I Can't Believe it's Not Murder!

[Amake]

Being a terrible person is a crime that warrants being shot down on the streets, I guess. But being a terrible person and shooting down people in the street means you haven't done anything wrong.

See that's what bothers me. I admit we don't know exactly what happened or why. That may be largely because the police has been incredibly racist and basically refused to investigate the killing but fine, we don't know for a fact that Zimmerman is a murderer and we don't want to put people in jail if their guilt is in question. But how can anyone in the entire world say Zimmerman has done nothing wrong and keep a straight face?

Look at the pictures of that racist asshole: He's not the least bit ashamed. He doesn't think he did anything wrong. He doesn't wish that anything could have been different. He doesn't have any idea why people hate him so much he's forced to move out of the country. I'm sure he could defuse a whole lot of that hate if he turned to a camera and said something along the lines of "I'm sorry that I killed this person over nothing, I shouldn't have done that", but is that going to happen? Would the idea even occur to him?

[Bum Bill Bee]

Sigh, I am just all out tired of how much time and attention this one case has taken. And what's worse is it feels like all the hype and attention by the mass media is only empowering racist dicks who would otherwise be impotent pissants. Remember Koran Burning Day? Which was invented by some dumbass preacher who had a congregation of ONLY TWENTY PEOPLE, and then the liberal mass media decides to put this previously unknown man unto our televisions and inadvertantly inspire more dumbasses to be racist dicks.....

Look, I am quite pissed at how Zimmerman just got off the hook like that, but all the same....I wish this kind of shit would be put on trial and get done with quicker, I wish it didn't feel like mass media was inadvertantly glorifiying miserable wastes of skin who didn't deserve the time of day....

Plus, I have a black Wiccan Anarchist friend who says this is all just being hyped up so they can take attention away from more important matters like Snowden and the NSA. (He's the only individual opinion on political stuff that I listen to outside of this place).

[Red Mage Black]

Originally Posted by Mr.Bookworm

Jesus fucking Christ.

It is in every single goddamn way Zimmerman's fault. Do not play the victim blaming game.

You haven't read both my posts, have you? I said two things, which I believe I do not need to quote. Read them.

Don't you fucking dare start on that shit.

More proof you haven't read my second post.

You have this completely fucking backwards. Every death should be cause for grief. Every miscarriage of justice should be cause for outrage. We should never, ever allow ourselves to stop giving a shit about things like this.

Now you're acting as if looking at this from another viewpoint is a bad thing. There is nothing wrong with the law, it's the people who misinterpret it and use to it to their own ends which are to blame.

On another note: Threatening to riot over a verdict is not a valid form of grieving or getting back at an unjust law system.

Originally Posted by Amake

Being a terrible person is a crime that warrants being shot down on the streets, I guess. But being a terrible person and shooting down people in the street means you haven't done anything wrong.

See that's what bothers me. I admit we don't know exactly what happened or why. That may be largely because the police has been incredibly racist and basically refused to investigate the killing but fine, we don't know for a fact that Zimmerman is a murderer and we don't want to put people in jail if their guilt is in question. But how can anyone in the entire world say Zimmerman has done nothing wrong and keep a straight face?

Here's the rub: I never did say he did nothing wrong. Nowhere in posts did I explicitly state or even IMPLY it. If you guys found such an implication, that wasn't my intention. The fact everyone here who has responded to my posts so far has misinterpreted them is probably my fault.

The fact is, that it's hard to remain nonpartisan on an issue without one side thinking you're defending the other. Since you have to think on both sides of the issue to even try to understand it.

Look at the pictures of that racist asshole: He's not the least bit ashamed. He doesn't think he did anything wrong. He doesn't wish that anything could have been different. He doesn't have any idea why people hate him so much he's forced to move out of the country. I'm sure he could defuse a whole lot of that hate if he turned to a camera and said something along the lines of "I'm sorry that I killed this person over nothing, I shouldn't have done that", but is that going to happen? Would the idea even occur to him?

There's a lot of hate going around, both on the internet and real life. Fearing for your life and the life of your own family when such hatred arises probably makes him not want to even appear in public anymore. So the answer to your question? I can say with utmost certainty that he will not.


I think 3B's post below sums this tangent up pretty well, but swapped anyway.On a completely different tangent, I just thought I'd say this. Every time the news comes on, I have to shake my head. The media has everyone, whether you like to admit it or not. Those emotions you feel when a report comes up about an incident like this? That's how they get you. When did people stop thinking for themselves and let the media tell them how to feel?

