Don't Ask; Don't Tell Repeal Blocked

Kim · 09-21-2010, 02:37 PM

GODDAMMIT

Quote:

Lady Gaga was unable to convince the Maine senators: a Republican filibuster means the Senate will not vote on the defense authorization bill that repeals Don't Ask, Don't Tell. Democrats got 56 votes, four short of the needed 60.

Needless to say, I'm pretty pissed off. DADT is complete bullshit that needs to be gotten rid of, but fucking hell I guess our government still has its head up its ass. Fuck the Republicans. Fuck the Democrats who sided with the Republicans. Fuck everyone who tries to defend DADT.

I will be finding out the names of every single Dem who sided with the Repubs, and pretty much make a big old list of "Democrats who you should never fucking vote for ever again."

And you fucking know some of the people who voted to support this did it solely because elections are coming up.

Donomni · 09-21-2010, 03:06 PM

This is why I hate politics. We need more people who actually give a shit get elected, not fucking PR-maniac politicians.

Or, obviously, racist homophobic bigots(Not any specific party, just no more bullshit), but that should be a given at this point.

Amake · 09-21-2010, 03:30 PM

Obvious comments re. homophobia, growing up, learning respect, etc.

Now, a hypothetical question: Would you rather get rid of DADT or the armed forces? I think we're ready to trust each other, as countries, enough to get along without the threat of making war on each other.

krogothwolf · 09-21-2010, 03:40 PM

43 people voted to not repel it? Seriously...43 people didn't think this was a good idea? Not only that, with 59 senators as democrats that means at least 3 of the didn't think it was a good idea.

Wow.

Edit: But IQ, if we got rid of our armed forces, what would the government do with the billions of billions of dollars they spend on weapon development!

bluestarultor · 09-21-2010, 03:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Invisible Queen

Obvious comments re. homophobia, growing up, learning respect, etc.

Now, a hypothetical question: Would you rather get rid of DADT or the armed forces? I think we're ready to trust each other, as countries, enough to get along without the threat of making war on each other.

IQ, that's a terrible argument even though it IS a joke.

DADT is a terrible, backwards system that only reinforces hatred within what's supposed to be a cohesive unit. You do not gain anything by dividing your forces that way.

The whole thing is derived from a fear of boys kissing boys. All the arguments center around that. "What if a commanding officer forces my son into a sinful relationship!?" The military already reeks of enough corruption that DADT probably wouldn't do shit in that situation anyway. "I don't want my son having to bunk up with one of those devil's children!" He'll be doing it anyway; he just won't know who right away. "ZOMG GAY GERMS!" Seriously.

There's no reason it should still be in place. Everyone is there for the same reason, which isn't because they have a thing for men in uniform. Taking out DADT allows for pathways of communication to be formed and maybe for some of the homophobia to die down.

Professor Smarmiarty · 09-21-2010, 03:44 PM

That's why I don'thave that much of a problem with DADT. While its a terrible law it prevents people from doing an awful thing.
Like I could make a law saying "Homosexuals can't choose to get punched in the face by me" and it would be discriminatory, sure,but there are more important things to get worked up about.

Kim · 09-21-2010, 03:50 PM

It's not just about gays serving in the military, and it doesn't prevent them from serving in the military. It just keeps says they have to be in the closet to do so. All it does is make the gays who chose to be in the military miserable. Plus, it's not just about the army, it's about dismantling a system that oppresses people based on their sexuality, and DADT is just one aspect of that.

Ryanderman · 09-21-2010, 03:57 PM

Is there a reason Obama can't just executive order this away?

POS Industries · 09-21-2010, 04:17 PM

DADT is already working its way through the federal court system, and has so far already been ruled unconstitutional. The ruling may very well flipflop several times as it makes its way upward, but the law's days appear to be numbered regardless of what congress does.

Secondly, I want democrats to quit being weenies about this filibuster bullshit and let the republicans actually try it. I really don't think those old farts have the stamina to stand up there and yammer long enough to keep the vote from happening, and even if they do they're just going to end up saying enough retarded shit to make themselves look bad anyway.

Let them filibuster and let them fail, I say.

Funka Genocide · 09-21-2010, 04:18 PM

As far as I know, DADT is a policy not an actual law. Everyone is making a big fuss about it but I wonder if they actually understand the implications of such a repeal.

The point of DADT is to prevent the military from harassing you about your sexuality. They still "ask" when you enlist. I kind of found that strange when I signed my life away, there is literally a question on one of the forms asking if you've ever engaged in homosexual activity.

The point is that homosexual activity is illegal according to the Uniform Code of Military Justice. Meaning that if someone presents evidence that you are in a homosexual relationship to the chain of command, you will face disciplinary actions up to and including Court Martial.

DADT doesn't protect people from anything except being explicitly asked what their sexual orientation is. It doesn't allow military members to actually engage in the relationships of their choosing, it doesn't allow them to openly be who they are. It basically tells them to keep their mouths shut or else.

I might be totally off the mark here, but repealing DADT without changing the UCMJ would be like sending someone out in the rain with a tattered old umbrella, then subsequently taking the umbrella away. Sure it might not have offered much protection in the first place, but it was all they had.

What it really amounts to is a proposed solution that isn't really a solution. Shit like this takes up too much media attention and gets young people to vote according to their passions, even though they're not completely aware of what they're voting for or against. If you really care about gay rights then this is a battle not worth fighting, one stupid policy change isn't going to rectify centuries of systemic hate. You have to focus on changing the underlying laws, you have to research what those laws are. DADT is the horse in the room that's distracting you from the elephant.

