The Big Big Thread of Religious Discussion - Page 63

42PETUNIAS · 02-22-2007, 11:07 PM

Quote:

But that's the thing. We're only finding these errors because they make themselves clear by being contradictory. Who knows what other issues there could be with the texts?

Well, a couple hundred posts back, Krylo mentioned some major difficulties with the hebrew language. Considering the fact that there are over 600 posts, im obviously not going to find it, but I think it mentioned that the word we interpret as eternity, really just means a time.

That's an enormous problem right there. A lot of my problems with christianity stem from the idea that anyone who doesn't accept Jesus gets to live in hell for the rest of eternity. If the bible had that down as "a time", I'm sure the views would be much more understandable.

Krylo also mentioned something about the word we interpret as "hell" was actually a burning pit (or something) where they would discard of the bodies of criminals.

Again, this isn't very accurate, but those are two huge differences that you wouldn't find just looking for contradictions.

ZAKtheGeek · 02-22-2007, 11:50 PM

There is a "Search Thread" function...

Quote:

Originally Posted by krylo

Accurate/Ambiguous: Just for STARTERS, there's how many different translations of the bible? Only one of them can be correct. Oh and how about that crazy hebrew language? Here's a fun fact, there's no word in hebrew for eternal or eternity. The word used to describe either eternity in heaven OR hell, actually means 'a time'. Let's take it a bit further, the hebrew word for hell is Gehenna. Gehenna is a small valley north of mesopotamia, where the jewish people threw their garbage to burn. They also threw the bodies of their criminals there, and, as that human fat is a complex carbon chain, it burns slow and never goes out. Thus you spend a time in the ever burning fires of the valley of gehenna if you were a sinner. This is a LITERAL phrase in the old testament. Not spiritual.

Elminster_Amaur · 02-23-2007, 12:10 AM

About the whole "number of Abraham's sons" thing. Yeah, even as written it's not contradictory.

See, that phrase "only begotten" does not mean that it's the only child/son, it means that that's the only child who is recieving inheritance, or only legitimate child. The rest are bastards and are not counted in the those times.

That is also why Jesus can be called the "only begotten son" of God. Everything else is a creation, not a direct offspring. That entire site you listed is as bad with their arguments as most of them "christian science" websites I used to quote. My Engineering Ethics teacher is fond of saying, "if you pay someone to prove something, what do you think they're going to do? They'll go and prove it."

Mirai Gen · 02-23-2007, 01:58 AM

Part of the giant contradiction of ideas that I truly can't wrap my head around is the fact that people can read the Bible and not have it make sense, and instead of walking away from it with an expression that said you got thrown out of the car halfway through a blowjob, they just seem as happy as can be that something didn't make sense.

I'm not saying that people who don't care about thinking are the only religious ones...But I am questioning exactly why it is we can have things in the Bible that just don't make any kind of sense and yet be totally okay with it. Or even be more okay, since that means that there's something you get to think about for a while. Anyone?

ZAKtheGeek · 02-23-2007, 01:23 PM

Quote:

But I am questioning exactly why it is we can have things in the Bible that just don't make any kind of sense and yet be totally okay with it. Or even be more okay, since that means that there's something you get to think about for a while. Anyone?

Dude, that's how art and literature work...

Solid Snake · 02-23-2007, 03:33 PM

Man, I'm really interested in this topic of discussion, but at the same time, I'm also scared shitless of what getting involved will actually entail.

I'm sure, however, merely announcing the fact that I am an evangelical Christian, who was an atheist a mere three years ago and has since been "born again," will launch a firestorm here.

I fully expect Locke to have desecrated on my corpse by this time tomorrow.

ZAKtheGeek · 02-23-2007, 04:23 PM

*unzips*

What caused you to be "born again?"

Nique · 02-23-2007, 05:20 PM

Quote:

But I am questioning exactly why it is we can have things in the Bible that just don't make any kind of sense and yet be totally okay with it.

