Poor CEOs cannot live on $500,000 a year

[stefan]

Originally Posted by Fifthfiend

Um, you realize they couldn't raise their worker's wages more than the company earns, right?

you . . . you haven't been paying much attention to modern business, have you?

[Kepor]

Originally Posted by Fifthfiend

And what the people being capped have wanted to achieve is to make themselves grossly richer via a legalized ponzi-scheme that has destroyed the national economy.

Well, that would be more of a reflection on the business practices of the companies in general rather than the salaries of their top officers, wouldn't it?

Although it is in rather poor taste, I doubt the recession began because CEO's were flying private jets to ask for bailout funds.

Overall though, the pay caps aren't intended to punish the executives, but insure that government money is spent most efficiently. (Even if a massive bailout plan might not be the best way to stimulate the economy, but hey.)

[Mirai Gen]

The only thing preventing me from posting an image of someone staring blankly in shock is the fact that this is now in Discussion.

So, I won't, and just know I'm thinking it, Stefan.

I mean you can't spend more money than you make else you go into debt, and to be a business you have to grow.

[bluestarultor]

Guys, as much as I hate to say it, we're forgetting about the social aspect of this. Having gone to a private school with frankly a ton of prestige and a grand total of maybe two people who didn't have one or more doctorate degrees, I'm well aware that there actually ARE certain things expected out of people of higher classes. This may sound strange coming from a guy whose household income grosses ~$50,000US, but when you're out in the field, you have to play ball. In high-paying jobs, there are simply certain expectations for one's behavior. For something like a doctor or pharmacist, if you don't belong to a country club, you have severe issues on various levels, including a poor reputation and a lack of connections among your peers. The higher up on the pay scale you go, the more important your image is, because it directly influences the connections you hold both within and outside your profession. And those connections are everything. They can net you clients, services, advertising, and basically anything else that could possibly relate to your success.

In short, it sounds good to people like us, but for the people it would happen to, it could mean the utter collapse of their entire career.

To put this in perspective, an analogy. Imagine your life right now, provided you're in a professional environment. If you're not, imagine your life growing up with your parents. I'd say the loin's share of us come/came from middle- or working-class homes. Maybe your PS3 was a group present from your entire family this past Christmas, but life is generally comfortable. You shop at Wal-Mart and Target and all those other seemingly normal stores. Now imagine you get a pay cut. Suddenly, it's a lot harder to afford Target and you have to go to Goodwill and the Dollar Tree. Eating McDonald's becomes more of a norm, where you had the occasional steak before. Mostly, though, you have to eat at home, and your menu features a lot of frozen stir-fry. Normal school is no longer an option, no, your family has to transfer over to "that place" in the inner city, where the kids stop up the drinking fountains with gum and pee in them and the "hall passes" consist of necklaces with colored beads corresponding to individual rooms so the monitors know exactly where you should be heading either from or to during classes. Where your house was always set at a comfortable 72F/22C, you now have it at 65/18 to save on heating bills and 80/27 to save electricity on air conditioning. You have to skip out on your weekly get-together with friends because you can't afford the gas or movie tickets and word starts getting around that you're slipping out of the loop. And you are. Suddenly, when your peers are talking about the greatest new thing to come along, you realize you haven't heard anything about it and try to keep quiet and slink away without being noticed, or maybe stay just within earshot to absorb as much of it as you can in case someone asks you about it so you don't look like a total idiot. And when you do get caught off-guard, they're rather patronizing about it, because they've heard all about your situation and it's only to be expected. But the worst part is the pile of bills on your desk at home, looming over you like a tower of bleached bone. You sell your PS3 for the extra cash you need, trade down your car, and try to postpone the inevitable, losing your home. Sure you can trade that down, too, but the idea of living in a place that could double as a closet if it were bigger isn't appealing. You even go so far as to stop donating to the collections at church for that little bit extra that might add up. Unfortunately, you're kidding yourself. You sell your home and move into a place too tiny to even hold what remains of your stuff. You try to store it at first, but that costs more money. Eventually, you can't afford it anymore and end up selling it. You really liked some of that stuff. Eventually, you adapt. But you know what you had. You had it good before. Maybe if you'd been able to find a job elsewhere nearby, you could have kept it all, but there were just so many people in the same position and you weren't one of the lucky ones. You start looking in broader and broader circles, anyway. Even if you have to leave town, maybe you might find something that pays what you used to get if you keep looking. Maybe you don't find it, but maybe you're lucky and snap up a position not unlike what yours used to be. Sure, you might eventually get back to where you were. It was just stuff, after all. You move across state lines into a hole not unlike what you just left, but you're saving to work back up. It doesn't make you feel any better. More like just dragging yourself from the ground after having been kicked in the balls. Your pride is hurt. And you know that some poor shmuck is going to need to fill your old position. Maybe he'll be happy with it as a trade-up. Maybe he's like you and it's the next best thing...




