Boycott Atlus

[rpgdemon]

Originally Posted by Liz

There is literally no reason whatsoever to argue the point that you're currently arguing other than heterosexual privileged hurt.

I don't care about that! At all! I legitimately care about the issue at hand, and how your approach is not conducive to spreading awareness of it.

It's really easy to dismiss all criticisms as privileged butthurt, but when they're not derived from that, you're just plain wrong.

[Loyal]

Welcome back, Liz. I won't comment on your request since I can't think of a single Atlus game I have any intention of buying, but I do have to raise a concern. Namely, with your reddit thread. I would question the wisdom of using reddit for this sort of thing at all due to how its voting algorithms sort content (Explanation) (TL;DR: Upvote value scales logarithmically, and degrades rapidly over time, making images more popular, and long, drawn-out posts more likely to be buried, because of how much quicker one can respond to the former).

But seriously, you have entirely the wrong audience. Don't submit a serious call for a boycott to /r/gaming, that's the subreddit for game-related jokes and images and things like that. Try resubmitting it to /r/games or /r/truegaming, they're more geared (and receptive!) toward actual discussion.

If I were making the post I might also try to reword it to sound less accusatory and demanding. Even intelligent people are unlikely to respond well to things like "If you buy [X] you are supporting oppression," factually correct or no. Also, Reddit's a sucker for a good witch-hunt, but I've never seen one go off with the post opening with "This guy's an asshole, get him!" or "This company sucks, don't buy their products!" Maybe retitle it something like "Transphobia in Atlus games" and let the boycott call develop naturally.

Best of luck in your endeavor, whatever route you take.

[Krylo]

Originally Posted by Liz

@Bells: Because boycotts work best when they are focused on individual companies, and because making an example of a company helps show other companies that they can't keep doing a thing for long before they're the next target.

Also, I'd assume, because, to the best of my knowledge, Capcom/Squeenix/Other Examples have never claimed to be tackling matters of sexuality and whatnot maturely while Atlus has. Which makes them a good example.

[Kim]

Yeah. Atlus also gets a lot of cred from allies for being progressive, but it fucks up a LOT.

[Aerozord]

Originally Posted by Krylo

Also, I'd assume, because, to the best of my knowledge, Capcom/Squeenix/Other Examples have never claimed to be tackling matters of sexuality and whatnot maturely while Atlus has. Which makes them a good example.

I can understand that but I'd think targeting a group thats clearly making sexist games like Team Ninja is better.

One can argue Atlus is trying and just not doing a good job at it, and them suffering financially doesn't send the message "don't be sexist" but "don't try to handle sex issues maturely" because no one rallied against the blatantly sexist developers.

[Kim]

Originally Posted by rpgdemon

I don't care about that! At all! I legitimately care about the issue at hand, and how your approach is not conducive to spreading awareness of it.

It's really easy to dismiss all criticisms as privileged butthurt, but when they're not derived from that, you're just plain wrong.

Your criticisms have been just plain wrong and deflective bullshit. It's literally been incorrect statements about "what I'm focusing on" and nitpicking a single term that is an actual legit term with history behind it that I'm using both because of that history and to raise awareness of it actually being a thing.

@Aero: Blatantly sexist developers are already being called out by other people with more effective tools of doing so.

[POS Industries]

Originally Posted by Liz

Yeah. Atlus also gets a lot of cred from allies for being progressive, but it fucks up a LOT.

In fact, for a company that claims to be tackling these issues, they seem to be fucking up with them a lot more than the other companies as a result of their efforts.

[rpgdemon]

Like, I'll be honest, I also do not have much interest in Atlus products. I think I bought some RTS on the DS from them at one point years back?

I do care about the issue at hand though, especially considering that I've heard people say that once gay marriage is allowed everywhere, the US is going to be almost perfectly equal and then fat people rights need to come next, because of how oppressed they are. I am not even kidding. I verbally slapped them down, but it's something that people need to be made aware of.

The other thing is, there are legitimately people who believe in "Reverse Oppression". Like, I've had people complain to me because group X is being given some government protection and it's totally oppressing them and they're going to sue for hate crimes. And while they're wrong, rhetoric ought to try to avoid fanning those flames, because these people legitimately believe that they are being oppressed by gays, and are legitimately afraid of gay marriage because of that. They are wrong! But they're still an alarmingly growing opinion, and just saying "Fuck Y'ALL!" to them isn't going to help anything.

[POS Industries]

Originally Posted by rpgdemon

The other thing is, there are legitimately people who believe in "Reverse Oppression". Like, I've had people complain to me because group X is being given some government protection and it's totally oppressing them and they're going to sue for hate crimes. And while they're wrong, rhetoric ought to try to avoid fanning those flames, because these people legitimately believe that they are being oppressed by gays, and are legitimately afraid of gay marriage because of that. They are wrong! But they're still an alarmingly growing opinion, and just saying "Fuck Y'ALL!" to them isn't going to help anything.

No, I think that's the perfect way to treat them.

Going out of one's way to be sensitive towards a bunch of loudmouths' willful, hateful idiocy is the exact opposite of anything that could be productive.

[Kim]

just saying "Fuck Y'ALL!" to them isn't going to help anything.

Yes it is.

Because those fuckers are fuckers no matter what you say to them and they're minds aren't going to change no matter how much you cater to them. Best get everyone telling them to fuck off so much they just shut their fucking mouths rather than try and please ignorant, privileged assholes.

In fact, for a company that claims to be tackling these issues, they seem to be fucking up with them a lot more than the other companies as a result of their efforts.

Yeah, nobody's going to praise Capcom's handling of Poison but Capcom also isn't calling Poison "Eric" in a manual, saying sex with trans women is weird, and using a game's underlying themes to argue that trans women are still really men.

Capcom also doesn't have a game that says a trans man is just a woman trying to avoid sexism and then dress that trans man in female, objectifying clothing.