Pokemon Umbral Discussion 31: Zero Mode and Asuras

[Dracorion]

That's retarded.

And unjustifiable, anyway. What, Enmakki doesn't want to use Dark Abyss until Pierce gets enough levels? Bullshit.

Also, I'd prefer to use the term "signature move" to refer to my moves for Enmakki and Dialga, and "custom moves" for the ones you get through getting levels in Trainer and shit.

[Menarker]

*Shrug* I'm just giving examples of how it could/might be "regulated", so not everyone pokemon and their mom has 3-4 signature moves. As far as we know, AB might not actually grant custom moves, or he'll say that custom moves gained through Pokemon Breeders will have a power level that easily trumps those who request it at the goodness of his heart. That and with Pokemon Breeder, you will be obligated to have those moves if AB states that is what the levels of Pokemon Breeder should grant you, while moves requested through unofficial ways can be vetoed at AB's slightest whim... because you know... he doesn't have to give it to you.

Besides, how would Pierce know about what custom moves a pokemon has? Is Enmakki so eager to brag "I can do this and this and this!" to the person who captures him? At least with my example, it's plausible because it's a work of development between pokemon and trainer. Custom moves that always existed however doesn't have that plausiblity because no one knows of their existance (since they are homebrew and presumably has never been recorded by anyone else) and thus Pierce shouldn't know of their existance unless he sees the move firsthand or the pokemon chooses to inform him of it.

Or maybe I should say "Screw that!" and request that I get the custom moves that I might dream up right now, since my pokemons doesn't have any custom moves and you're saying you should get them the moment you get your custom pokemon when you don't have the Pokemon Breeder levels or never plan to get them (or only get them at a super late stage). At least Mollesk was built using moves and abilities that actually existed. Yours is completely homebrewed! I'm trying to stay within the tracks to a certain degree. AB has no real obligation to allow you to have those moves after all. Just out of the kindness of his heart.

[Dracorion]

If that's your argument, how does anyone know what Legendaries' movesets are like? I mean, the fuckers are rare enough. People are lucky to see just one of the minor ones in their entire lifetime. How do we know Lugia has Aeroblast, Ho-Oh has Sacred Fire? Or, to get onto the rarest rares, Jirachi has Doom Desire, Dialga has Roar of Time, Palkia gets Spacial Rend, Arceus gets Judgment?

Clearly, the answer is to make it so that every Legendary's moves become available only through getting levels in Breeder! "But wait, I wanted more than six moves!" "HAHA, TOUGH LUCK".

Seriously, though? Pokemon inexplicably become pretty loyal once captured, so there's no reason they wouldn't show off all their moves upon request. You explain to me why pokeballs magically make pokemon love their new trainer.

Yes, of course AB can say no! It's not like I'm demanding these things. And hell, I encourage you to make up your own signature moves for Mollesk. Go nuts! That said, don't start complaining when we argue your proposals because Mollesk is already min-maxed to all hell.

Anyway, I'm dropping Deathclaw (the 40% chance of insta-kill on a sleeping target) as one of Enmakki's custom moves. It sucks.

[Menarker]

Everything you have been saying in the past about how Enmakki would be barely under Pierce's control in character made me think otherwise in his case.

Otherwise, I got no problem with that particular argument. (Shaymin has the Signature Move "Seed Flare" and Renny uses that frequently.)

The thing I was trying to bring to point is... Why should AB grant you those moves? Or better yet... why shouldn't everyone else who is a trainer not request their own moves in the process (and the same number of them too)? All for the sake of fairness! I know that AB said he got no problems with the moves themselves... But why shouldn't Bard or I be unable to request them as well? (Aside from having a sense of fairness or shame or whatever restraining trait you don't have.) Or what's stopping AB from just changing his mind and saying no or "I decided that you can't have it for free. You need to invest in Breeder so not everyone will request them without making the same effort"?

