Mafia: Basic

[Mondt]

In my opinion, Ogianres' actions make sense to me. He's super-defensive, and thus has a reason to be. Like being mafia. Let's put it in steps:

1) People are overreacting over his joke
2) He gets really defensive, although it's a stupid claim anyway.
3) Lots of big words and angry people.
4) Reason to vote for either TWG, Mesden, or CmP. CmP, being the party with one person seems like he might deserve a vote more. How -- that works out is beyond me.

It may just be CmP, or it might be that he has a role/trait which makes him important somehow. We aren't sure, but he seems more suspicious than anyone at the moment. Which is reason to vote for him. I'll hold off 'til later tonight for a vote, though.

[Mesden]

Originally Posted by sk3L3t0n

In my opinion, Ogianres' actions make sense to me. He's super-defensive, and thus has a reason to be. Like being mafia. Let's put it in steps:

1) People are overreacting over his joke
2) He gets really defensive, although it's a stupid claim anyway.
3) Lots of big words and angry people.
4) Reason to vote for either TWG, Mesden, or CmP. CmP, being the party with one person seems like he might deserve a vote more. How -- that works out is beyond me.

It may just be CmP, or it might be that he has a role/trait which makes him important somehow. We aren't sure, but he seems more suspicious than anyone at the moment. Which is reason to vote for him. I'll hold off 'til later tonight for a vote, though.

Uh...didn't...Didn't I say that...Like, a few times?

[Silly Kitty]

Okay, I never thought CMP would be guilty just because of joke and that didn't go as planned. I did think he was mafia because he seemed to know what the mafia would do and gave a lot of reasons about mafia stuff. I know that could just be because he once was mafia but Twiddy in SOL mafia did the same thing and turned out to be mafia. I am not going to vote now because if he is a townie it looks like I was mafia and just trying to get someone gone. If he is mafia it looks like I'm mafia and just voting for him to clear my name. It is a lose lose situation for me. So, I am going to hold my vote.

[CallmePrismatic]

Vote: Ogianres

Now, this may seem like a desperate bid, and in fact it was on a 'well I'm gone anyway'-whim I decided to check it out, but Ogianres is a big posterchild for the "Hide Under the Wings of the More Experienced"-award.

In chronological order...

Originally Posted by TWG

And now I'm going to FoS:Catlover20410 for voting, unvoting, THEN VOTING again for the same person.

Originally Posted by Ogianres

VOTE: Catlover
I considered just FOS'ing him, but I believe his votes had very little reasoning, and I think he may be trying to get a bandwagon started. In fact, getting a bandwagon on Mesden would not only be easy, but if she is lynched and is townie, then it's easier to make it look like an honest mistake.

Innocent enough, the button-mashing as it were seems (and turned out to be) very scummy, so voting for one makes sense.

*3 pages pass*

Originally Posted by TWG

Upon reflection, I'd say Catlover is the same as last time. A citizen with entirely too much zeal, and easily led at that. A dangerous weapon in the hands of a skilled mafiate manipulator. Or a nuisance.

But maybe not mafiate. Maybe not.

Originally Posted by Ogianres IN THE VERY NEXT POST

I have to agree that Catlover is probably an overzealous townie. I've seen people act like that before. UNVOTE

Now, me and Ogianres seem to have had similar experiences with button mashing, but he appears to switch between "Vote-mashers are all mafia!" and "Yah know, most vote-mashers I've known are overzealous town-aligned." Quite an easy switch it seems.

Later he FOS's Supreme Edgemaster for voting for a No Lynch (something I'd like to think I'm well known to be against, but not vain enough to claim some sort of CmP Postulate), but it isn't as pronounced as the other examples even though two other people posted pretty much the same thing before him.

Originally Posted by TWG talking about Mes and I

One, or both of you, are acting extremely peculiar.

Originally Posted by Ogianres, very next post again

Actually TWG, that is very sound reasoning. Unfortunately, I get very paranoid when someone else says something that would convince me rather than just them saying something I already agree with... I think that's the reason I have some weird gut feeling about CmP and Mesden. Ick, no wonder it's so hard for me to figure things out.

Wow, second time he's agreed with something TWG said.

At this point in my research I considered the possibility that TWG and Ogianres were two Masons, but that would mean Mes would have to be the third and there's too much bickering between the two/three to be possible. It seems to me that Ogianres just seems poised to agree with TWG at the slighest moment...

Originally Posted by The Vote Count

Catlover
H4x.M4g3
Thundergod Cid
Silly Kitty
Fenris Wolf
Darth Mauler 64
The Wandering God

Although I fear I may be joining a scum bandwagon, but I fear more that we could miss scum if we choose not to vote, so VOTE: Catlover.

