Pokemon Umbral Discussion 37: You Don't Want To Enter This Thread - Page 7

Menarker · 08-20-2010, 04:53 PM

I would assume that anyone with classes in Slayer would be able to carry 6 items.

Also, I didn't technically say that slayers or pokebrids who take classes in trainer or snagger would be immune to enemy attack. What I was saying that is that they can't be DIRECTLY targeted. Basically, it's like a pokemon is actively stepping in the line of fire or blocking a foe's path so as to protect the their actively fighting trainer. However, if the pokemon was somehow unable to do this whether by sleep, frozen, maybe paralysis, or something like that, or if the attack was an AOE attack that would hit both targets anyhow, then the slayer/trainer would still be injured.

As for trainer attack, are you asking if trainers who take ranks in pokebrid or slayers get improved Trainer attacks? Because if both their pokemons are attacking, nothing should stop them from using a normal trainer attack.

Dracorion · 08-20-2010, 05:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Menarker

I would assume that anyone with classes in Slayer would be able to carry 6 items.

I'm not so sure.

Which reminds me, how many items can Pokebrids carry?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Menarker

Also, I didn't technically say that slayers or pokebrids who take classes in trainer or snagger would be immune to enemy attack. What I was saying that is that they can't be DIRECTLY targeted. Basically, it's like a pokemon is actively stepping in the line of fire or blocking a foe's path so as to protect the their actively fighting trainer. However, if the pokemon was somehow unable to do this whether by sleep, frozen, maybe paralysis, or something like that, or if the attack was an AOE attack that would hit both targets anyhow, then the slayer/trainer would still be injured.

That's retarded.

As it is, trainers, PC, NPC or enemy, can be directly targetted by any kind of attacks. We just don't, y'know, do that because we risk all of their pokemon going rogue.

First you'd have to make it so trainers can't be targetted, and then you could make it so Slayers and Pokebrids can't be.

But, I don't agree with that at all. I'm okay with Trainers and Snaggers and all of them being vulnerable to attacks. It's not like we can abuse that anyway, since killing them only makes their pokemon go rogue.

At most, what we could do is take out most of a Trainer's team and then kill them, so that at that point it doesn't really matter if their pokemon go rogue.

Basically, Trainers and Snaggers, and Slayers and Pokebrids who take levels in those classes are already practically immune to enemy attacks (save for status effects like Sleep). I don't think we should make that particular feature official.

Menarker · 08-20-2010, 05:06 PM

I was just making a suggestion and clarifying when I thought you misunderstood me, but fair enough.

As for pokebrids and how many items they can carry, I thought it was 3 myself. I don't know though and it seems like the updates sheets don't even mention Slayers having access to 6 items instead of 3.

Astral Harmony · 08-20-2010, 05:22 PM

Overblades that can double attack actually have an additionally action in which they must attack. They can't use it to use another item, for example.

A PC Battle Master wouldn't be able to use a Trainer attack. I mean, why would they use a Trainer Attack when they can just...y'know...attack? Besides, these days it just doesn't feel like Trainer attacks do anything, especially not against bosses.

Dracorion · 08-20-2010, 06:02 PM

Thanks.

What about items?

Also, maybe we can buff trainer attacks in some way? Like, provide the trainers with weapons that cause certain status effects or debuffs? For example, Pierce is attacking with a Dragon Slave, so (totally forgot about this), half the time the targets he hits should take -1 Special Defense. Maybe we could buff trainer attacks so that, say, instead of a 50% chance of -1 Spec. Def, it'll be something like -2. And Charlotte could get a similar effect for her weapon. And Renny can get something like that if he ever gets a weapon.

Menarker · 08-20-2010, 06:55 PM

I'd think Gem would definately veto a boost of that magnitude simply because Trainer Attacks are free attacks that don't take away from any of the actions of the trainer. I personally never felt like Trainer Attacks really amounted to very much anyhow. I don't even include them normally when it comes to battle plans.

Dracorion · 08-20-2010, 07:08 PM

Then it comes down to whether we want to remove them or make them useful.

I vote making them useful.

Bard The 5th LW · 08-20-2010, 07:14 PM

I vote keeping them the same.

Thematics and whatnot.

Although I would like to put the jar of Phantomere's blood to some use...

Dracorion · 08-20-2010, 07:21 PM

I thought it was just Phantomere's ooze.

Anyway, no one's saying make them as strong as Slayer attacks. Just make them useful.

Menarker · 08-20-2010, 07:23 PM

Well, I don't mind making them useful, but the question is how to do so without making them too strong for a free action... Otherwise, I'd let everyone keep them, but I wouldn't care about them either way. (It's not like I would have Renny choose to pick up a weapon.)

The factors that make up a a Trainer Attack is...

A: Allows Trainer to hit enemy as a free action.
B: Attack is fairly weak.
C: Generates no Rage.

Although we also seem to have homebrewed the following...

D: Custom Item can be made for typing purpose when Trainer attacking.

So we if change it... some things we could consider...

1: Boosts its power minorly, but keep the rest as is.
2: Not making it a free action, but boost its power worth using and give Trainers an additional action to use Trainer Attack or an item or something like that. Basically, make it so the trainer attack can be replaced with a difference action. (Not advised unless you want to have people dualclassing to trainer for an extra action... although it takes 3 levels of trainer to do so. More or less unfair though to everyone who didn't start as a trainer.)
3: Making it gain the base amount of rage while keeping its power the same. (Which could end up being higher if the trainer is a Slayer (which gains 10 per attack) or a level 1 or 5 Breeder, Deva or Overblade.
4: Give additional effect of some sort, perhaps a Debuff or something like that. Probably nothing too strong.
5: Make its power boostable by rage or something.

