North Korea test fires long range rocket.

[Bob The Mercenary]

Pentagon to cut missile defense spending and recommends cancelling 2nd Boeing airborne laser demonstration program.

This is all leaving me very uneasy. Even if NK is years away from completing a functioning warhead, they have shown that they have nothing against proliferating fissile materials throughout the world to aid their battered economy. Why wait until they're a threat? I don't mean military action, I'm just getting anxious watching all these politicians "talk".

[Edit] Also, apologies for the thread title. It won't happen again.

[POS Industries]

Originally Posted by Bob the Mercenary

Why wait until they're a threat?

Because it's highly unlikely that they will ever be one. This is a country that can't even keep the lights on through most of the day, and what resources they do have are of Chinese origin. Their economy tanked before it was the cool thing to do, what little money they do have has been pumped to a smaller degree into classic communist military parades and to a larger extent into Kim Jong Il's wannabe gangsta lifestyle. So far all they've done is one failed explosive test that some doubt was even really nuclear to begin with and this recent bottle rocket they fired into the pacific. Ooooooooh scary!

This entire "look at us, we're trying to get the bomb" charade is just a pathetic and mostly impotent cry for attention and I honestly don't see any point in wasting time and money placating their national ego. If we're going to worry about nuclear threats, getting all those former Soviet warheads rounded up and accounted for should be our key concern.

[Mesden]

Originally Posted by POS Industries

Because it's highly unlikely that they will ever be one. This is a country that can't even keep the lights on through most of the day, and what resources they do have are of Chinese origin. Their economy tanked before it was the cool thing to do, what little money they do have has been pumped to a smaller degree into classic communist military parades and to a larger extent into Kim Jong Il's wannabe gangsta lifestyle. So far all they've done is one failed explosive test that some doubt was even really nuclear to begin with and this recent bottle rocket they fired into the pacific. Ooooooooh scary!

This entire "look at us, we're trying to get the bomb" charade is just a pathetic and mostly impotent cry for attention and I honestly don't see any point in wasting time and money placating their national ego. If we're going to worry about nuclear threats, getting all those former Soviet warheads rounded up and accounted for should be our key concern.

On top of that, the "Why wait until they're a threat?" opinion is what has gotten us into stupid wars before, like Vietnam where we decided "Why wait until they're a communist threat?" and Bay of Pigs for the exact same reason. If we justified every course of action like that, we'd preemptively invade every country that looks at us funny, like Iran and, for the past while, Iraq.

[01d55]

Originally Posted by Bob the Mercenary

Pentagon to cut missile defense spending and recommends cancelling 2nd Boeing airborne laser demonstration program.

This is all leaving me very uneasy. Even if NK is years away from completing a functioning warhead, they have shown that they have nothing against proliferating fissile materials throughout the world to aid their battered economy. Why wait until they're a threat? I don't mean military action, I'm just getting anxious watching all these politicians "talk".

[Edit] Also, apologies for the thread title. It won't happen again.

1. We're not waiting, we're abandoning a dead end project long after it became clear the thing was never gonna work.

2. NK is not a threat to us. We are a threat to NK. There is no country that threatens the United States, the very idea that any other country could threaten the U.S. (save the symmetrical threat of M.A.D.) is absurd. The foreign policy elite promotes this absurd idea constantly to manufacture public consent to their program of threatening and waging aggressive war on other countries.

[Pip Boy]

Originally Posted by 01d55

There is no country that threatens the United States, the very idea that any other country could threaten the U.S. (save the symmetrical threat of M.A.D.) is absurd. The foreign policy elite promotes this absurd idea constantly to manufacture public consent to their program of threatening and waging aggressive war on other countries.

Are you serious? America may be one of the most powerful nations in the world, but we're far from invincible, and an arrogant attitude like that in foreign policy would only make things worse. As much as I wish all of that "Go America" G. I. Joe crap would actually help the country, you can't make bullets out of patriotism and Uncle Sam isn't going to save us when times get tough. Nor will the hand of God reach down to save us when we have half of the world's nukes flying at us. America may be a one of the world's most powerful countries, but so are France, England, Russia, China, Japan, and Germany. You are really overestimating the power of the American armed forces.

[Doc ock rokc]

Originally Posted by Megaman FTW

Are you serious? America may be one of the most powerful nations in the world, but we're far from invincible, and an arrogant attitude like that in foreign policy would only make things worse. As much as I wish all of that "Go America" G. I. Joe crap would actually help the country, you can't make bullets out of patriotism and Uncle Sam isn't going to save us when times get tough. Nor will the hand of God reach down to save us when we have half of the world's nukes flying at us. America may be a one of the world's most powerful countries, but so are France, England, Russia, China, Japan, and Germany. You are really overestimating the power of the American armed forces.

