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Unread 07-01-2012, 10:49 PM   #11
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Originally Posted by Ryong View Post
If "heterosexual males" automatically translates to "assholes" then I don't see how it's any more oppressive of them to go "transsexuals" = "sexual predators".
1. Nobody is saying heterosexual males translates to assholes.

2. BECAUSE HETEROSEXUAL MALES AREN'T OPPRESSED.

Quote:
But I guess I'm being an asshole by pointing this out?
You're being an asshole by equating the situations of heterosexual men and trans folks, yes.

Quote:
The whole male gaze thing isn't an universal concept that is agreed as a good thing forever. I may have blown your mind.
What even the fuck is this bullshit.
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Unread 07-01-2012, 10:51 PM   #12
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The whole male gaze thing isn't an universal concept that is agreed as a good thing forever. I may have blown your mind.
Nope, just let Liz believe what she wants. Whatever, getting the point across clearly isn't as important as being technically correct and telling me my opinions.

Like, I was even clear, "I'm not claiming some reverse oppression" crap. But, Liz can read whatever she wants into my posts, and I'm not going to even bother trying to defend it.
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Unread 07-01-2012, 10:51 PM   #13
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Dreadful ITT Ryong and RPG try very hard to fail at understanding a simple concept.
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Originally Posted by Ryong View Post
The whole male gaze thing isn't an universal concept that is agreed as a good thing forever. I may have blown your mind.
It's (nearly) universally agreed to be a bad thing. That doesn't mean it's not a thing that exists, very dominantly, in the media. Nor does it mean that things like the princess's outfit are not pandering to it.

Further, adding the word 'heterosexual' to the front is just a nice way to recognize that not all men are heterosexual and it's not pandering to homosexual men.
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Unread 07-01-2012, 10:53 PM   #14
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Like, I will admit that I did not know of the term. Maybe it's the right term? But to someone who's unaware of it, it's focusing the issue on the wrong thing.
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Unread 07-01-2012, 10:54 PM   #15
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It's only been a term for about 40 years.
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Unread 07-01-2012, 10:55 PM   #16
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what about homosexual woman's gaze?

And why are bisexuals always excluded
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Unread 07-01-2012, 10:55 PM   #17
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I think you are over inflating your views with buzzwords, spin and Blind Fire Outrage.

Sorry, but i just don't see it.

Not saying you don't might have a point, just saying that it doesn't really come across to me... why single out Atlus? Have you taken in account Japanese culture? Gaming habits? Sensibilities and themes that matter for those who develop games over there?

Shouldn't you be targeting predatory marketing instead?

Why does Atlus deserves to be a special target in this particular subject matter? So much so that it deserves to be singled out into an specific campaign against the company as a WHOLE?

Are you going to Boycott Bandai for Queen's Blade? Sure, the Queen's blade games didn't leave Japan... but that surely is not a problem for you since you are targeting Atlus who is from the same country... or are you just bothered about equality on your own backyard?

Nothing to say about Rockstar? Square Enix got some flak for Nier and it's Intersex character Kainé... is this just about Badly portrail of Sexuality in games? Hyper Sexualization?

...have you seen Code Of Princess's gameplay? I did... it has Boob Jiggle physics... is that also a issue for you? Are you going to Boycott Tecmo and Team Ninja?

The artist who actually created the visual of the characters in that game that you are displeased with is Kinu Nishimura, a Woman, Artist, who works at capcom and worked on such games like Street Fighter 4, Snk vs Capcom, Marvel vs Capcom, Darkstalkers.... she is directly responsible fpr the artwork you're using as a flag for your Boycott. Do you plan to Boycott her Work as well?

I mean, you pointed at Atlus for just Publishing the game and are creating a Boycott extended to the whole company for it, should the Artist directly responsible for the art get a pass? Atlus made, makes and is still making a ton of other games that are nothing like your main issues, but your Boycott envelops them too...

Wouldn't you be supporting her paychecks by giving credit to her work in other forms? On the other company who employs her ? So, does your Boycott extends to Capcom? Morrigan, Chun Li, Cammy, Rose, Felicia, Sakura, Ibuki, Elena... all featured in length with the same Male targeted sexually charged passive-agressive marketing ploys to sell video games... and actually a few art pieces are probably made by the exact same artist that made the art for code of princess that causes you such rage that you have to Boycott the entire company... !!

Again, i'm not trying to piss on your head from the upper floor, but if you can elaborate on your thoguhts a bit further that would be best... cause right now, all i see is babble. Your problem is with marketing. Not publishing, not developing... and if you want to pick a whole company for just those 2 examples you gave as being "enough" and "justified" you're gonna come out as shallow, hypocrite and lazy at your attempt with any analyzes beyond the cracked surface of the arguments your posted here. If you gonna single out Atlus and think your reasons are enough, than i can ask you why you draw the line there? What does that company do that is so much worst than the others who done similar and the same? In the end of that spiral, you just might as well Boycott japan... and then i would have to ask if that doesn't make you a Xenophobe... because, Buzzwords and Blind Rage are just that easy to make.

This is all rage machine. And again, if you have a better point to make, if you have something more to share on your thoughts and i can see your point, i sure as hell don't mind supporting it.

As for persona, i just gonna leave this Extra Credits video, because it's about that and also the very first thing that came to mind... they make a better point than i could possibly do

http://penny-arcade.com/patv/episode/sexual-diversity
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Unread 07-01-2012, 10:57 PM   #18
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But to someone who's unaware of it, it's focusing the issue on the wrong thing.
There is literally no reason whatsoever to argue the point that you're currently arguing other than heterosexual privileged hurt.

Quote:
what about homosexual woman's gaze?

And why are bisexuals always excluded
Jesus fucking Christ, if NPF was any more full of derailing bullshit it would implode from the weight of its own privilege.
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Unread 07-01-2012, 11:00 PM   #19
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Originally Posted by Krylo View Post
Yeah, I've been reading it now. I might be in the minority here, that I don't actually know about it until now! It's interesting, but also a weird term to me still, because it encompasses both male and female objectification? But okay, it's a term that people use, and it probably might maybe be okay?

But I maintain my point that the problem isn't how they're advertising it, so much as what they're advertising. They're advertising all of these things and trying to sell you on it, but so far these posts are about how they've been advertising them, and not the fact that they shouldn't be advertising such things at all.
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I did a lot of posting on here as a teenager, and I was pretty awful. Even after I learned, grew up, and came to be on the right side of a lot of important issues, I was still angry, abrasive, and generally increased the amount of hate in the world, in pretty unacceptable ways. On the off chance that someone is taking a trip down memory lane looking through those old threads, I wanted to devote my signature to say directly to you, I'm sorry.

Thank you for letting me be better, NPF.
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Unread 07-01-2012, 11:01 PM   #20
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@Bells: Because boycotts work best when they are focused on individual companies, and because making an example of a company helps show other companies that they can't keep doing a thing for long before they're the next target.

Quote:
But I maintain my point that the problem isn't how they're advertising it, so much as what they're advertising. They're advertising all of these things and trying to sell you on it, but so far these posts are about how they've been advertising them, and not the fact that they shouldn't be advertising such things at all.
Pointing out transphobia in Persona 3? Pointing out in-game sexism in Persona 4 Golden? Pointing out the actual character art of a female protagonist in a game?

All of these are IN-GAME shit that is being called out.

Stop derailing with this nonsense.
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