So, yeah. There's my point. A bit more poignant now, I believe. I'm not saying I wouldn't LOVE to make that much money a year, but I wouldn't be taking a pay cut in the least by doing so. This kind of thing can absolutely ruin a reputation. Yeah, it can be recovered, but the hit can never truly be erased.

[Mirai Gen]

In short, it sounds good to people like us, but for the people it would happen to, it could mean the utter collapse of their entire career.

As opposed to the collapse of everyone's entire economy and massive job loss? Yeah boo friggin' hoo, I'm really sorry that they might have a rough time in their career as opposed to two working parents who lose their jobs.

[The Wizard Who Did It]

Originally Posted by bluestarultor

Guys, as much as I hate to say it, we're forgetting about the social aspect of this. Having gone to a private school with frankly a ton of prestige and a grand total of maybe two people who didn't have one or more doctorate degrees, I'm well aware that there actually ARE certain things expected out of people of higher classes. This may sound strange coming from a guy whose household income grosses ~$50,000US, but when you're out in the field, you have to play ball. In high-paying jobs, there are simply certain expectations for one's behavior. For something like a doctor or pharmacist, if you don't belong to a country club, you have severe issues on various levels, including a poor reputation and a lack of connections among your peers. The higher up on the pay scale you go, the more important your image is, because it directly influences the connections you hold both within and outside your profession. And those connections are everything. They can net you clients, services, advertising, and basically anything else that could possibly relate to your success.

As a person who has a mother who grew up on a farm and went to public school and became a very well respected doctor at the local clinic, this is more or less BULLSHIT! What you're talking about is people who were born with the money to get into their profession (went into a country club to get clients and connections) rather than working hard and doing their job well enough to get prestige in their profession. You're talking as if this would end people in certain professions, but in actuality it would only end people who wouldn't have earned being in those professions without that money.

In short, people who do well at their job don't need social clubs to get respect and clients.

Also, your VERY long and blocked analogy (paragraphs would have helped, please, you can just use more lines to single it out) really doesn't seem as applicable to people taking a drop to $500k.

[Jagos]

Seriously I'm not seeing the issue here.

Main issue is investments. Granted, the last few years with subprime results has more to do with some extension of greed. But the fact that there won't necessarily BE anyone to fund new businesses as the money just may not be there is what concerns me.

[Fifthfiend]

Originally Posted by Kepor

Well, that would be more of a reflection on the business practices of the companies in general rather than the salaries of their top officers, wouldn't it?

So there's no connection between the business practices of the companies and the decisions of their top officers? That's what we're going with?

[MasterOfMagic]

I...you...Okay. Here:

“a woman can spend $10,000 or $15,000 on a dress. If she goes to three or four of those a year, she’s not going to wear the same dress.”

A personal trainer at $80 an hour three times a week comes to about $12,000 a year.

A summer house in Southampton that cost $4 million, again not the top of the market, carries annual mortgage payments of $240,000.

We're talking about losing these kinds of things. You cannot tell me these are necessary for them to keep their jobs and connections. I understand they will miss having these awesome things, but when other people are struggling just to pay for FOOD and a ROOF, directly because of their mistakes, they can deal with it.

[Aerozord]

well I find it stupid that they live beyond their means, but honestly, who doesn't? Our society is based on rampant consumerism. No matter how much you have you want more. People want to live in the manner in which they are accustomed. Take most of the people that post on this forum. Many say as middle-class they are suffering and lack money. Yet these same people are paying for internet, computer, ect.

Thats not to say its a bad idea. However this will quickly be rendered useless when they realize that to get around it they just need to make their bonus come in the form of non-liquid assets.

Besides personally I think politicians are far worse. Atleast CEOs work more then 20 days a year. I mean why does the president need several hundred thousand a year, not only was he rich before hand (like all the previous ones) but he doesn't pay for housing, utilities, security, transportation, heck I'm pretty sure he doesn't even buy his own food.