Its all just a pointless song and dance routine and pretty much everyone is going along with it.

09-21-2010, 03:06 PM	#2
Donomni Would you deign to supply me food? Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Tampa Bay Area, Florida Posts: 2,004	This is why I hate politics. We need more people who actually give a shit get elected, not fucking PR-maniac politicians. Or, obviously, racist homophobic bigots(Not any specific party, just no more bullshit), but that should be a given at this point. __________________ Dance your cares away! Chirrrrrrp. Also, dead blog.

09-21-2010, 03:30 PM	#3
Amake Keeper of the new Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: A place without judgment Posts: 4,506	Obvious comments re. homophobia, growing up, learning respect, etc. Now, a hypothetical question: Would you rather get rid of DADT or the armed forces? I think we're ready to trust each other, as countries, enough to get along without the threat of making war on each other. __________________ Hope insistent, trust implicit, love inherent, life immersed

09-21-2010, 03:40 PM	#4
krogothwolf Fetched the Candy Cane! Join Date: May 2009 Location: Calgary Posts: 4,278	43 people voted to not repel it? Seriously...43 people didn't think this was a good idea? Not only that, with 59 senators as democrats that means at least 3 of the didn't think it was a good idea. Wow. Edit: But IQ, if we got rid of our armed forces, what would the government do with the billions of billions of dollars they spend on weapon development! __________________ Knowledge is Power, Power is Knowledge ╔╦╦══╦══╦═╦══╦══╦╗╔╦╦╦╦══╦╗╔═╗ ║═╣╠═║╔╗║╔╣╔╗╠╗╔╣╚╝║║║║╔╗║║║═╣ ║║║╔╗╣╚╝║║║╚╝║║║║╔╗║║║║╚╝║╚╣╔╝ ╚╩╩╝╚╩══╩═╩══╝╚╝╚╝╚╩══╩══╩═╩╝

09-21-2010, 03:50 PM	#7
Kim adorable Join Date: Sep 2007 Posts: 12,950	It's not just about gays serving in the military, and it doesn't prevent them from serving in the military. It just keeps says they have to be in the closet to do so. All it does is make the gays who chose to be in the military miserable. Plus, it's not just about the army, it's about dismantling a system that oppresses people based on their sexuality, and DADT is just one aspect of that. __________________ this post is about how to successfully H the Kimmy

09-21-2010, 03:57 PM	#8
Ryanderman Beard of Leadership Join Date: Apr 2006 Posts: 827	Is there a reason Obama can't just executive order this away? __________________ ~Your robot reminds me of you. You tell it to stop, it turns. You tell it to turn, it stops. You tell it to take out the trash, it watches reruns of Firefly.~

09-21-2010, 03:44 PM	#6
Professor Smarmiarty Sent to the cornfield Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: K-space Posts: 9,758	That's why I don'thave that much of a problem with DADT. While its a terrible law it prevents people from doing an awful thing. Like I could make a law saying "Homosexuals can't choose to get punched in the face by me" and it would be discriminatory, sure,but there are more important things to get worked up about.

09-21-2010, 04:17 PM	#9
POS Industries Argus Agony Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: Gotta go fishing! Posts: 10,483	DADT is already working its way through the federal court system, and has so far already been ruled unconstitutional. The ruling may very well flipflop several times as it makes its way upward, but the law's days appear to be numbered regardless of what congress does. Secondly, I want democrats to quit being weenies about this filibuster bullshit and let the republicans actually try it. I really don't think those old farts have the stamina to stand up there and yammer long enough to keep the vote from happening, and even if they do they're just going to end up saying enough retarded shit to make themselves look bad anyway. Let them filibuster and let them fail, I say. __________________ Either you're dead or my watch has stopped.

09-21-2010, 04:18 PM	#10
Funka Genocide Sent to the cornfield Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Las Vegas Posts: 4,566	As far as I know, DADT is a policy not an actual law. Everyone is making a big fuss about it but I wonder if they actually understand the implications of such a repeal. The point of DADT is to prevent the military from harassing you about your sexuality. They still "ask" when you enlist. I kind of found that strange when I signed my life away, there is literally a question on one of the forms asking if you've ever engaged in homosexual activity. The point is that homosexual activity is illegal according to the Uniform Code of Military Justice. Meaning that if someone presents evidence that you are in a homosexual relationship to the chain of command, you will face disciplinary actions up to and including Court Martial. DADT doesn't protect people from anything except being explicitly asked what their sexual orientation is. It doesn't allow military members to actually engage in the relationships of their choosing, it doesn't allow them to openly be who they are. It basically tells them to keep their mouths shut or else. I might be totally off the mark here, but repealing DADT without changing the UCMJ would be like sending someone out in the rain with a tattered old umbrella, then subsequently taking the umbrella away. Sure it might not have offered much protection in the first place, but it was all they had. What it really amounts to is a proposed solution that isn't really a solution. Shit like this takes up too much media attention and gets young people to vote according to their passions, even though they're not completely aware of what they're voting for or against. If you really care about gay rights then this is a battle not worth fighting, one stupid policy change isn't going to rectify centuries of systemic hate. You have to focus on changing the underlying laws, you have to research what those laws are. DADT is the horse in the room that's distracting you from the elephant. Its all just a pointless song and dance routine and pretty much everyone is going along with it.