Pierce, Charlotte and Renny are all the same level of pokemon trainer, so I got no objection to Pierce having custom moves... so long as the other two also have access to custom moves of their own, and that when people level up, those who choose to stay with trainer will have better progression with custom moves than those who branch out to other fields. If AB was to allow you to have 3 custom moves for Enmakki and then when I come to ask AB for a custom move for Mollesk and for Umbreon and for Magnezone (or whomever I please), and he says no, I feel I would be validated to protest over inequality. Or if I got the 7 levels of Pokemon Breeder, and was allowed to have 6 moves, I would expect that Pierce should not be allowed to suddenly request more moves to match my own until he reaches the same level of Pokemon Breeder.

EDIT:
Lastly, should Geminex or Matthias request something special for their character as well since they don't wield pokemons? I'd imagine they'd feel indignant if we trainers had this special custom move thing and they couldn't request something.

Ah, I see you made some edits in your post that wasn't there when I was making this post.

Anyhow, I got no objection to you having custom moves (and no objection to the ones you chosen), just discussing as you said you were "nervous" and "awkward" and all that. But I'm bringing up certain viewpoints that I and a few others might have thought, so we could see what your response would be.

[Dracorion]

Originally Posted by Menarker

Everything you have been saying in the past about how Enmakki would be barely under Pierce's control in character made me think otherwise in his case.

Not quite. Enmakki's going to try to push Pierce toward world domination, yes. It'll lie about some stuff, sure. Other than that? Enmakki has to be obedient in order to get Pierce to trust it somewhat, see?

Originally Posted by Menarker

The thing I was trying to bring to point is... Why should AB grant you those moves? Or better yet... why shouldn't everyone else who is a trainer not request their own moves in the process (and the same number of them too)? All for the sake of fairness! I know that AB said he got no problems with the moves themselves... But why shouldn't Bard or I be unable to request them as well? (Aside from having a sense of fairness or shame or whatever restraining trait you don't have.) Or what's stopping AB from just changing his mind and saying no or "I decided that you can't have it for free. You need to invest in Breeder so not everyone will request them without making the same effort"?

I'm not saying you shouldn't get to request your own moves! Bard's already requested Spectral Reaver for Revenard. I would accept it if AB changes his mind about it. I'd try to argue, of course, but who wouldn't?

Also, shame. The restraining trait I'm missing is shame.

Originally Posted by Menarker

Pierce, Charlotte and Renny are all the same level of pokemon trainer, so I got no objection to Pierce having custom moves... so long as the other two also have access to custom moves of their own, and that when people level up, those who choose to stay with trainer will have better progression with custom moves than those who branch out to other fields. If AB was to allow you to have 3 custom moves for Enmakki and then when I come to ask AB for a custom move for Mollesk and for Umbreon and for Magnezone (or whomever I please), and he says no, I feel I would be validated to protest over inequality. Or if I got the 7 levels of Pokemon Breeder, and was allowed to have 6 moves, I would expect that Pierce should not be allowed to suddenly request more moves to match my own until he reaches the same level of Pokemon Breeder.

He probably wouldn't say no to you having custom moves. If he did, it'd be because of a problem with the specific move you proposed.

Perhaps... we could change the Breeder class a bit to differentiate. What if instead of custom moves, they get to power up an existing move, for example? I can imagine you orgasming over Mollesk having a 2x effective Cosmic Power, for example.

I'm just proposing an alternative here.

Originally Posted by Menarker

Lastly, should Geminex or Matthias request something special for their character as well since they don't wield pokemons? I'd imagine they'd feel indignant if we trainers had this special custom move thing and they couldn't request something.

They already get Synchronization Techniques and Signature Techniques sooner than the rest of us. Also, Matt could come up with his own signature moves, I guess? And Geminex gets his own power armor and Full Demon upgrade.

Originally Posted by Menarker

Anyhow, I got no objection to you having custom moves (and no objection to the ones you chosen), just discussing as you said you were "nervous" and "awkward" and all that. But I'm bringing up certain viewpoints that I and a few others might have thought, so we could see what your response would be.

Well, let's see. So far I've requested four signature moves. There's three for Enmakki, and one for Dialga. I dropped one, but that still leaves three powerful moves, two of them going to one pokemon. And they're all awesome and I love them and I really really want to have them. So I didn't want you guys to argue against my getting 'em. That's why I mentioned "nervous" and "awkward".

