The Spy Among Us Mafia

[Sifright]

because hawks death miller claim is the perfect cover for a mafia don to take? it's why i've voted to lynch him. Although killing the standard millers might be a good idea as well.

The problem is we have three people that the PO can't verify, The two standard millers and the death miller that claims when he dies it will show Mafia don. There have been plenty of games where the mafia dons power has been that he identifies as town.

[Professor Smarmiarty]

Why would that be the perfect cover and not the stupidest cover.

[The Artist Formerly Known as Hawk]

Ok, so you all assume I'm the mafia don. So I ask you a simple question then; why in the hell would I bother making any claim at all, especially on the very first day?

Mafia dons generally have the power that, if investigated, they show as town, which is what happens if I'm investigated anyway. If I was the mafia don I would already show up as being town and wouldn't need to claim death miller, thus drawing attention to myself in the first place. I could have just sat back, let you all carry on, probably left you all to lynch Ryander or one of the other millers and avoided attention entirely, then if I got investigated I would show as town.

There would be far too much risk for a mafia don to go and make such a bold claim so early for no reason, drawing everyones attention for no reason when he could just sit back, let himself maybe get investigated and not risk the ire of every other player. For a faction that generally wants to keep its head down and go unnoticed it's literally the worst possible way to play.

The only thing a deathmiller claim would help a mafia do is mask his death, which is not something that really matters all that much, and I should know, having been killed off as mafia several times in other games, generally early on. Why would I care so much about what my death looks like in this game, when it's never mattered in any past game, to the point of drawing everyones attention when I needn't have bothered?

The only reason I would have claimed death miller is because I actually am one, and I claimed because I'm pretty damn certain Ryander is town too since his role is almost identical, between us both we've already got (at least for me) 2 confirmed townies, in a game of 14 players. On day 1. It was my hope that backing up Ryander would get town more confirmed townies, reveal to the town that this game is going to be full of misdirection and confusion (as befits a game about spies) and get peoples attention focused on the now reduced number of possible suspects. Clearly this did not happen.



As for the other millers, I'm also thinking maybe Kareshs miller claim may be genuine too, since it seems he revealed himself to show that there are in fact a lot more millers roles this game than normal, which I already know to be true. I'm still suspicious as all hell of BF though, and not because of his miller claim, more his blatant obfuscating "logic". I get the feeling he's being deliberately obtuse about stuff in order to get votes started. Missing Ns after Mafia, not realising town aligned means "wins when town does" and multiple dons just because a miller shows as one are some of the flimsiest and stupidest reasons to suspect someone ever.

[Professor Smarmiarty]

Pretty much everything Hawk says. The whole deathmiller suspicion is based on fuck all and is stupid.

WHy aren't we lynching the millers who are trying to buy immunity from POs because that is a sketchy claim- deathmiller is not a particularly sketchy claim.

[Professor Smarmiarty]

Also as I sad lynching the deathmiller doesn't achieve us anything- it will show as mafia when he is dead but we don't know what that means and we are in the same place as we were at the start of day 1. If say we're down to a few people and we're still dying and we haven't found any mafia then lynch the deathmiller and see if the killings stop. Lynching them day 1 makes no sense.

[Nikose Tyris]

Reason I'm suspicious of Death Millers: Because Inbred outright told us he'd be lying to us in this game. There's no reason for me not to suspect that he told a Death Miller they're town, when they are in fact mafia.

That's the entire justification here.

[Professor Smarmiarty]

But if the mafia think they town they not going to kill anyone?

Like I'm open to the suggestion that there is no mafia, that the mafia don't know who they are or things and actaully think its pretty likely- the idea that these deathmillers are the mafia seems reasonable- but like we should at least see what halppens during the night before jumping to conclusions.

[Nikose Tyris]

True nuff.

*Points at Sifright* I blindly suspect him as I already stated.

[The Artist Formerly Known as Hawk]

Ok, I can see where you are coming from with regards to the "deathmillers may be mafia/may not know it/may not be any mafia at all" thing, but if you read ICs post, he explicitly says there is a mafia, and that the only lieing is being done by roles with the power to change what he says.

He did not say there may or may not be a mafia, like he did for Cult, SK and 5th Unknown party. He never said he'd be lieing about the roles he'd hand out, only that some roles can manipulate what he says. So I find it very hard to believe that me and Ryander are the mafia, because lieing to us outright in our own role pms would just inherently screw us over from the start and make it near impossible for either of us to win, unless it was completely by accident.

I really doubt IC would do that, because it would severely limit our ability to win if we were really the mafia and didn't know it. And if you're assuming he's lied about our 2 roles, then you have to ask yourselves if he's lied about your own. Maybe he's lied about everyone's role then, and what kind of clusterfuck game would that make? I know that doesn't make any sense for him to do, but it makes as much sense as him lieing to the mafia about what they are so they are immediately handicapped for the entire game.

[Nikose Tyris]

If he lied about all our roles, that would make an infinitely amusing game.