What's particularly hilarious(in a very macabre sort of way), that I found, is that any white on black crime was immediately a racial thing, but not black on white? Yet two people of the same race fight and that's all she wrote? The media plays it up to be bigger than it should be and it tends to stir up more and more conflict. Then militant organizations like the KKK or Black Panthers show up and nothing is ever the same.

It is in my opinion, that racism will never go away. As long as there are people who are different, it will always exist. So, what solution exists? Do we curb it and tell everyone to just 'put up with one another'? I think we've been trying that one for years and been failing miserably. So really, what is the solution or do we just not have one yet?

Originally Posted by Bum Bill Bee

Sigh, I am just all out tired of how much time and attention this one case has taken. And what's worse is it feels like all the hype and attention by the mass media is only empowering racist dicks who would otherwise be impotent pissants. Remember Koran Burning Day? Which was invented by some dumbass preacher who had a congregation of ONLY TWENTY PEOPLE, and then the liberal mass media decides to put this previously unknown man unto our televisions and inadvertantly inspire more dumbasses to be racist dicks.....

Look, I am quite pissed at how Zimmerman just got off the hook like that, but all the same....I wish this kind of shit would be put on trial and get done with quicker, I wish it didn't feel like mass media was inadvertantly glorifiying miserable wastes of skin who didn't deserve the time of day....

Plus, I have a black Wiccan Anarchist friend who says this is all just being hyped up so they can take attention away from more important matters like Snowden and the NSA. (He's the only individual opinion on political stuff that I listen to outside of this place).

Yeah, I can completely agree with you on the media bit. It's all stupid sensationalism and giving the people who don't deserve it the spotlight. My posts were more or less just looking at the two sides of the equation and my rant is more or less my own take on the mass media and the people who allow themselves to be lead by it.

[Marc v4.0]

I disagree. I think a Murderer walking free from his Murder Trial is exactly the sort of thing the Media and the public at large needs to be getting in a big goddamn fury about.

Pretending that this didn't happen by just not covering it does no one any good, and is exactly the sort of dismissive bullshit that lets things like this happen all the time.

The only thing that is really accomplished by 'not giving it attention' is that we all get to go back to pretending a belief in a more comforting non-reality, where things like this can't possibly be happening because then it would be all over the news!*


*except don't put it all over the news because I don't like seeing how fucked up everything is it disturbs my way of life.

[Amake]

Originally Posted by Red Mage Black

Here's the rub: I never did say he did nothing wrong. Nowhere in posts did I explicitly state or even IMPLY it. If you guys found such an implication, that wasn't my intention. The fact everyone here who has responded to my posts so far has misinterpreted them is probably my fault.

Yes, I did that thing you're not supposed to where you don't respond directly to someone's post but to general frustrations built up by listening to completely different people speaking on topics tangentially related to your post; aka being carried away. Sorry about that.

There's a lot of hate going around, both on the internet and real life. Fearing for your life and the life of your own family when such hatred arises probably makes him not want to even appear in public anymore. So the answer to your question? I can say with utmost certainty that he will not.

There's a time honored tradition of journalists finding ways to let people speak without giving vigilantes or even law enforcement any opening to attacking them. If Zimmerman wanted to speak to the media, he could.

Those emotions you feel when a report comes up about an incident like this? That's how they get you. When did people stop thinking for themselves and let the media tell them how to feel?

I'm going to guess this is no more directed at me than my outbursts were at you. But I can tell you I've made a habit of not letting anyone tell me how to think or feel, and particularly not the media, and I don't think I have any more special powers than anyone else, so it stands to reason a lot of people do think for themselves. Maybe people aren't angry at Zimmerman because the media tells us we should be but because he's exactly the unapologetic racist murdering dickfart the more reasonable media (not Fox News) tells us he is?

PS. The Justice Department are now to review the case, apparently after being pressured by the NAACP. Zimmerman is not exactly getting away yet. So that's probably good.

[Red Mage Black]

Originally Posted by Amake

I'm going to guess this is no more directed at me than my outbursts were at you. But I can tell you I've made a habit of not letting anyone tell me how to think or feel, and particularly not the media, and I don't think I have any more special powers than anyone else, so it stands to reason a lot of people do think for themselves. Maybe people aren't angry at Zimmerman because the media tells us we should be but because he's exactly the unapologetic racist murdering dickfart the more reasonable media (not Fox News) tells us he is?

Actually, that was completely unrelated to you. Apologies for not clarifying.

PS. The Justice Department are now to review the case, apparently after being pressured by the NAACP. Zimmerman is not exactly getting away yet. So that's probably good.