Ya know, all the fuss was made over catlover switching votes with abandon, but Ogianres has been doing it the entire game...well, as long as other people were doing it. Something else to note is that at that vote count point, catlover had officially garnered more (1 to be exact) more votes than B_real. If I had to guess, Oggy may have realized that one of his own was going down no matter what and if he had to put a vote down it might as well be for the bad guys so if anyone looked over it later...

Originally Posted by Ogianres, after a good deal of the CmP-TWG-Mes show

I'm going to FOS: CmP.

I believe that I can for sure trust Mesden now. Before, I didn't believe I could trust her because she could be both experienced and scum, but now I know she's experienced and townie. However, the fact that he keeps defending himself regarding the joke post is ridiculous. It was a joke post, and I don't think anyone should be suspicious about a joke post. Instead, I think that suspicion should be cast upon those who seemed to agree/take the joke post too seriously.

Gotcha, Mes is a revealed townie and NOW we trust her...well her and TWG, and that's 2 outta 3. Also, I like how he acknowledges that he realizes its a joke, and says that the suspicion should be cast on those who took the joke seriously...like Mes and TWG. At this point I'm sure he was glad he invested in that Paradox Dampener.
*3 pages of back and forth later*

Originally Posted by Ogianres

I think that pretty much all three of you are over-reacting. It was a joke, and jokes usually are part of the first-page random vote. I see it all the time in MafiaScum.net. I don't think anyone other than Mesden and TWG are taking it at all seriously, or a lot of people could just be lurkers. However, CmP is getting really over-defensive about it, and he seems to be stressing over it more than he should. All three of you would normally tie on my scum list. Mesden, being a confirmed townie, is at the bottom of my suspicions list. That leaves TWG and CmP. TWG has been using relevant posts and what has been said to explain his suspicions. CmP, as has been said before, is only relying on his word. I think I believe that CmP deserves a VOTE, and if he is townie, let me be struck down by the vigilante (if it has been/will be reassigned).

So Mes and TWG are still taking it seriously, I'm still being overdefensive, and since I'm in the minority I deserve the vote. Also, I'd talk about the 'relying only on my word' thing but I covered that.

After that he does the "Hey why are you so mad about being on the lynching block?"-thing I shot down.

Even after all that, however, I saw that he had been given a personality allowing him to see 'Night Actions' or something (he hasn't really given a detailed explanation), so I thought I might be misguided, digging up dirt on a townie. But then Newb explained how personalities and alignments/roles are different and can be stacked as it were, so that threw out that particular hole.

So I'm going to stick with that vote. I believe he is a mafiate who's clung to the underbelly of whoever could draw the most support, and attention, away from him.

[P-Sleazy]

What's sad is that makes WAY more sense than anything I've heard so far. Not to mention, after reading each of those posts, in the way you ordered them mind you, I've noticed that generally everything he said, was a restatement of TWG. He didn't actually contribute anything in those posts when you showed his posts after TWG's post.

BTW, nice of you to finally try and take some heat off yourself and Bounce it off at someone else.

I'll be looking over all of Ogianres' posts (and related TWG posts) tonight before I decide on whether I'll be changing my vote or not.

[CallmePrismatic]

Originally Posted by B_real_shadows

What's sad is that makes WAY more sense than anything I've heard so far. Not to mention, after reading each of those posts, in the way you ordered them mind you, I've noticed that generally everything he said, was a restatement of TWG. He didn't actually contribute anything in those posts when you showed his posts after TWG's post.
.

If by 'ordered' you mean 'presented chronologically', then yeah, that's how it sorta looks.

[Thundergod Cid]

Because of CmP's post and the fact that Ogianres has been on and didn't respond to either of the posts against him (Newb said we could check to see when someone was last on) I shall now upgrade my finger of suspicion to a Vote: Ogianres.

[P-Sleazy]

Originally Posted by CmP

Ya know, all the fuss was made over catlover switching votes with abandon, but Ogianres has been doing it the entire game...well, as long as other people were doing it. Something else to note is that at that vote count point, catlover had officially garnered more (1 to be exact) more votes than B_real. If I had to guess, Oggy may have realized that one of his own was going down no matter what and if he had to put a vote down it might as well be for the bad guys so if anyone looked over it later...

In this little tidbit you made, Twiddy already voted for Catlover before Ogianres voted, which btw, was right after Newb's deadline post. So I think it was more as a realization that was made once Newb posted the Deadline, and him just continueing to use TWG as his foil so to speak.