So very true. But do to being a superpower during the cold war we have a lot of nukes and a lot of Anti missile systems in place. but i really think that those wont give a flip if we piss off everyone. that's why we are allies with France, England, the new Russia, China, Japan, and Germany. because when the nukes start flying we wont be the ones on their launch list. We also have the UN on our side if NK attacks first. But the chance of their bottle rocket...rocket getting here is the exact same as a snowball jugglers job in hell

[Pip Boy]

Originally Posted by Doc ock rokc

So very true. But do to being a superpower during the cold war we have a lot of nukes and a lot of Anti missile systems in place. but i really think that those wont give a flip if we piss off everyone. that's why we are allies with France, England, the new Russia, China, Japan, and Germany. because when the nukes start flying we wont be the ones on their launch list. We also have the UN on our side if NK attacks first. But the chance of their bottle rocket...rocket getting here is the exact same as a snowball jugglers job in hell

Either way, taking this situation lightly, much less arrogantly, would be unwise, especially when we're dealing with nukclear weapons. One nuke on the right city would be a national tragedy that make 9-11 look like a walk through the park.

[01d55]

Look at that fucking ridiculous chart and tell me that anyone can threaten the United States. We could spend a tenth as much and still spend four times as much as Canada!

From the standpoint of a defensive military force - an armed force oriented towards its proper role as a deterrent and defence against foreign aggression - the U.S. Military is incomprehensibly oversized.

As the enforcement arm of a global empire, it's much more reasonably sized, perhaps even a bit too small. Attacking a country that isn't geographically adjacent requires a vastly disproportionate expenditure than would a commensurate defence against such an attack, largely due to logistics. However, this does not mean that there is any country that threatens the U.S. Imperialism is unjustifiable. To say that the possibility that a country might be able to resist aggression from America means that country threatens America is Orwellian.

[Professor Smarmiarty]

Originally Posted by Megaman FTW

Are you serious? America may be one of the most powerful nations in the world, but we're far from invincible, and an arrogant attitude like that in foreign policy would only make things worse. As much as I wish all of that "Go America" G. I. Joe crap would actually help the country, you can't make bullets out of patriotism and Uncle Sam isn't going to save us when times get tough. Nor will the hand of God reach down to save us when we have half of the world's nukes flying at us. America may be a one of the world's most powerful countries, but so are France, England, Russia, China, Japan, and Germany. You are really overestimating the power of the American armed forces.

I think the point 55 was making is that the economies of all the most powerful countries in the world are all so tied into each other and particularly into America that it would require a very odd set of circumstances for them to wage war against America as it would have drastic effects on thier economy which would hamper not only the aftermath of the war but wargoing ability itself.

In purely military terms, however, the US is the strongest but would certainly be threatened by China in particular. Especially as the US Navy, which would be crucial in such a war, continues to rely on massive warships which military wisdom has really discredited recentely.

Getting back to the subject at hand, North Korea really aren't a threat to anyone. Back when they announced they were detonating a small nuclear warhead a year ago (I think it was about it) China began specifically monitoring the region where they said the test was and said they found nothing, despite NK saying the test was a success. Most of the stuff that comes out of there is just talk.

[Pip Boy]

Originally Posted by 01d55

Look at that fucking ridiculous chart and tell me that anyone can threaten the United States. We could spend a tenth as much and still spend ten times as much as Canada!

From the standpoint of a defensive military force - an armed force oriented towards its proper role as a deterrent and defence against foreign aggression - the U.S. Military is incomprehensibly oversized.

As the enforcement arm of a global empire, it's much more reasonably sized, perhaps even a bit too small. Attacking a country that isn't geographically adjacent requires a vastly disproportionate expenditure than would a commensurate defence against such an attack, largely due to logistics. However, this does not mean that there is any country that threatens the U.S. Imperialism is unjustifiable. To say that the possibility that a country might be able to resist aggression from America means that country threatens America is Orwellian.

Hey. I spent like, 180 dollars on a used Xbox. And it was broken. So I spent 100 dollars repairing it. And it broke again after 2 months. So I bought a new Xbox for 200 dollars.

Obviously, this means that my Xbox 360 Arcade must be better than my neighbor's elite because I spent more money on it.

POINT BEING: Spending a lot of money on military does not make your military more powerful. It just means you spend a lot of money on military. There is no telling how much of that was spent on something useful and how much was spent on gold-plated toilet seats.

Now, I don't think that North Korea alone does stand even a tiny chance in a war against America. Even North Korea teamed with like, China and Japan would find itself hard pressed against the USA. But even then, one bomb on US soil would probably be the biggest tragedy in the entirety of US History. Trying to win a nuclear war is like trying to win an earthquake.