Pokemon Umbral Theatre 4: Dedicated to Cosplaying Pokemon Trainers Part 2

[Menarker]

Not to offend you in any way, but I haven't been listening to the BGM because I'm severely hard of hearing and thus it's never in my mindset to look for songs. Maybe the others listen to them, and if they like it, I think that's great. I myself though don't tend to listen to music all that much.

Although I should probably archive binge the RP threads and check the songs out soon.

Drac: Yes, AB has been linking BGM during every significant change to battle, such as entering battle, new boss mode or things like that. Starting around Mission 2 if I'm right.

[Dracorion]

Yes, I know there's BGM.

I was making a point.

[Geminex]

1) Crits are too easy to reach for fast pokemons.

...
What?
Our goal here is to make speed central to crit. It is the entire motherfucking point of this discussion. And besides, "way too easy"? 25% for one with better speed, 33% for one with really high speed. How is that "way too easy"? Considering that those points you have in speed could have probably been raised your attack and special attack by 50% each, if they had been reallocated? Or doubled your HP?
My goal here is to modify speed so that, assuming an absolutely average, all-rounder pokemon that's equally feasible in every role, there is a real choice where to allocate a free stat point. That was given in the old system, where speed actually mattered. It's not given now. It certainly wouldn't be given if we modified it so that hold items and, for gods sake, DIRE HIT are more important in achieving crit than actual speed.

2) Crit pokemons who are SUPPOSED to be GOOD at critting are inferior to fast pokemons.

Right now, there are tons of pokemon who are SUPPOSED to be BENEFITING from having a speed stat. They are inferior to pokemon who don't really have much of a speed stat at all because the 100 points that sweepers have in speed suddenly don't really exist. Of course, solving the speed problem in my way would create another problem. But, thing is, it would be less of a problem. We could solve it more easily. Whereas your solution wouldn't really solve the original problem to begin with.
Particularly cause I think your claim that there are "crit pokemon" is bullshit. Some pokemon are better at using crit than others. But there's not a single pokemon whose sole feasible strategy is crit, or to which crit even matters very hugely. There is no pokemon who is SUPPOSED to be a crit-master. Crit is a viable strategy, sure. But there are tons of viable strategies for different pokemon.

3) Crits are too common and too easy to get IN GENERAL. Keep in mind Crits bypasses opposing buffs and ignore negative debuffs on your character and doubles your damage. (Making quad effective moves doing 8x damage instead of 4x.)

Once again. Speed is a stat. Stats have a major influence on combat. This is really like saying that attack shouldn't affect damage too much because otherwise people would be dealing too much damage.
Putting points into speed is a major investment, because you could have put those points into something else as well. This investment has to be worth it, if we want speed to be as important a stat as all the others. Making it powerful is seriously the only way to do this.
Not to mention that, y'know, if you want to deal double damage all you have to do is use swords dance. Or have a medic use x-attack/sp. attack on you. That'd give you the same average damage boost as a 50% chance to crit.

4) Speed pokemons who don't even TRY to be crit users end up having chances of critting equal to the crit users who TRY to be crit users. (25% or 33% chance of critting without held item or crit move).

Like I said above. Pokemon that relied more on crit before may now have fewer strategies available to them. But there's lot's of ways to fix that.
And on the other hand, pokemon who relied on speed before now actually find that their main stat DOES SOMETHING FOR THEM. And the pokemon who have a speed stat (everyone except for Mollesk) far outweigh the pokemon who heavily focused on crit (like, three, or something. Seriously, I really can't think of many).

5) Speed pokemons already gain more benefit with speed helping destroyers and snipers.

I'd actually recommend that this doesn't happen.

Crit is already its own mechanic with moves, items and abilities that influence it.

THEN YOU SHOULD NOT HAVE SUGGESTED THAT SPEED INFLUENCE CRIT, FOR THE LOVE OF GOD. THIS WAS YOUR MOTHERFUCKING IDEA. AND I SAID IT BEFORE, IF YOU DON'T WANT SPEED TO INFLUENCE CRIT, THINK OF SOMETHING ELSE. BUT DON'T TRY TO COMPROMISE BY SAYING "Ok, but just a little." THIS IS A STAT. IT SHOULD BE THE STRONGEST INFLUENCE AROUND.

this is clearly one of those "overly powerful changes to the RP's system"

No. Wanna know what was an overly powerful change? The removal of the speed stat. We're trying to fix that here. And sure, my solution isn't perfect. But the problems it creates are minuscule compared to the problems that the non-existence of speed creates.

where we're enabling more than 50% chance of double damage to anyone who is super fast, especially if they are the type with low defense and high offense and thus doubling that high offense is sure to be near gamebreaking.