And Lo and Behold A post that isn't influenced by TWG other than his first post.

And then there's also this little number here.

Originally Posted by Ogianres post 26

Actually, I have a personality. It isn't too useful sometimes, but it can be. You see, I can't help it, I'm extremely nosy. I like to know what other people are doing. At night, I spy on people. If anybody is doing anything to somebody else, I will know. I can tell when somebody is heading towards someone else's house, but I can only tell who's being targeted. Like last night, I saw a shadowy figure heading to TWG's house, and someone else tailing them. Some things I notice can be helpful, but not all. It's kind of like the death scene where it may include a clue or red herring.
Anyways, I can't see anyone being suspicious right now, but I will keep my eye on things. Especially you Mesden. That's right, I read the other games [/joking].

Originally Posted by Ogianres Post 249

Well the reporter was reassigned but either the vig didn't get reassigned or if someone got it they didn't use their night role. I certainly didn't notice anything last night.

But certainly you must have seen who was targetted right and how the person got there right Ogianres? Otherwise, I would think you're faking the whole "personality trait" you got going for you.

And then theres his defense from my FOS on him that seems to make MUCH more sense now really.

My accusation there was saying that If he and TWWDI were both mafiates they could have swung that vote on me easy. But since TWWDI voted for Catlover, and if Ogianres was a mafiate, he didn't vote for me because that wouldn't aid him any in helping keep a fellow mafiate alive, but it COULD help him keep suspicions off of him. And if BOTH TWWDI and OGIANRES were mafiates, they probably would have tried to save Catlover. And he also FOS'd me for the 4th freakin time there! Its only the SECOND DAY!

Originally Posted by Ogianres post 306

CmP, you are just being aggresive and sarcastic now, which doesn't help in the slightest. And don't tell me that you are acting this way because of vote pressure. If I get an influx of votes right now it wouldn't bother me. Why? Because as a townie, my death can actually help gain insight. I believe that the same would apply to any townie that may be lynched. IMO the only people who believes that being lynched is nothing but bad (for them) are anti-town. If you are townie and die, I, and many others I would hope, would seriously evaluate all the posts of this day.

Speak of the devil, we're evaluating your posts BEFORE the day is up.
And there's that big IF right there too. IF you got an influx of votes it wouldn't bother you? Hmmmm, probably cause there hasn't been a single vote for you yet.

Originally Posted by Ogianres post 308

You do have a very good point SK. However, I don't have any reason to believe that CmP is cop, and reporter is a very big if on the town/anit-town thing. If CmP has substantial evidence to suggest that he is reporter/cop/doc/whatever then I would not vote for him.

But what if HE DID say he was the cop/reporter, There would be NO WAY whatsoever that he could provide that substantial evidence without it being bad for the town. If he did say he was a cop, all he would have to do is say "so and so is a townie" and so and so would agree with him regardless of his role because that means that he wont be lynched and MUCH less likely to be hit at night. He could even be a mafiate, as a fellow mafiate to sacrifice himself, and there, he's "proven" a cop when in fact isnt.

SO...I'll UNVOTE: CmP
and VOTE: Ogianres

Phew, Never thought I'd do one of these SUPER posts

Edit: Fixed Quote Tags

Double Edit to CmP: Well, people can order quotes to make things look more incriminating. But yes, you did do them Chronologically.

[Silly Kitty]

Forgive me for not reading that post earlier, CMP. I saw a huge post and just went, ^^', maybe later. You do make a lot of sense with that post. When he clings to what others say that are more experienced he really taking the light off himself. I don't know if that really clears your name CMP but I am going to have to FOS: Ogianres. If he doesn't give me a reason not to vote for him I will vote for him tonight.


Edit: Ninja'd by B_real. All I have to say is wow. Vote: Ogianres. Post 26 is really what clicked it for me.

[Mondt]

Originally Posted by Thundergod Cid

Because of CmP's post and the fact that Ogianres has been on and didn't respond to either of the posts against him (Newb said we could check to see when someone was last on) I shall now upgrade my finger of suspicion to a Vote: Ogianres.

How does that make sense?

Damn. I find myself arguing against bad reasoning again, while looking like a I defend someone.

I'm on a lot, actually, I never log off. If I don't get on for a day or two, is that reason to vote for me? It's possible that he hasn't even seen those attacks.

Edit: Why is having a trait like that bad? Man, logic must be failing me or something.
Edit2: How is post 249 hurting him? He said he didn't notice anything about the vig, or who he may have targetted. How is that contradicting his claimed night-trait? I don't know if I'm thinking too hard, or if I just have bad luck and he's a mafiate, but this is kind of ridiculous to me.