[Geminex]

I'm not even going to read the rest of this discussion (though I agree quite strongly with Menarker, those moves shouldn't be free, there should be some sort of limit, and that limit should be very low, since enemy trainers might be fielding signature moves as well, otherwise), but one thing caught my eye:

Enmakki's going to try to push Pierce toward world domination, yes.

Dude. My territory. Get your own evil plan.

[Dracorion]

Oh relax, you big girl.

I know that's your territory. I was there when you were pissing all over it to mark it as your own. You know, figuratively. Though I don't doubt you would've done it literally too if you could.

Pierce wouldn't touch your territory with a ten-foot pole.

[Menarker]

Well, we're just about ready for AB. Gem hasn't edited his post to make it better and Dante is presumably still busy with life. But at least AB has enough to work on the next RP post.

EDIT:

Originally Posted by Dracorion

Perhaps... we could change the Breeder class a bit to differentiate. What if instead of custom moves, they get to power up an existing move, for example? I can imagine you orgasming over Mollesk having a 2x effective Cosmic Power, for example.

Also, I wouldn't be orgasming over that at all. By the time Renny gets a few more levels, Mollesk's Defense will be high enough that it'll hit the standard max of 999 with one use of the normal Cosmic Power after taking Simple in account.

Mind you, the idea of boosting a move wouldn't be shunned by me. Togekiss's Air Slash, Shaymin's Seed Flare, among a few other choices. ^^

[Astral Harmony]

Your ideas are good, and I'll consider them as part of the Pokemon Breeder upgrades.

I'd need a lot of time, maybe this and Pierce's sidequest, to come up with a full-on upgrade directory. But I think it's a good idea to go ahead and do that so I won't have to worry about it everytime a mission concludes. Here's a general rundown, though:

- Slayers upgrade to Overblades. I like that title better than Ragnarok. As a Slayer puts upgrades into Overblade, they'll gain access to multiple SignTechs, two attacks per turn, better Rage generation, lower Rage costs, Slayer abilities, and new weapons, armor, and accessories. More is expected, but I need time to consider balance and whatnot.

- Trainers upgrade to Breeders. Custom moves will be allowed at the 1st, 3rd, and 5th levels. Custom evolutions (excluding Mollesk) become possible. The ability to teach "pool moves" to any Pokemon become available. There'll be more Co-Ops, and it's also possible a weakness could be erased and an Ability switch. I just need to crank my brain about it for good week or something.

- Pokebrids upgrade to Devas. Custom moves, more Pokeshifts, double attack, longer Paradigm Shifts, Ruin Pokeshifts, Ability switches, Legendary Pokeshifts, a weakness erasure. It's all very likely to become available, but gimme time to run it around the ol' noggin for a while.

- Snaggers upgrade to Tuners. Custom moves, Ruin Pokemon captures, custom evolutions, "pool move" availability, eight Pokemon arsenals, Instant Death Pokeballs, probably more.

This list is subject to change as I get your ideas on them. Demon Half and Demon aren't available for debate yet but I'll provide thoughts on them soon.

When I speak of "pool moves", I'm talking about a much greater pool than the TMs that pretty much any Pokemon can learn.

As for Dracorian and Menarker fighting about Enmekki, here's what I going to do. Drac, pick one move for Enmekki to have as his own personal move. Just like most Legendaries have one move that no other Pokemon has, Enmekki is sure to have one as well. If you want a second move for him, all you'll need to do is invest one level in Breeder.

And if it's any consolation, you're getting Dialga at the end of this mission. That's two Legendaries almost kinda back to back.

[Menarker]

Wait, hold on. How many levels are there of each ascended class? You make it sound like there are 5 levels of the base levels and 5 levels of the ascended classes. (It doesn't help that we don't know what the immediate next levels of upgrades are like.)

And I'm still wondering if we'll all be getting more relationship techniques like the Renny/Lola or the Impact/Rayleen or the Pierce/Chizuru one.

Does Mollesk get a custom move too? Since he's Legendary class as well with no custom move of his own?

>_> Those Tuner's Instant Death pokeballs kinda defeat the purpose of catching pokemons, since they can't be allowed to faint to be captured. >_<