Nothing is as it Seems Mafia: The Game

[P-Sleazy]

Bleach Mafia. It was hosted by SK.

[Professor Smarmiarty]

Originally Posted by Nayno

IMO, Sithdarth is too obvious a lynch and deathpigeon is too far removed from the math issue. I figure that BHS is the best possible lynch in order to maximize the information we gain as well as our chances of lynching scum.

Wait?
How does lynching me maximise information gained?
Surely if you want to do that you should lynch based upon people on the list of SithDarth.
Unvote ODWTF Vote: Deathpidgeon
I raised this a while ago, so I better actually vote.
And he under suspicion for voting after reviewing "evidence". There's none in the thread so either he's covering or he's got some kind of crazy mafia evidence.

[Fenris]

Vote Count

Barrel-Hating Sycophant (14)
Moogle0119
Ape Boy
neyo the king
Marn of Mayhem
Giever
Ole' Dude
Demonlink2
Nayno
russianreversal
Cephrir
wasoe
deathpigeon
Skyshot
Major Blood

Death By Stabbing (4)
Newb
Cephrir
Doppler
secretskull

Sithdarth (3)
Axl
Jeneralissimo
Zilla

neyo the king (2)
Tendronai
Zell

deathpigeon (2)
Masked Jedi
Barrel-Hating Sycophant

Cephrir (2)
Captain Combustible
Demetrius

Demetrius (2)
bananarama
B_real

Skyshot (1)
Michael Valentine

B_real (1)
Aerozord
Ugainius

Wasoe (1)
OctoberRaven

Lunaknight (1)
Red Fighter

Giever (1)
Inbred Chocobo

Silly Kitty (1)
Mr.Bookworm

Ecurt (1)
IHateMakingNames

Nikose (1)
Ecurt

Ole' Dude (1)
Tophat

Pointing her finger around aimlessly (1)
Silly Kitty

26 to lynch, day ends at 10:00 p.m. CST, Sunday December 16th.

If unvotes or votes didn't follow my rules, I didn't count them. I'm playing hardball, now. I'll go update the first post now that I'm thinking of them with specific voting rules for this game.

EDIT: Yes, I did mention them before making you follow them. No ex post facto here.

[Ole' Dude With the Face]

Originally Posted by BHS

Vote Logic!
Vote sense!
Don't vote random nonsense!
Vote ODWTF today!

The problem with such a vote is that it is no better than "random nonsense" with a potentially skewed list. And we've already went over how it could favor townie lynchs, so I'm not going to go back over that again.

Originally Posted by BHS

And he under suspicion for voting after reviewing "evidence". There's none in the thread so either he's covering or he's got some kind of crazy mafia evidence.

Well, there isn't any evidence, per say, but there is more backup from the thread and people's actions than against anyone else. You're just ignoring that.

I stated that you basically went from hating Sith's idea to loving it and seemed quite pleased with the notion that we should spend several days lynching according to said list. To me, advocating picking lynches off of a static list that is potentially skewed in one of the mafias favor for several days in succession is scummy. The plan seems like a great way for several days to take away the town's only real weapon, or at least for the gun barrel to be aimed at someone who isn't in your squad. It is especially scummy when you add in the fact that there are 3 mafias, so all he had to do was get lucky and hit on a member of one of the other two for his whole list to be validated as a great idea.

You haven't even mentioned this or even tried to defend yourself from it after it was mentioned and people have voted on you based upon it. That just makes me more sure of this charge since it seems you are trying to brush it off like it never happened so everyone will forget. And you're also trying to divert attention to other people. First, you tried to push it on me, now you're going after a (as best I know) new Mafia player who isn't likely as able to defend himself being unused to the game.

[russianreversal]

...BHS isn't voting for you anymore

[Ole' Dude With the Face]

Originally Posted by russianreversal

...BHS isn't voting for you anymore

That doesn't make me feel like there are any other better candidates due to what I've seen. Just because he is no longer voting for me doesn't make me think he isn't mafia anymore.

[Professor Smarmiarty]

Originally Posted by Ole' Dude With the Face

The problem with such a vote is that it is no better than "random nonsense" with a potentially skewed list. And we've already went over how it could favor townie lynchs, so I'm not going to go back over that again.



