Oh shit, a Steam Autumn Sale, NOT ENOUGH MONEY

[Kim]

I'm gonna keep saying this, but get Analogue. It's amazingly well-written. The experience of learning about another culture via spaceship logs, the sexism of that culture being commented on by a character in the story, the background music... It's all just great. Plus, it's by a queer developer, and I'm gonna be honest and say I think queer developers are very much worth supporting when possible, because there need to be more of them in the industry. Just check the game out. It's great.

[Solid Snake]

Originally Posted by Kim

I'm gonna keep saying this, but get Analogue. It's amazingly well-written. The experience of learning about another culture via spaceship logs, the sexism of that culture being commented on by a character in the story, the background music... It's all just great. Plus, it's by a queer developer, and I'm gonna be honest and say I think queer developers are very much worth supporting when possible, because there need to be more of them in the industry. Just check the game out. It's great.

There are progressive Visual Novels on Steam?
...Done and done.
Should I get Visual too?

[Ramary]

Fuck you Kim, now have to make a visual novel tab for my steam list. IT WAS PERFECT TILL YOU REMINDED ME THAT ANALOGUE WAS STILL AROUND.

Now if you excuse me I need to work 5 grueling seconds to fix my games list.

[Solid Snake]

...Shit I want to buy this universe simulator thing.
Is it worth it?
NOTE: You only have an hour to respond get to it

[Flarecobra]

It's fun to derp around in. Like once I managed to transfer the Solar System from the Milky Way to the Large Magellenic Cloud.

[Solid Snake]

Since it's now a Flash Deal and because I'm desperate to actually play a multiplayer session of this game with folks I know, I'll strongly recommend Crusader Kings II, an addictive strategy game that's akin to Total War except you control a ruling dynastic family instead of a nation, and you're able to more intimately influence politics, religion, the economy and military matters.

If you like games like Total War or if you've played Paradox titles before, CKII is a very similar medieval strategy simulator with a beautiful aesthetic design, a challenging degree of difficulty and an interface that's simultaneously easy to learn but complex and difficult to master.

There are a few social-justice related concerns with the game that merit mentioning:

* In the interests of 'historical authenticity,' characters with the 'homosexual' trait receive a fairly significant penalty to their Diplomacy and Fertility stats, which in turn leads to gameplay benefits being derived from murdering or de-legitimizing gay heirs (because your heterosexual heirs with otherwise equal stats are statistically predisposed to have happier reigns and more children.)

Fortunately, you can choose to ignore this incentive and rule your Kingdom as a 21st Century progressive monarchy, and your gay ruler can become legendary (and sleep with hordes of lovers) if you play well.

Furthermore, you can choose to Mod the penalty out of existence, but those modded values won't carry over into online multiplayer games.

* In the interests of 'historical authenticity,' most women are relegated to supporting roles -- though it is technically possible to procure and play as a female heir, doing so is very difficult unless you're murdering all your sons, grandsons and brothers to ensure your eldest daughter (or sister) takes control. And, female rulers, like homosexuals, suffer a penalty to their Diplomacy stat. If your ruler is a lesbian, you get both penalties, and it becomes very difficult to stay in power unless she has offsetting traits like 'Genius' or 'Kind.'


These have been relatively minor matters in my own playthroughs because, if you're progressive enough as a player, you can just choose to ignore play through the structural limitations. In fact, it's fun to play CKII with gay and female Kings and Queens in an overt attempt to piss on 'historical authenticity.'

And when it comes to matters of race, CKII does the best job of any historical strategy game I've played of including unique Muslim, Mongol and African factions. The Muslim kingdoms and empires in particular don't feel like afterthoughts, and playing as them is lots of fun.

[Arcanum]

So gameplay mechanics that portray the bias and prejudice of that time period are a concern? Those same mechanics that you can ignore or even embrace and that only limit you if you're trying to do a min-maxed playthrough? Are there honestly people out there that think a game striving for social and political realism situated in the 11th century should not portray the biases of that time and instead be unrealistically progressive?

[Bells]

I'm pretty sure that by that definition Civilization is also "socially unjust"

[Solid Snake]

Originally Posted by Arcanum

So gameplay mechanics that portray the bias and prejudice of that time period are a concern? Those same mechanics that you can ignore or even embrace and that only limit you if you're trying to do a min-maxed playthrough? Are there honestly people out there that think a game striving for social and political realism situated in the 11th century should not portray the biases of that time and instead be unrealistically progressive?

It's kind of disconcerting that the penalty for merely being a homosexual ruler in CKII is actually in most respects more severe than the penalties actual homosexual rulers were likely to face at the time, yes.

Like if we're talking 'true historical accuracy' here, you could be a homosexual ruler and face relatively little consequence unless you flaunted a so-called 'decadent' lifestyle in the face of the church. Most gay rulers, given the power they had access to, were perfectly able to dabble with lovers 'on the side' without facing any significant consequence. In that sense they had far greater latitude than the peasantry.

The real problem with this mechanic in CKII from a 'historical authenticity' perspective is that the mere act of being born homosexual automatically leads to the penalty. There's no conscious decision-making involved where, say, I could accept the penalty for my character if I chose to flaunt a gay relationship publicly in front of religious figures. And the penalty is grossly exaggerated in effect -- if you're ruling a major Kingdom or Empire with lots of vassals, the mere fact that the King is gay and visiting male lovers in secret will result in mass uprisings, even if all his other stats are generally positive. Vassals are prickly in this game.

But the warning is really intended for people who might, say, emotionally react to the notion that their gay character might be murdered (by an opposing vassal with the 'Zealous' trait, for example) merely for being gay. I'm sure regardless of any interest in 'historical authenticity' it's possible for those who've suffered under oppression to find a game insufferable if it seems hellbent on reminding them how terrible being gay or female was in prior centuries under the patriarchy.

Personally, I wouldn't mind the 'historical accuracy' stuff if there was an option to toggle them off. Given that the entire point of the game is that you can take history in crazy directions by -- say -- re-establishing the Roman Empire, dethroning the Pope and establishing heresy as a dominant religion, or conquering Europe as a Muslim nation, the idea that you could play an a-historical game in which homosexuality was legalized or women were treated as equals in one's kingdom seems relevant and permissible.

[Kim]

Originally Posted by Arcanum

So gameplay mechanics that portray the bias and prejudice of that time period are a concern? Those same mechanics that you can ignore or even embrace and that only limit you if you're trying to do a min-maxed playthrough? Are there honestly people out there that think a game striving for social and political realism situated in the 11th century should not portray the biases of that time and instead be unrealistically progressive?

If things like sexual orientation are to be inflicted arbitrarily upon the player as a punishment and nothing more, then it would be better for the game to not touch on them at all. It doesn't explore them enough to do the themes justice. Being gay becomes a negative thing.

It's possible to include homosexuality and mistreatment of gay people and be a progressive game. Analogue: A Hate Story actually does that. It also does the same thing for sexism. This works because there are in-game elements that show the bigotry itself as being a bad thing.

No such commentary exists within Crusader Kings II, as far as I know. As a result, the game gains nothing by making homophobia a part of the experience. Because it gains nothing by doing this, it should not have done so.