08-20-2010, 04:53 PM	#61
Menarker OMG! WHAT SHOULD I DO NOW? Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 3,802	I would assume that anyone with classes in Slayer would be able to carry 6 items. Also, I didn't technically say that slayers or pokebrids who take classes in trainer or snagger would be immune to enemy attack. What I was saying that is that they can't be DIRECTLY targeted. Basically, it's like a pokemon is actively stepping in the line of fire or blocking a foe's path so as to protect the their actively fighting trainer. However, if the pokemon was somehow unable to do this whether by sleep, frozen, maybe paralysis, or something like that, or if the attack was an AOE attack that would hit both targets anyhow, then the slayer/trainer would still be injured. As for trainer attack, are you asking if trainers who take ranks in pokebrid or slayers get improved Trainer attacks? Because if both their pokemons are attacking, nothing should stop them from using a normal trainer attack. __________________ THE BIO OF RENNY TRESSERHORN THE BIOs OF POKEMON UMBRAL! Last edited by Menarker; 08-20-2010 at 04:57 PM.

08-20-2010, 05:06 PM	#63
Menarker OMG! WHAT SHOULD I DO NOW? Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 3,802	I was just making a suggestion and clarifying when I thought you misunderstood me, but fair enough. As for pokebrids and how many items they can carry, I thought it was 3 myself. I don't know though and it seems like the updates sheets don't even mention Slayers having access to 6 items instead of 3. __________________ THE BIO OF RENNY TRESSERHORN THE BIOs OF POKEMON UMBRAL!

08-20-2010, 06:02 PM	#65
Dracorion Moves Like Jagger, Kupo! Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: To the south, a little to the left... Or to the right. Posts: 4,910	Thanks. What about items? Also, maybe we can buff trainer attacks in some way? Like, provide the trainers with weapons that cause certain status effects or debuffs? For example, Pierce is attacking with a Dragon Slave, so (totally forgot about this), half the time the targets he hits should take -1 Special Defense. Maybe we could buff trainer attacks so that, say, instead of a 50% chance of -1 Spec. Def, it'll be something like -2. And Charlotte could get a similar effect for her weapon. And Renny can get something like that if he ever gets a weapon. __________________ Dracorion's dumbass color is Royal Blue. If you see that color, you better run the fuck away.

08-20-2010, 06:55 PM	#66
Menarker OMG! WHAT SHOULD I DO NOW? Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 3,802	I'd think Gem would definately veto a boost of that magnitude simply because Trainer Attacks are free attacks that don't take away from any of the actions of the trainer. I personally never felt like Trainer Attacks really amounted to very much anyhow. I don't even include them normally when it comes to battle plans. __________________ THE BIO OF RENNY TRESSERHORN THE BIOs OF POKEMON UMBRAL!

08-20-2010, 07:08 PM	#67
Dracorion Moves Like Jagger, Kupo! Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: To the south, a little to the left... Or to the right. Posts: 4,910	Then it comes down to whether we want to remove them or make them useful. I vote making them useful. __________________ Dracorion's dumbass color is Royal Blue. If you see that color, you better run the fuck away.

08-20-2010, 05:22 PM	#64
Astral Harmony Don't Hate Me 'Cause I'm Moe Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: Harmonial Sanctum Posts: 6,798	Overblades that can double attack actually have an additionally action in which they must attack. They can't use it to use another item, for example. A PC Battle Master wouldn't be able to use a Trainer attack. I mean, why would they use a Trainer Attack when they can just...y'know...attack? Besides, these days it just doesn't feel like Trainer attacks do anything, especially not against bosses.

08-20-2010, 07:14 PM	#68
Bard The 5th LW Feelin' Super! Join Date: May 2009 Posts: 4,191	I vote keeping them the same. Thematics and whatnot. Although I would like to put the jar of Phantomere's blood to some use...

08-20-2010, 07:21 PM	#69
Dracorion Moves Like Jagger, Kupo! Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: To the south, a little to the left... Or to the right. Posts: 4,910	I thought it was just Phantomere's ooze. Anyway, no one's saying make them as strong as Slayer attacks. Just make them useful. __________________ Dracorion's dumbass color is Royal Blue. If you see that color, you better run the fuck away.

08-20-2010, 07:23 PM	#70
Menarker OMG! WHAT SHOULD I DO NOW? Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 3,802	Well, I don't mind making them useful, but the question is how to do so without making them too strong for a free action... Otherwise, I'd let everyone keep them, but I wouldn't care about them either way. (It's not like I would have Renny choose to pick up a weapon.) The factors that make up a a Trainer Attack is... A: Allows Trainer to hit enemy as a free action. B: Attack is fairly weak. C: Generates no Rage. Although we also seem to have homebrewed the following... D: Custom Item can be made for typing purpose when Trainer attacking. So we if change it... some things we could consider... 1: Boosts its power minorly, but keep the rest as is. 2: Not making it a free action, but boost its power worth using and give Trainers an additional action to use Trainer Attack or an item or something like that. Basically, make it so the trainer attack can be replaced with a difference action. (Not advised unless you want to have people dualclassing to trainer for an extra action... although it takes 3 levels of trainer to do so. More or less unfair though to everyone who didn't start as a trainer.) 3: Making it gain the base amount of rage while keeping its power the same. (Which could end up being higher if the trainer is a Slayer (which gains 10 per attack) or a level 1 or 5 Breeder, Deva or Overblade. 4: Give additional effect of some sort, perhaps a Debuff or something like that. Probably nothing too strong. 5: Make its power boostable by rage or something. __________________ THE BIO OF RENNY TRESSERHORN THE BIOs OF POKEMON UMBRAL! Last edited by Menarker; 08-20-2010 at 07:26 PM.