real life I would be a lot more awkward, nerdy, but (God help me)still as unbearably concerned and caring as one can stand. I hope you can at least feel the honesty in my words. I may not have answered some questions, but on the other hand, neither do I have all the answers. But I know Someone who does. And he's a tried and true gentleman.

[ArlanKels]

How possible is that God himself is actually the Devil, playing both roles as only he could hope to comprehend how to create a perfect balance betwixt good and evil?

[I_Like_Swordchucks]

Originally Posted by ArlanKels

How possible is that God himself is actually the Devil, playing both roles as only he could hope to comprehend how to create a perfect balance betwixt good and evil?

About as possible as any other theory I'd imagine. I've heard before that the very nature of God to be 'good' forced 'evil' into existence. You could argue that the Devil is an aspect of God, for without evil there can be no good. The entire universe might then be involved in a supernatural battle between Good and Evil, and we as humans are made in the likeness of God, henceforth each of us are representative of this battle as we make choices between good and evil each day in the same way the aspects of God battle with each other. Jesus, for instance, could have been a personification of this good aspect of God in an attempt to win humanity over from the evil side.

I don't know how much of that I really believe, but its an interesting thought.

[ZAKtheGeek]

So when people talk about the meaning of life, they're talking about what they're "supposed" to do?

Shit, pick something that makes you feel good and work towards that. I want to learn and to help humanity. I made that up all by myself, and it works fine.

About as possible as any other theory I'd imagine. I've heard before that the very nature of God to be 'good' forced 'evil' into existence. You could argue that the Devil is an aspect of God, for without evil there can be no good.

Why can't there be good without evil?

[I_Like_Swordchucks]

Originally Posted by ZAKtheGeek

Why can't there be good without evil?

Because good and evil are both relative concepts. Good is good only in relation to evil. If there was no evil, how could something be 'good'? It would simply be normal.

[ZAKtheGeek]

I remember this from the old thread. Quoth Krylo:

Apathy is the absence of good.

Good is seeing someone being raped and attempting to stop it.

Zero good is seeing someone raped and walking away.

Evil is seeing someone being raped and then joining in.

Unlike cold, we have no 'zero good' mark which can not be gone below. You can easily go below not doing good on the moral scale.

...okay, that's not all that relevant. The point here is that, regardless of evil, there can easily be "neutral" actions, and then also good ones. Just because there's no evil doesn't mean everything is good. Simple example: I'm looking at an apple. Is there any evil in this action? No. Does that make it an act of good? No. It's neutral.

[MasterOfMagic]

Originally Posted by Red Fighter 1073

As for Meaning, I would say that the meaning of life is to be happy right?

I'd have to say no, simply because that doesn't mean anything. XD "Be happy" is something you can do, yes. But how does it carry any meaning?

Personally, I don't really care if there's a god or not. I've been both ways, believing in god, then not, then maybe, and then not again. Blah, blah, blah. In the end...it never did anything. I was never any happier either way. I may have passing thoughts or discussions on whether or not it exists, but I don't honestly care whether it exist and messes with things or not.

The only thing religion has really done for me is make my life stressful. My parents are Christian, you see, and so they want me to go to church, and do all that stuff. I whole heartedly do not want to do so, as church is very boring and monotonous, and it requires me to get up really early in the morning. Not to mention the person at the front going on about things I've decided I don't necessarily agree with. To them, it matters what religion my girlfriend is. So if she's not of their faith, then they aren't going to be...happy with the choice. Not to say they'll attempt to break us up, but it puts an invisible weight put on my shoulders. As much as I would like to, and try to, live without caring what they think of certain things: they are my parents. Its hard.

They still think I believe, always have, and there's no way I can tell them otherwise. If I do, that weight I mentioned will be about 5x heavier, and I know for certain they'd be extremely worried and upset; I'll be going to hell after all, right? I'd have to make my mother cry. Why would I want to do that? And so I lie, and pretend, and its all so very annoying.

So, blah. I guess in my little world, its had more of a negative effect. I've seen what "my" church does for the greater good too, though...so meh.