Ok. Assume they're super-fast, so that they can get the +3 bonus against most pokemon. I think average speed is like, 75 or something, so let's assume that the majority of pokemon have less than 90 speed. To regularly get +3 against these guys, our pokemon in question would have to have 180 speed. 180. That's fully one third of a pokemon's stat points (assuming this is a fairly strong non-legendary, with 540 total base points).
And that's just for a 33% chance, to get the 50 or 66% that'd actually make this worth it, they still need two of the following: Buff move, buff item, hold item, ability, crit-enhanced attack. That's one hell of an investment, and what do they get? 66% chance to deal double damage? That's barely fair. And seriously, do you see someone with 180 speed getting anything other than mediocre attack? I didn't think so. Because if you put another 100, 120 points into attack, you're suddenly left with just 240 points for the other 4 stats. Even if you min-max and turn sp. attack into a dump stat (with 30, because anything below that is just shameless game-breaking I'MLOOKINGATYOUMOLLESK), that'd still leave you with just 70 in HP, defense and special defense. Not horrible, but not very good either. Certainly not the murderous striker you're making it out to be, and certainly not likely to survive for very long. And I think you'll find that this is the case with most speed-heavy builds. Speed will be barely equal to the other stats. Not overpowered. It'll influence battle, sure, and defensive buff moves will become less valuable. But hey, speed buff moves, which were utterly useless before, will suddenly become viable, not just offensively, but defensively as well! It all balances out, and, like I said. Speed is balanced this way. It'll influence combat, but it won't break it, won't change its face forever.

And what if I was to tell you that my pokebrid form might very well be one of those crit users or one of those heavy speed types? If the thought of improving crit to the point where my character with high offensive power can suddenly do double damage 50% or 66% of the time makes you shudder and think my build should be scrapped, then the entire crit system obviously needs working.

Then I would congratulate you. Because having high speed obviously needs to be rewarded somehow, and if we're using crit, then it's only fair for you to get high crit with high speed. If you make crit your strategy, and invest in it enough, then it's only fair for you to benefit from it. Because the points in speed would have helped you hugely if they had been in another stat instead. But now they're in speed, so they should help you hugely there as well.

Mind you, I don't know what exactly your build is gonna be. But if you focus on speed, I'm fully aware that critting becomes very likely for you. And I think that's only fair. I'm aware of the implications of my suggestions, you know. I just think that, considering the factor in question here (once again, A STAT), and its importance, the implications are justified in being equally huge.

I've made my point I think: Speed is a stat, it is justified in affecting combat hugely, it should be the main factor affecting crit, if it affects crit at all, crit pokemon can be compensated otherwise.

Though let me just add fuck you for making we write all of that again. I wrote it before, and with a bit of work you could have gotten my point by reading my previous posts.

Also, using "Dire Hit" isn't effort, we have a medic who can't use rage rockets, but can use stats buff items. Shit is going to be flying left and right.

[Dracorion]

PS. AB, I don't mean that the BGM is bad or that it doesn't matter.

I'm just lazy and won't bother to listen to it. But the times I do, it does add a little something when I'm picturing the battle.

[Menarker]

Alright.

I still think it's easy enough to add a razor fang to pump things up a bit, but I'll bite, seeing some of the newer comments that I did not see in your past ones.

At the very least, to be prudent, we should probably have a trial period on the crit system.

Rules:
1) All attackers start at stage 1.
2) The percentages incrementally starting at 1 is 6.25%, 12.5%, 25%, 33%, 50%, 66%.
3) If the Attacker wins the Speed Clash, add +2 to crit stage.
4) If the Attacker wins the Speed Clash with double the speed of the defender, the bonus is +3 instead.
5) If the Attacker uses an Improved Critical move, add +2 to crit stage.
6) All other boosts to Crit stage adds +1.


Would this be an appropriate setup for the time being?

[Bard The 5th LW]

Just dropping in to say that Drac's NPC is fucking creepy and he is fucking creepy for making it.

[Dracorion]

Eh, what else is new?

[Menarker]

Bard, aren't you going to make your upgrades sometime soon?

[Astral Harmony]

No offense taken. The BGM probably helps me most of all. Kickass BGM is great for inspiring shit.

Oh, I know! Totally gotta give Elizabeth the personality of Quagmire.

Elizabeth: "Hey, Charlotte. What Pokemon do you like?"
Charlotte: "Dogs, mostly."
Elizabeth: "Ever have one of them give you a rimjob before?"
Charlotte: "What's a rimjob?"
Elizabeth: "Well, why don't you and me go up to my room and bring that Houndoom with you?"
Charlotte: "Yeah, I think I'd rather go over to Renny, and I never thought I'd say that in my life."
Elizabeth: "I like where this is going. Giggity, giggity, gigg-i-ty."
Charlotte: "Seriously, I'm two seconds from blasting you in the face."
Elizabeth: "I love being blasted in the face! Wow, so you're a futanari? I love those!"
Charlotte: "With my shotgun."
Elizabeth: "...Is that an innu-"
Charlotte: "GET THE FUCK AWAY FROM ME!!"

And now my soul is a little darker inside.

[Dracorion]

Liz's text color is #FF3366, by the way.

None of the standard ones really fit her.

Also, she's smarter than to approach Charlotte while she's carrying a shotgun.

Anyway, no one's got anything to say about my proposed Snagged pokemon happiness system?

Christ.