I wasn't aware you could pursue the same(or related) charges twice. Isn't that double jeopardy?

EDIT: Just looked this one up. Apparently civil rights charges. Huh.

[Nique]

Originally Posted by RMB

What's particularly hilarious(in a very macabre sort of way), that I found, is that any white on black crime was immediately a racial thing, but not black on white?

To respond to an earlier question, I wasn't implying that you are a bigot.

But I will state outright that when it comes to racial issues that you clearly don't know what you're talking about as demonstrated by your barely-veiled reverse racism arguments. You're also bristling at even hints of criticism towards your uninformed viewpoint.

I don't have the time to deconstruct everything you're saying but I did have a thought on why this case is and should be about race: The Zimmerman trial isn't about race because Zimmerman hates all black people. It is about race because Zimmerman engaged in racial profiling (which may be difficult to prove in a courtroom but is relatively clear based on the 911 call and the entire social atmosphere of America) which ultimately led to the unjust killing of a 17 year old boy whose character was called into question postmortem because of his race.

The question is not 'Is Zimmerman a racist' it's 'Would this case have been handled institutionally the exact same way if the victim were white'? The answer is, of course, 'No'. The verdict sends the message that 'Trayvon may not have deserved to die, but better to kill an innocent black kid than take the risk that they're up to no good!'

EDIT:

On another note: Threatening to riot over a verdict is not a valid form of grieving or getting back at an unjust law system.

Says who?

[Red Mage Black]

Originally Posted by Nique

To respond to an earlier question, I wasn't implying that you are a bigot.

But I will state outright that when it comes to racial issues that you clearly don't know what you're talking about as demonstrated by your barely-veiled reverse racism arguments. You're also bristling at even hints of criticism towards your uninformed viewpoint.

I don't have the time to deconstruct everything you're saying but I did have a thought on why this case is and should be about race: The Zimmerman trial isn't about race because Zimmerman hates all black people. It is about race because Zimmerman engaged in racial profiling (which may be difficult to prove in a courtroom but is relatively clear based on the 911 call and the entire social atmosphere of America) which ultimately led to the unjust killing of a 17 year old boy whose character was called into question postmortem because of his race.

Regardless of race, regardless of what type of murder it is, race or not, both the victim and the murderer will be scrutinized based on past history. Now, I have no doubts his was more closely done due to racist sentiment. I get it.

I also know Zimmerman had a bad history of domestic disputes and alcoholism, which lead him to be fired from a security job. Got it, the guy was a complete asshole.

The question is not 'Is Zimmerman a racist' it's 'Would this case have been handled institutionally the exact same way if the victim were white'? The answer is, of course, 'No'. The verdict sends the message that 'Trayvon may not have deserved to die, but better to kill an innocent black kid than take the risk that they're up to no good!'

I... have no actual response for this one. Just filler since I quoted the other part of the post.

EDIT:


Says who?

Two wrongs don't make a right, were you ever taught that? Violence breeds violence, etc etc, but seriously for a moment, the answer isn't chaos. In a riot, people who aren't involved get hurt and property gets damaged. Racial hate does not need to be answered by chaos. If they were planning a protest, I wouldn't give two shits, but stating intent to riot over a hate crime is insanity.

I'd think it would put more burden on Trayvon's family. "We did this for him!"

[Marc v4.0]

I don't think his family would really care who is rioting for what reason. They lost a child, and his murderer walked free.

Protests are nice, when they work.

When the media ignores every protest, politicians and lawmen do as they please despite the overwhelming forces pushing against them, sometimes gleefully spiteful of the issues at hand and those they harm in the process...well, when protests and diplomacy fail, there is only riot and revolution.

[Loyal]

On another note: Threatening to riot over a verdict is not a valid form of grieving or getting back at an unjust law system.

As far as I can tell the "rioting" has been basically an invention (or overplayed to the point of being an invention) of the media who would just love such a ratings spike.

Anger, demonstrations, and protests are perfectly justified here, and I fully support any instance of it being used as speech, even in cases where I disagree with the message.

If they were planning a protest, I wouldn't give two shits, but stating intent to riot over a hate crime is insanity.

Nobody's threatening to riot over a hate crime. They're threatening to riot over a hate crime once again going unpunished by the justice system even despite having a massive media floodlight over it.

Or! It's just angry people being angry. It's not like everyone or even a majority of the angry people share this sentiment (or we'd be hearing it), and so we shouldn't succumb to sensationalism and act as if it were. There's plenty of reason to riot in the US these days, but, sad to say, if it hasn't happened yet I don't see it happening over this.