What seems to happen, is that people will do one of two things at this juncture: 1) ignore what they don't understand, or 2) walk away from it completely, assuming that becuase of some apparent contradictions, the Bible is compeltely bunk.

Understanding linguistics and context is crucial to understanding the Bible and realizing that, whether or not it is the inspired word of God, it actually doesn't contradict itself. You wouldn't know it from a study of typical "christian" doctrines and church history, unfortunatly... But the Bible itself isn't really the problem when it comes to this.

ZAKtheGeek · 02-23-2007, 06:31 PM

It depends which bible you're talking about. Perhaps not the very most original set of documents, but any version you might read today is going to have indisputable contradictions in it, as demonstrated. Which doesn't mean the entire thing is a load of holy crap, but certainly that you shouldn't assume everything in there is absolutely right, since you know for sure that some of it simply cannot be.

Nique · 02-23-2007, 06:40 PM

Quote:

It depends which bible you're talking about. Perhaps not the very most original set of documents, but any version you might read today is going to have indisputable contradictions in it, as demonstrated.

Since these parts require some understanding of the original writings, as I mentioned, I'm not sure what you mean.

Maybe you could give an example and we can take it from there?

Quote:

What caused you to be "born again?"

I can't speak for Solid, but I was born right the first time.

I keed! I keed!

02-23-2007, 12:10 AM	#623
Elminster_Amaur Her hands were cold and small. Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: My Mind Posts: 2,049	About the whole "number of Abraham's sons" thing. Yeah, even as written it's not contradictory. See, that phrase "only begotten" does not mean that it's the only child/son, it means that that's the only child who is recieving inheritance, or only legitimate child. The rest are bastards and are not counted in the those times. That is also why Jesus can be called the "only begotten son" of God. Everything else is a creation, not a direct offspring. That entire site you listed is as bad with their arguments as most of them "christian science" websites I used to quote. My Engineering Ethics teacher is fond of saying, "if you pay someone to prove something, what do you think they're going to do? They'll go and prove it." __________________ "It just rubs me the wrong way." -CJ, most likely about non-yaoi porn or something

02-23-2007, 01:58 AM	#624
Mirai Gen We are Geth. Join Date: Nov 2003 Posts: 14,032	Part of the giant contradiction of ideas that I truly can't wrap my head around is the fact that people can read the Bible and not have it make sense, and instead of walking away from it with an expression that said you got thrown out of the car halfway through a blowjob, they just seem as happy as can be that something didn't make sense. I'm not saying that people who don't care about thinking are the only religious ones...But I am questioning exactly why it is we can have things in the Bible that just don't make any kind of sense and yet be totally okay with it. Or even be more okay, since that means that there's something you get to think about for a while. Anyone? __________________

02-23-2007, 03:33 PM	#626
Solid Snake Erotic Esquire Join Date: Nov 2003 Posts: 5,563	Man, I'm really interested in this topic of discussion, but at the same time, I'm also scared shitless of what getting involved will actually entail. I'm sure, however, merely announcing the fact that I am an evangelical Christian, who was an atheist a mere three years ago and has since been "born again," will launch a firestorm here. I fully expect Locke to have desecrated on my corpse by this time tomorrow. __________________ *WARNING:* Snek's all up in this thread. Be prepared to read massive walls of text.

02-23-2007, 04:23 PM	#627
ZAKtheGeek Worth every yenny Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: not my mind that's for sure! Posts: 1,299	unzips What caused you to be "born again?" __________________ Pyro Icon - It needs your love. I haven't looked at it in months.

02-23-2007, 06:31 PM	#629
ZAKtheGeek Worth every yenny Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: not my mind that's for sure! Posts: 1,299	It depends which bible you're talking about. Perhaps not the very most original set of documents, but any version you might read today is going to have indisputable contradictions in it, as demonstrated. Which doesn't mean the entire thing is a load of holy crap, but certainly that you shouldn't assume everything in there is absolutely right, since you know for sure that some of it simply cannot be. __________________ Pyro Icon - It needs your love. I haven't looked at it in months.