Well, there isn't any evidence, per say, but there is more backup from the thread and people's actions than against anyone else. You're just ignoring that.

I stated that you basically went from hating Sith's idea to loving it and seemed quite pleased with the notion that we should spend several days lynching according to said list. To me, advocating picking lynches off of a static list that is potentially skewed in one of the mafias favor for several days in succession is scummy. The plan seems like a great way for several days to take away the town's only real weapon, or at least for the gun barrel to be aimed at someone who isn't in your squad. It is especially scummy when you add in the fact that there are 3 mafias, so all he had to do was get lucky and hit on a member of one of the other two for his whole list to be validated as a great idea.

You haven't even mentioned this or even tried to defend yourself from it after it was mentioned and people have voted on you based upon it. That just makes me more sure of this charge since it seems you are trying to brush it off like it never happened so everyone will forget. And you're also trying to divert attention to other people. First, you tried to push it on me, now you're going after a (as best I know) new Mafia player who isn't likely as able to defend himself being unused to the game.

I have mentioned all of this.
You seem to be completely missing the point of Sith's list. The people were chosen at random but as we remove people from the list it will give information about the rest of it. This only applies if NO OTHER information comes up. It is the only lynch we are making that will provide information. If, however, we get better information then we follow that.
What we have is a case of
A) Lynch based on an information gaining strategy
or
B) Lynch randomly and gain nothing
Sure Sith may be mafia and have skewed his list. But there are two other mafia's out there and the maths still applies that we could match them. So sure he might hide one mafia but it is still a good tool for finding the other.
You claim I flopped on Sith's idea. Yes I did. Why? Because he outlined his maths. His first claim seemed murky and was unclear. Once he outlined his approach in numbers and I could follow his full chain of reasoning it made sense so I followed it. Clearly better than following a wagon lynch steadfastly to the end, based on little.
I haven't defended myself against this because no one has used it as a reason. Everyone was just like, Lynch BHS as a random Day 1 lynch. I haven't seen my name at all related to Sith. And this was my big problem. We had a method, everyone else was voting randomly.
You only have two real claims against me:
A) That I flipflopped about Sith's list which is completely untrue
and
B) That everyone else is backing you up (in reference to no evidence). This makes no sense. It's a random lynch mob. No one in the thread has made any solid accusations against me and thus this doesn't apply.

I never tried to "push" a lynch on you. I was following a clearly delineated plan, laid out in the thread. You, however, are working in secret with murky accusation.

You claim I haven't defended myself. Lay some accusations against me and I will defend them.
All I've seen so far is me swapping around on Sith's list which didn't happen as you say I did.

Edit: If I die, however, and become vindicated just listen to Sith. He makes sense.
And kill ODWTF. That dude's evil as.

[P-Sleazy]

I'm not a random lynch mob. I stated my reasons and I stand by them.

[neyo the king]

Originally Posted by Barrel-Hating Sycophant

You seem to be completely missing the point of Sith's list. The people were chosen at random but as we remove people from the list it will give information about the rest of it. This only applies if NO OTHER information comes up. It is the only lynch we are making that will provide information.

Now, I might be wrong, but I'm pretty sure that any lynch we have will provide information in some form. Have you forgotten that death post's are more likely filled with clues then not?

A) Lynch based on an information gaining strategy
or
B) Lynch randomly and gain nothing

Ok, but, you see, we don't have any information today, so we have little choice but to go by option B, at least until we get some info. And the best way to get info is, as you keep reminding us, to lynch someone. But that someone doesn't have to be on some list in order for us to get helpful information.

Sure Sith may be mafia and have skewed his list. But there are two other mafia's out there and the maths still applies that we could match them. So sure he might hide one mafia but it is still a good tool for finding the other.

The only problem I see with this is that we will be helping a mafia in order to get the others. Last I checked, helping mafia was bad news. And besides, what would happen when all other mafia were gone? The magical list might become more sinister then we remember.

You claim I flopped on Sith's idea. Yes I did. Why? Because he outlined his maths. His first claim seemed murky and was unclear. Once he outlined his approach in numbers and I could follow his full chain of reasoning it made sense so I followed it. Clearly better than following a wagon lynch steadfastly to the end, based on little.

Maybe so, but you forget that he chose those three people at random. All the list is is a glorified random vote that seems all fancy to get you to say that it isn't. Therefore, at least at the current moment, Day 1, where we have no information, the list is useless.

I haven't defended myself against this because no one has used it as a reason. Everyone was just like, Lynch BHS as a random Day 1 lynch. I haven't seen my name at all related to Sith. And this was my big problem. We had a method, everyone else was voting randomly.

Wait, first, flop on Sith's math, and now you are refering to Sith and you as a team? Just how are you two related, I wonder...

You only have two real claims against me:
A) That I flipflopped about Sith's list which is completely untrue
and
B) That everyone else is backing you up (in reference to no evidence). This makes no sense. It's a random lynch mob. No one in the thread has made any solid accusations against me and thus this doesn't apply.

That's day 1 for you. I'd bet money that you wouldn't be half as upset about lynch-mobbing and random votes if you weren't the target. Hell, for all I know, you might have been a member of said mob.

I never tried to "push" a lynch on you. I was following a clearly delineated plan, laid out in the thread. You, however, are working in secret with murky accusation.

Again, less a clearly delineated plan, more a random vote.

You claim I haven't defended myself. Lay some accusations against me and I will defend them.
All I've seen so far is me swapping around on Sith's list which didn't happen as you say I did.

Wait, didn't you just get through saying that you did change you opinion on the list?

[Professor Smarmiarty]

Originally Posted by neyo the king

Now, I might be wrong, but I'm pretty sure that any lynch we have will provide information in some form. Have you forgotten that death post's are more likely filled with clues then not?

Ok, but, you see, we don't have any information today, so we have little choice but to go by option B, at least until we get some info. And the best way to get info is, as you keep reminding us, to lynch someone. But that someone doesn't have to be on some list in order for us to get helpful information.

But there is a way to get MORE information. This way you gain none and are relying on what happens at night.
The other way you can STILL use the night if its BETTER but you can use what is gained from the outcome of the lynch today and its relations to the rest of the group, tommorow if nothing comes out of night, something that can't be done with a me lynch

The only problem I see with this is that we will be helping a mafia in order to get the others. Last I checked, helping mafia was bad news. And besides, what would happen when all other mafia were gone? The magical list might become more sinister then we remember.

Helping mafia kill other mafia= all good.
When those other mafia are gone then we could turn on Sith assuming he was in the mafia.
We can only lynch one person at once and thus it doesn't matter which mafia we lynch as long as we are lynching mafia.

Maybe so, but you forget that he chose those three people at random. All the list is is a glorified random vote that seems all fancy to get you to say that it isn't. Therefore, at least at the current moment, Day 1, where we have no information, the list is useless.

Sigh, haven't we gone over this.
Yeah voting based ont he list will be random at the moment. But the outcome of the votes will give us information about future votes which we can use if we have no other information.
Voting for me is just as random but provides NO future information.

Wait, first, flop on Sith's math, and now you are refering to Sith and you as a team? Just how are you two related, I wonder...


That's day 1 for you. I'd bet money that you wouldn't be half as upset about lynch-mobbing and random votes if you weren't the target. Hell, for all I know, you might have been a member of said mob.



Again, less a clearly delineated plan, more a random vote.

I'm annoyed because you guys are all making a random vote when there are alternatives.
Sith has a mathematical plan.
There are plenty of people voting for me who are pushing for a quicklynch which is a known strategy that hugely favours the mafia (which is behind my current vote as no one wants to join me on maths plan). If you refuse to look at other plans and jsut vote for quicklynchs and random mafia will win.
Saying "It's Day 1!" is no defence. What if we could conclusively prove the existence of a mafia man on Day 1. Would you just say "It's Day 1!" and vote randomly?

Wait, didn't you just get through saying that you did change you opinion on the list?

Yes because he justified himself and detailed his reasoning which wasn't clear from his first post.
It's call reviewing other peoples opinions rather than voting on blind instinct. I suggest looking into it.